NFL Thread XXXII: No Luck For Carolina

[Maidpool w/ Cleaning Action]

Jan 8, 2011 2:38:35 GMT -5 Orange said:

Denver looking at John Fox, I wouldn't mind it at all. I think he got dealt a bad hand in Carolina, what do Carolina fans think he'd be like here, having seen him coach every week?

He is a good coach, he just plays it VERY conservatively and a lot of people don't like that.

Unlike what Seth said, he was dealt a god awful hand this year. He had no QB, a beat up O-Line, a WR corp that had nothing but late-round rookies after Steve Smith, massive amounts of injuries to an already inexperienced team and knew he was on the way out of the door.

He took a team that was 1-15 when he got it and two year later had us in the Superbowl. He had two division championships (And in the NFC South that's good as this is a very rotating division every year), an NFC Championship, a Super Bowl appearance, Two NFC Championship game apperences and three playoff appearances in the nine years he was here. All from that 1-15 team he took over.

He finished his time here with a 73-71 record, but if you take away this year where his hands were 100%, absolutely tied behind his back he was 71-57. The worst record he had in any season until this year was 7-9 and I believe he was one of only like three or four coaches that could say that in the same time period.

He always had his players ready to play, and never threw players under the bus. He was a class act. And anyone saying he isn't a leader obviously doesn't know about the stories of him whipping that lazy 1-15 team into shape. Or hear the interviews with his players. Or see how much effort he had his players giving even at the end of this season (see: The Punter running like 40+ yards to shoe string tackle a guy from getting a TD when the game was already over).

Anyone saying he wasn't a good coach is quite frankly just disillusioned by how this year went down, and the fact that last year we didn't make the playoffs.

That said, he does have flaws like everyone. His biggest flaw is inconsistency. There are times you should have gotten to the playoffs and instead went 7-9 and there were times when we should have sucked and went to the NFC Championship. There will be a lot of ups and downs with John Fox, but the thing you can bet on is that you won't be a perennial loser so many teams.

Another example of the inconsistency is that he never had two losing seasons in a row here, but he never had two winning ones in a row either.

So yes, there will be times you pull your hair out and get frustrated about why you didn't go for it on 4th and 1 when you're just outside of FG range but close enough that a gain would get you there. There will be times you wonder why you settled for a FG. There will be times you wonder why this team didn't win this year. But there will be times you also are glad you're not ever one of worst teams in the league (like I said, I don't even count this year. No one would have won with out team and injuries this year. NO ONE.) There will be times you are ecstatic you are one of the best teams in the league.

It's going to be an up and down ride man, but thankfully Fox know how to not get to low.

[The Captain]

I think John Fox isn't as bad as Carolina's disheartened fans make him out to be. Not even Bill Belichick could've gotten the 2010 Panthers a .500 season, much less a playoff berth. Maybe they would've won a couple more games, but they'd still be down in the dumps with Buffalo, Cincinnati, and Denver. The Panthers were a miserable team with no real talent or experience except for Carolina!Steve Smith. And they were also a bad team in the best division in the entire NFL, with two teams that earned a playoff spot and one team that almost made it, but didn't due to tiebreakers.

[Maidpool w/ Cleaning Action]

Jan 8, 2011 13:22:54 GMT -5 The Captain said:

I think John Fox isn't as bad as Carolina's disheartened fans make him out to be. Not even Bill Belichick could've gotten the 2010 Panthers a .500 season, much less a playoff berth. Maybe they would've won a couple more games, but they'd still be down in the dumps with Buffalo, Cincinnati, and Denver. The Panthers were a miserable team with no real talent or experience except for Carolina!Steve Smith. And they were also a bad team in the best division in the entire NFL, with two teams that earned a playoff spot and one team that almost made it, but didn't due to tiebreakers.

Exactly. Though I will add you're forgetting Jonathan Stewart and DeAngelo Williams when mentione the talented players. But D-Will is on the list of injuries I spoke of. I will personally miss Foxy. I highly doubt the next guy will bring us to the Superbowl in 2 years like Fox did when he took over. A lot of people hated his conservative play but I liked the ram the ball down your throat and let the defense win it style personally.

[Tyfo]

I liked John Fox's style when the personnel was right. But he would INSIST on doing it no matter who was on the field. That style doesn't work at all when your offensive line isn't right (like early this season). Without Jeff Otah and reliable guards, your not going anywhere. Plus Stewart wasn't healthy. Two years ago, it worked great, because we had the right players at each spot to do it.

Fox needs to learn when to add in a little variety and he would be fine, instead of just having a set game plan and refusing to deviate from it to play to the strengths of his players.

