Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2010 21:54:19 GMT -5
I never saw Hogan advancing on Elizabeth at all. Infact, it kind of disturbs me that people rooted for Macho during that feud because Macho represented abusive boyfriends everywhere. I get it's cool to be anti-Hogan but still. Ther reason why you never saw Hogan advancing on Elizabeth was because it never happened. So many people forget that Macho Man made Hogan look like that by showing edited footage to plead his case (Hogan saying "I love Elizabeth..." and cutting it off before Hogan finished with "...like a sister"). If Macho Man is in the right, why did he have to distort the truth? Exactly. As one person said it is likely just "anti-Hogan" stuff, but really, there was nothing babyface about Savage in that feud. He played the jealous/abusive/paranoid boyfriend. Nothing shown on TV portrayed Hogan "lusting after" Elizabeth. Savage distorted images to portray that as fact, showing that he was delusional and blinded by jealousy (i.e. the whole point of the freakin' storyline). Even after the Savage/Liz on-screen split in 1989, Hogan simply had her as a manager until the feud with Savage wore out, and then it was back to Hogan by himself and Liz in limbo for two years until she and Savage reunited at WM 7. Sympathizing with the abusive/jealous boyfriend is a bit of a stretch.
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Post by yapappi4life on Nov 30, 2010 21:57:52 GMT -5
Owen Hart and the Nation against D-X
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percymania
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Percymania will live forever! Oh yeah!
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Post by percymania on Dec 1, 2010 0:53:41 GMT -5
This wasn't WWE, but the West Texas Rednecks are the gold standard in this category.
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Post by American Dragon on Dec 1, 2010 2:39:58 GMT -5
Even his feud with Shawn Micheals? I thought it was great, but Jericho was the clear heel during that storyline. Didn't Jericho accuse Michaels of faking an injury to gain a win, or something along those lines? He basically called Michaels out on cheating to win, Jericho had every right to call him out on it, while HBK never logically defended himself. Jericho was the face in that situation.
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Post by Starshine on Dec 1, 2010 2:50:03 GMT -5
The triple threat between Cena, Big Show and Edge for Mania 25. Cena blackmails Vickie into getting into the match then immediately goes back on his agreement the second he gets what he wants and exposes her secret.
Seriously, what the hell? Dick move all around.
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ANTLOL
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,384
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Post by ANTLOL on Dec 1, 2010 3:33:42 GMT -5
-Owen Hart vs. Bret Hart -Whenever D-X were faces -Yokozuna Vs. Hulk Hogan -Jeff Jarrett Vs. Razor Ramon -Chris Jericho Vs. Shawn Michaels -Randy Orton Vs. Undertaker -Randy Orton (heel) Vs. McMahons/Levesque -Chris Jericho (heel) Vs. Edge (crappy, crappy, crappy babyface)
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Post by Cactus Jack on Dec 1, 2010 3:44:27 GMT -5
I'd be the meat in that sandwich any time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2010 6:57:36 GMT -5
Even his feud with Shawn Micheals? I thought it was great, but Jericho was the clear heel during that storyline. Didn't Jericho accuse Michaels of faking an injury to gain a win, or something along those lines? He basically called Michaels out on cheating to win, Jericho had every right to call him out on it, while HBK never logically defended himself. Jericho was the face in that situation. Hell, Michaels didn't just not defend himself, he outright admitted that he did cheat.
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Post by Woooooolhouse! on Dec 1, 2010 9:10:06 GMT -5
Ther reason why you never saw Hogan advancing on Elizabeth was because it never happened. So many people forget that Macho Man made Hogan look like that by showing edited footage to plead his case (Hogan saying "I love Elizabeth..." and cutting it off before Hogan finished with "...like a sister"). If Macho Man is in the right, why did he have to distort the truth? Exactly. As one person said it is likely just "anti-Hogan" stuff, but really, there was nothing babyface about Savage in that feud. He played the jealous/abusive/paranoid boyfriend. Nothing shown on TV portrayed Hogan "lusting after" Elizabeth. Savage distorted images to portray that as fact, showing that he was delusional and blinded by jealousy (i.e. the whole point of the freakin' storyline). Even after the Savage/Liz on-screen split in 1989, Hogan simply had her as a manager until the feud with Savage wore out, and then it was back to Hogan by himself and Liz in limbo for two years until she and Savage reunited at WM 7. Sympathizing with the abusive/jealous boyfriend is a bit of a stretch. Why does it have to be "anti-Hogan" and can't just be "pro-Macho Man?" Maybe another problem I had is that Savage was the WWF Champion at the time- the headliner, the top-dog- but when they teamed they always wore yellow and red, they always came out to Hogan's music ... Hogan was clearly pushed as the top-guy over the World's Champion at the time. So- along with seeing Savage as "in-the-right" involving Elizabeth- some of us also see him as being "in-the-right" when he claimed he was tired of being Number 3 in the Mega-Powers, and that Hogan clearly always wanted his belt back (and the power that came with it.)
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Post by Sharpy Snow on Dec 1, 2010 9:28:32 GMT -5
Hornswoggle vs Anyone.
Poor Chavo was made to dive through all sorts of hoops and stuff against him. And then Chavo saves him and correct me if I'm wrong, but Hornswoggle STILL didn't leave him alone.
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Post by American Dragon on Dec 1, 2010 9:36:41 GMT -5
Austin/McMahon to an extent. Vince was just trying to run a company with a decent champion to represent his company, he didn't want some reckless, beer drinking redneck running around causing hell and making his company look bad. Austin never reasoned with Vince at all.
