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Post by rnrk supports BLM on Sept 8, 2010 3:27:00 GMT -5
As terrible as the situation with Davey Boy's sister was... from a booking perspective, having Michaels win was the right call, IMO.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Sept 8, 2010 5:15:01 GMT -5
How was it? The event he won it was wasn't shown live in the states so it didn't get Shawn over in the market he was being pushed as a face in, the European title was a third tier belt held by the third best Hart family member currently in the WWF who'd never actually gotten a win over the established main eventer Shawn in their past encounters so didn't elevate him in any way whatsoever and he damaged the belt's already limited credibility by losing it shortly after in the manner in which he did... Wow, a fingerpoke match, those sure do send the fans home happy.
It was one of those events where no-one benefited, it pissed off the audience the show was created to appeal to, who they were marketing the Hart Foundation to as a face group, on one of the first PPV's created especially for the UK market at a time when nearly all WWF events were shown for free. The WWF were desperate for revenue at the time so the last thing they needed to do is alienate yet more fans. It needlessly created greater friction backstage and made Bulldog look bad in front of his family, fans and friends back home, which I guess was the point. Losing the match wouldn't have harmed Shawn in any way whatsoever or it would never have been booked to happen to begin with and would have sent the crowd home happy, but stroking Shawn's ego and giving his sidekick a belt was more important.
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Post by rnrk supports BLM on Sept 8, 2010 5:27:57 GMT -5
The show ended with an infuriated Bret Hart and the Hart Foundation in the ring while Michaels taunted him from the aisle, with an incensed crowd ready to lynch Shawn.
Coming up less than two months later is the big Bret vs. Shawn showdown. You think the pro-Hart fans weren't salivating even more for the chance to see HBK potentially get his commupance? Or that Michaels taking out the 3rd biggest member of the Hart Foundation didn't build up him going after their leader?
Bulldog was playing the same role he'd often been used in as a singles wrestler: the guy credible enough that he loses to build up his opponent into an even bigger match against another big draw. Hell, did the job five years earlier to build up the first Bret/Shawn feud.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Sept 8, 2010 6:03:43 GMT -5
The show ended with an infuriated Bret Hart and the Hart Foundation in the ring while Michaels taunted him from the aisle, with an incensed crowd ready to lynch Shawn. Coming up less than two months later is the big Bret vs. Shawn showdown. You think the pro-Hart fans weren't salivating even more for the chance to see HBK potentially get his commupance? Or that Michaels taking out the 3rd biggest member of the Hart Foundation didn't build up him going after their leader? Bulldog was playing the same role he'd often been used in as a singles wrestler: the guy credible enough that he loses to build up his opponent into an even bigger match against another big draw. Hell, did the job five years earlier to build up the first Bret/Shawn feud. I don't feel it did anything for anyone, no, other than alienate the UK audience at a time they were experimenting with producing exclusive PPV events there to try and claw their way back to profitability and make Bulldog look like more of a joke, what's the point of a faction if only one guy in them is allowed to look good? Michaels had plenty of heat, the Hart rivalry had been going on and off for most of the decade so this really didn't do much to build up that match. I don't believe for one second that more people bought survivor series 1997 because Michaels won the European belt in a PPV that wasn't shown in the states, or that ratings increased due to Michaels now wearing a third tier belt he'd defend once against a lower midcarder (Flash Funk) before giving it to his buddy. None of the people baying for Shawn's blood in the UK could have translated to money for the WWF because (If I recall correctly) the majority of WWF events were shown on Sky Sports rather than PPV so what was the point?