[Dr. T is an alien]

Jan 8, 2011 14:52:52 GMT -5 Tyfo said:

I liked John Fox's style when the personnel was right. But he would INSIST on doing it no matter who was on the field. That style doesn't work at all when your offensive line isn't right (like early this season). Without Jeff Otah and reliable guards, your not going anywhere. Plus Stewart wasn't healthy. Two years ago, it worked great, because we had the right players at each spot to do it.

Fox needs to learn when to add in a little variety and he would be fine, instead of just having a set game plan and refusing to deviate from it to play to the strengths of his players.

Meh. I sat through the Jeff George years in Indy and can say that trying to adapt to a piss poor line is not that great. George had talent (even if he was a complete tool), but that O-line was so porous that SpongeBob would have done a better job. It was nothing but quick short pass one after another. It kept the team more competitive, but it also meant that they were mediocre for years on end. Granted, that is not a coaches responsibility. Winning is, but it can make their job hard if they don't get the right personnel.

Hitting bottom is not the worst thing to happen to a team so long as they make good use of the opportunities that will present themselves in the way of draft picks and free agent openings. That is where having a good team president is key. Neither Bill Polian or Jonathan Kraft would have let their team languish as league doormat for more than a decade like Mike Brown had with the Bengals. Seriously, the team has had, what, 2 winning seasons since he took over? It is no wonder that when asked about whether the team would resign him after this season, Marvin Lewis was quoted on saying that it might not be an issue of whether the team would bring him back but whether he would agree to come back.

[Seth Drakin of Monster Crap]

Jan 8, 2011 14:52:52 GMT -5 Tyfo said:

I liked John Fox's style when the personnel was right. But he would INSIST on doing it no matter who was on the field. That style doesn't work at all when your offensive line isn't right (like early this season). Without Jeff Otah and reliable guards, your not going anywhere. Plus Stewart wasn't healthy. Two years ago, it worked great, because we had the right players at each spot to do it.

Fox needs to learn when to add in a little variety and he would be fine, instead of just having a set game plan and refusing to deviate from it to play to the strengths of his players.

That is what I was trying to say, the man will play his style of ball no matter if his team is built for that style. It is kind of like Mike Shanahan in Washington and personally, I could see Mike gone after the 2011 season (if their is one).

Yes, we were kind of in a rebuilding year, but even for a rebuilding year.......it was terriible.

And we saw several times this season that we had a defense who was undisciplined and would jump the gun, which screwed us.

It is either his way or the high way and that doesn't succeed unless you have the team around you to do exactly that. Remember, this guy thought about playing Jake Delhomme last year even with a broken thumb.

[Orange]

One thing I like about Fox (over other candidates like Fewell and Dennison) is that he has Head Coaching experience. Not to say that coordinators can't become great head coaches, but I don't know if the FO would be willing to take another chance on a coordinator, so I think Fox would be an attractive choice for us.

[Bake Or Die]

Jan 8, 2011 15:53:59 GMT -5 Orange said:

One thing I like about Fox (over other candidates like Fewell and Dennison) is that he has Head Coaching experience. Not to say that coordinators can't become great head coaches, but I don't know if the FO would be willing to take another chance on a coordinator, so I think Fox would be an attractive choice for us.

Looks like Elway isn't too high on your boy Tim Tebow.

[Tyfo]

Today, I want to see a whole lot of....





Dominate, Big Mike Williams, DOMINATE!!!!

[Deleted]

That was a really bad pre-game pep talk by that Seahawk guy

[rogers67]

3 minutes until the ass-whooping!

[MGH]

Here we go!

[BearDogg-X]

Saints win the coin toss and will receive.

[brettappedout (BLM)]

The crowd is f***ing ROCKING! I see atleast 4 false starts for the Saints

[MGH]

Hope the Saints run these jokes out of the game early and ends this charade.

[Citizen Grimm]

Jan 8, 2011 16:07:53 GMT -5 Bake Or Die said:

Jan 8, 2011 15:53:59 GMT -5 Orange said:

One thing I like about Fox (over other candidates like Fewell and Dennison) is that he has Head Coaching experience. Not to say that coordinators can't become great head coaches, but I don't know if the FO would be willing to take another chance on a coordinator, so I think Fox would be an attractive choice for us.

Looks like Elway isn't too high on your boy Tim Tebow.

I really can't understand why though. I mean, Tebow played in what, 3 or 4 games and did pretty damn decent in them IMHO. Is the guy gonna be the next Joe Montana, probably not, but he seems to be a winner, regardless of how he gets it done.

I'd say you have to give him at least a full year to try and be a franchise QB before you push him to the wayside, especially after using a 1st round pick on him.

[BearDogg-X]

Saints ball at the 40.

[brettappedout (BLM)]

LMAO!

[MGH]

Nice start for the Seahawks.

[Citizen Grimm]

And Seattle off to a hot start!