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Post by Kevin's Thorn on Dec 1, 2010 9:55:19 GMT -5
I dunno if it was brought up yet, but Hogan vs Rock the first time, nearly everyone sided with Hollywood Hogan eventually instead of uber-over face Rock.
Also, Hollywood Rock gets cheered in most situations even when he makes fun of the maple-syrup-sucking Canadians, so it all comes back around!
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BxB
Unicron
Only the shift key stands between him and copyright infringement.
Posts: 2,849
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Post by BxB on Dec 1, 2010 10:13:09 GMT -5
Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, since I didn't check all the pages. But, Cena vs Lesnar back in the day. Lesnar was a dick that put Cena out of action for months, Cena came back to get his revenge. Somehow, Lesnar was a face in all this.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2010 10:47:11 GMT -5
Any feud with Rey Mysterio.
And also CM Punk during his "feud" with Big Show, as well.
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Post by Piccolo on Dec 1, 2010 18:44:24 GMT -5
Didn't Jericho accuse Michaels of faking an injury to gain a win, or something along those lines? He basically called Michaels out on cheating to win, Jericho had every right to call him out on it, while HBK never logically defended himself. Jericho was the face in that situation. Hell, Michaels didn't just not defend himself, he outright admitted that he did cheat. The twists and turns early in that story were so great. Michaels starts out as a face and Batista as a heel, while Jericho is putting his nose in where it doesn't belong. Batista provokes Michaels until he decides to live down to those expectations and does cheat, turning Michaels into the heel and Batista into sort of a face, whereas Jericho, whose nose is STILL where it doesn't belong, takes it on as a personal crusade to expose the trickery... so he's "right", but he's still being a busybody, and he was also exacerbating this situation from the get-go. Heel!Michaels plays the put-upon martyr so well that Jericho finally believes him and goes full-on babyface with his apology, only to get kicked in the face for his troubles, pushing him into a weird territory where he's being a total jerk, but kind of understandably, but only if you ignore that he shouldn't have stuck his beak in in the first place. And Michaels sort of goes back to being a face, but only in the sense that the audience understands he doesn't mind cheating against massively larger jerkish opponents and lying about it to busybodies, and likes him anyway. It was all very deliciously grey. Much more so than any other storyline in recent memory, in my opinion. I would be hard-pressed to say who was really the face and the heel by the time Batista dropped out of the picture and it was just Jericho-Michaels... it's kind of a Javert vs Valjean thing, you know? Jericho was technically right, but he was insane. Michaels was technically wrong, but he was much more live and let live... moreover, he'd already paid for what he did to Batista via the stretcher match. So it was like, dude, Jericho, what's your problem? And it started looking a lot more like ego than like righteous anger.
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Post by 'Smart' Mark Poindexter on Dec 1, 2010 18:58:06 GMT -5
Hollywood Hogan's heel turn when he first joined the NWO...I mentione dit in another thread let me find it... That the Hulkster to Hollywood Hogan change was not only justified but should kept him a face...think about it like this. Hogan comes in as the paragon of all thats good and right and the fans instead chose to cheer Ric Flair,a man who cheats,womanizes, and disrespects everyone....so really the Hollywood change was the Hulkster's attempt to give the fan what they wanted. He tried to be the man by beating the man at his own game.
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Post by chunkylover53 on Dec 1, 2010 22:43:39 GMT -5
Hollywood Hogan's heel turn when he first joined the NWO...I mentione dit in another thread let me find it... That the Hulkster to Hollywood Hogan change was not only justified but should kept him a face...think about it like this. Hogan comes in as the paragon of all thats good and right and the fans instead chose to cheer Ric Flair,a man who cheats,womanizes, and disrespects everyone....so really the Hollywood change was the Hulkster's attempt to give the fan what they wanted. He tried to be the man by beating the man at his own game. Right, because Hogan never cheated as a babyface.
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Post by Perpetual Nirvana on Dec 1, 2010 22:49:31 GMT -5
-Randy Orton Vs. Undertaker You sympathise with the guy who locked the Undertaker in a casket and set it alight? Who repeatedly tried to kill the Undertaker (I'm not exaggerating, "kill" was the term he used)? Really?
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ANTLOL
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,384
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Post by ANTLOL on Dec 2, 2010 11:44:47 GMT -5
-Randy Orton Vs. Undertaker You sympathise with the guy who locked the Undertaker in a casket and set it alight? Who repeatedly tried to kill the Undertaker (I'm not exaggerating, "kill" was the term he used)? Really? Yes I did. I know it's scripted and I just cannot take "kill" seriously in wrestling. Furthermore, The Undertaker is undead in kayfabe. Orton was fighting a supernatural entity. Beside that I just felt that if anyone Orton was the guy who should end the streak which would have catapulted to the very highest level of WWE, above Cena, above Triple H. In hindsight Orton did not need a victory to become one of the permanent main eventers of WWE, but back then it felt right.
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Post by YellowJacketY2J on Dec 2, 2010 11:46:47 GMT -5
You sympathise with the guy who locked the Undertaker in a casket and set it alight? Who repeatedly tried to kill the Undertaker (I'm not exaggerating, "kill" was the term he used)? Really? Yes I did. I know it's scripted and I just cannot take "kill" seriously in wrestling. Furthermore, The Undertaker is undead in kayfabe. Orton was fighting a supernatural entity. Beside that I just felt that if anyone Orton was the guy who should end the streak which would have catapulted to the very highest level of WWE, above Cena, above Triple H. In hindsight Orton did not need a victory to become one of the permanent main eventers of WWE, but back then it felt right. I read that the plan was to have Orton end the streak at Wrestlemania 21, with Taker himself being fine with the idea. It was Randy that nixed it. This could easily be a rumor, though.
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