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Post by Junkenstein on Sept 8, 2010 7:41:49 GMT -5
The show ended with an infuriated Bret Hart and the Hart Foundation in the ring while Michaels taunted him from the aisle, with an incensed crowd ready to lynch Shawn. Coming up less than two months later is the big Bret vs. Shawn showdown. You think the pro-Hart fans weren't salivating even more for the chance to see HBK potentially get his commupance? Or that Michaels taking out the 3rd biggest member of the Hart Foundation didn't build up him going after their leader? Bulldog was playing the same role he'd often been used in as a singles wrestler: the guy credible enough that he loses to build up his opponent into an even bigger match against another big draw. Hell, did the job five years earlier to build up the first Bret/Shawn feud. I don't feel it did anything for anyone, no, other than alienate the UK audience at a time they were experimenting with producing exclusive PPV events there to try and claw their way back to profitability and make Bulldog look like more of a joke, what's the point of a faction if only one guy in them is allowed to look good? Michaels had plenty of heat, the Hart rivalry had been going on and off for most of the decade so this really didn't do much to build up that match. I don't believe for one second that more people bought survivor series 1997 because Michaels won the European belt in a PPV that wasn't shown in the states, or that ratings increased due to Michaels now wearing a third tier belt he'd defend once against a lower midcarder (Flash Funk) before giving it to his buddy. None of the people baying for Shawn's blood in the UK could have translated to money for the WWF because (If I recall correctly) the majority of WWF events were shown on Sky Sports rather than PPV so what was the point? This. There was no positive to having Bulldog lose in front of an English crowd at that event. Were it for the WWF title, then I could understand HBK going over, but for the European belt that Shawn proceeded in doing absolutely nothing with? It was dumb and they were only ever gonna alienate the UK audience with a stunt like that. And frankly WWF needed all the support from Europe they could get, let's not forget that WWF was still more popular in Europe than WCW. I think the whole incident is the perfect example of HBK being deliberately and playing backstage politics to the point of hurting the company.
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lovingway
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Post by lovingway on Sept 8, 2010 7:55:04 GMT -5
Along those lines, did Savage ever get a clean win over Hogan? Nope
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DavidArquette
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Post by DavidArquette on Sept 8, 2010 8:21:00 GMT -5
I never understood why Michaels was allowed to go over. ONO really was Bulldog's event, an event that had no major effect on storylines and was a UK exclusive. What's worse is Bulldog got completely destroyed in front of his family.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Sept 8, 2010 12:02:37 GMT -5
Here's the thing, once you mention his DYING SISTER there's only one way to go frankly.
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Post by Bo Rida on Sept 8, 2010 12:42:10 GMT -5
I hated when Davey got knocked out of the ring by shawn at the 95 Rumble.It was unfair and the match should have been restarted just with those two guys fighting it out at the end.Daveys theme was playing which didnt help.I actually felt disgusted when Shawn went over Davey in England,as a kid i was genuinley upset by it.Ill always be a Bulldog mark more then a Michaels one though so perhaps im a bit biased. That pretty much sums up my feelings, it took a long time for me to warm to HBK after this feud.
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Post by dirtyoldman on Sept 8, 2010 13:34:00 GMT -5
I'm surprised nobody jumped the railings at ONO and twated michaels in the face.
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nisidhe
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Post by nisidhe on Sept 8, 2010 17:01:37 GMT -5
I suspect that Vince was giving Michaels at the time enough rope with which to hang himself. This was one of a number of incidents that, in the end, did little to boost Michaels's image and simply hurt his career ever after. Vince was not going to trust Michaels again with a major push, and perhaps did not need to do so once the dust from Montreal had settled. Sure, DX was at times highly entertaining, but after Austin and the Rock rose to the top of the card, Michaels sort of became the standby main eventer and became largely irrelevant until the buildup to Ric Flair's retirement.
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Post by Brother Ike: Thread Killer on Sept 8, 2010 19:26:58 GMT -5
Jim Cornette told a hilarious story from this feud at the Fanfest. I probably won't get it 100%, but it was something like this: He was filming one of the studio segments with someone, and they were expecting a call, so they had this bright red phone sitting out where everyone would have to notice it. To Jim's surprise, it actually rings. The other guy answers, and tells Jim it's Stu Hart, and that he wants to talk to him. Jim thinks, "Oh, sure it is," and takes the phone. "Ehhh...Ehh...This, this thing with Diana, it...it kinda makes her look like a f***in' whore!" Jim remembers that Bruce Pritchard does a great Stu Hart imitation, so he figures it's Bruce. Jim says something back, I think still basically playing into the angle. "Ehh...Yeah...Yeah...but, it kinda makes her look like a f***in' whore!" Jim says, "Well, Stu, I agree with you, and I'm betting it's that Bruce Pritchard behind it. Everybody knows he's a pervert, this is the kind of thing he would think is funny. If I were you, I'd have to say something to him about it!" Stu seems to pretty much agree and hangs up. Almost as soon as he does, Bruce Pritchard walks onto the set. Jim heads the direction Bruce just came from, but there's no phones. Then he spots Owen and Davey laughing. Apparently, Owen had actually gotten Stu to call and raise hell about his daughter looking like a "f***in' whore!" I was about to post the exact same thing, I recorded that part of the interview and I plan on posting it to youtube once I do my fanfest report (waiting on digital copies) but on the subject, yeah those two worked really well together. Although I'm in the minority on this, but I think the finish to the European title was the right call as the heat afterwords was off the charts.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Sept 9, 2010 2:24:50 GMT -5
I suspect that Vince was giving Michaels at the time enough rope with which to hang himself. This was one of a number of incidents that, in the end, did little to boost Michaels's image and simply hurt his career ever after. Vince was not going to trust Michaels again with a major push, and perhaps did not need to do so once the dust from Montreal had settled. Sure, DX was at times highly entertaining, but after Austin and the Rock rose to the top of the card, Michaels sort of became the standby main eventer and became largely irrelevant until the buildup to Ric Flair's retirement. What? HBK was at the top of the card till a back injury put him out for 4 years, and he came stright back into the man event.
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Post by Trent Valentine on Sept 9, 2010 10:19:12 GMT -5
Im gonna have to agree with Dysco Inferno. Michaels winning the Euro Title did nothing for him. Bulldog wanted to dedicate his victory to his sister, but it didn't happen like that. If anything, they weren't just booing HBK for winning the European Title, but booing him because once again he got his way by playing politics. After he won the European Title, he rarely defended it. His last major defense was practically handing it to his sidekick HHH on a silver platter. Many view HBK beating Davey for the European Title at One Night Only as a way to add more heat to DX and its feud with Bret. But I believe this was just another way for HBK to f*** with The Harts, showing he had all the stroke.
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nisidhe
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Post by nisidhe on Sept 9, 2010 20:49:02 GMT -5
What? HBK was at the top of the card till a back injury put him out for 4 years, and he came stright back into the man event. By which point he was not really needed, and there were no efforts to move him into the main event as anything other than a tease at a spoiler. Michaels's best years were well behind him by the time he returned, and his closest rivals size- and skill-wise were habitually destroying each other in spotfests, then taking only a few months off to recover from worse than it took him four years. Had Michaels been more reliable as a worker during his tenure with WWE, and less of the egomaniac he appeared to demonstrate throughout 1996 and 1997, his main event spot might have been more secure. As it turned out, he ended up making himself expendable to WWE, surplus to requirements at the very least, and unemployable to almost any other promotion.
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Post by sniper47 on Sept 11, 2010 20:48:27 GMT -5
To correct someone who commented - Bret Hart lost in Canada many times in his career. He refused ONE TIME and we all know what happened.
Back to the main issue, I don't think Bulldog ever got a victory over Michaels. Bulldog didn't lose in UK because he booked to win all the time (The European market). Being from the UK I'm a Bulldog fan myself.
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Post by agent817 on Sept 12, 2010 12:25:24 GMT -5
I've never actually watched the One Night Only match in its entirety, but I do remember seeing clipped footage of it on the DX VHS and man, was it bad. I just looked up the ending to the match right now on YouTube and Shawn bragging about how he became the first ever Grand Slam champion. I've heard my share of horror stories about Shawn's politics and ego, especially in 1997. I even noticed how people were throwing stuff into the ring area. Is that the only time a title change has occurred in a UK PPV?
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Post by Trent Valentine on Sept 12, 2010 13:39:36 GMT -5
I've never actually watched the One Night Only match in its entirety, but I do remember seeing clipped footage of it on the DX VHS and man, was it bad. I just looked up the ending to the match right now on YouTube and Shawn bragging about how he became the first ever Grand Slam champion. I've heard my share of horror stories about Shawn's politics and ego, especially in 1997. I even noticed how people were throwing stuff into the ring area. Is that the only time a title change has occurred in a UK PPV? I believe during an Insurrection/Rebellion PPV in 2000, Crash Holly upset William Regal by beating him for the European Title. But Regal got a rematch the next night by mauling Crash and reclaiming his belt.
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Post by Todd Pettengill on Sept 12, 2010 21:46:41 GMT -5
bulldog / bret ic belt
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Post by Trent Valentine on Sept 12, 2010 23:30:35 GMT -5
^ I can't believe I forgot that one.
Anyway, HBK winning the belt didn't do anything for him. If anything the WWF were supposed to send the fans home happy, but all Vince did was feed Shawn's ego by getting the best of Davey Boy, humiliating him in front of his friends and family in his home country. More importantly, Shawn didn't even defend his new European Title. All it was was a trophy to him. It made you wonder why he won it in the first place. Bulldog reportedly didn't like it, but was told he'd have the homefield advantage in the next UK PPV Months later in the rematch at Capital Carnage. But would Shawn have dropped the belt to him? who knows.
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