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Post by corndog on Dec 31, 2010 18:55:57 GMT -5
As most have said, Barrett has done very well for himself. For the most part he has been a legitimate main event and threat for the WWE title. I know there is alot of crying about the Barrett led Nexus's burial, but Cena is booked over everyone not named HHH.
The other two, yeah that's obvious. I wonder if Kaval was just a way to stick it to the internet fans. Kaitlyn, well NXT 3 was a joke anyways, and I think they just had her win over AJ and Naomi to give the whole season an overall feeling of suck. I atleast hope Naomi and AJ get shots on the main roster.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Dec 31, 2010 19:38:31 GMT -5
I do. And Kaval won his match with Big Show based on the stipulations involved, then had the fighting spirit to accept another match when challenged. That's really, really stretching it to the point where it borders on being revisionist history. The guy was not a member of the Smackdown team. At no time did he appear on the PPV. The only reason he was in that match in the first place was to be fed to Tyler Reks so he could at least look like a threat to fans who had no idea who he was. He was never allowed to look like he had any chance of winning that qualifier, and even the announcers basically spent five minutes saying that the Big show could finish off Kaval any time he wanted to and that Kaval never had a chance. He then won the match half a second before being on the wrong end of a chokeslam, and was immediately then fed to Tyler Reks. Kaval was about as involved in the main event at Bragging Rights as Chris Masters. I said main event program. And you know how else they could have put Reks in the match and intro'd him to fans? By putting him in a normal qualifier. Kaval's run to me struck me as a build where at any time they could have had him turn the corner and start getting wins. Okay, they had no plans for it in the immediate future, but eventually?
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Post by pink on Dec 31, 2010 19:44:36 GMT -5
And besides, it's always been more about Kaitlin's personality rather than her wrestling skills.
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
Posts: 4,804
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Post by randomranter on Dec 31, 2010 19:46:50 GMT -5
I said main event program. And you know how else they could have put Reks in the match and intro'd him to fans? By putting him in a normal qualifier. They didn't. They fed Kaval to him. His role in those qualifiers was the exact same role that Chris Masters had -- to be fed to someone the WWE actually cares about. And I doubt you're going to hear anyone say that Chris Masters was "part of a main event program" by jobbing to Del Rio. The same could be said for anybody. But they didn't, and it looks like they never had any intentions of doing so.
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Classy Lady
Don Corleone
Kingston's Part Time Lover
Posts: 1,595
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Post by Classy Lady on Dec 31, 2010 20:01:49 GMT -5
Wade has done fine.
Kaval I agree with.
Kaitlyn had no business winning in the first place, and shouldn't be anywhere near TV for a long time. Possibly ever.
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Post by pink on Dec 31, 2010 20:11:41 GMT -5
Kaitlyn had no business winning in the first place, and shouldn't be anywhere near TV for a long time. Possibly ever. But why would we have actual wrestlers who can contribute to the product like AJ or Naomi win, when we can have someone like Kaitlin who has a storyline going that was ultimately dropped after the competition?
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Dec 31, 2010 20:31:44 GMT -5
I said main event program. And you know how else they could have put Reks in the match and intro'd him to fans? By putting him in a normal qualifier. They didn't. They fed Kaval to him. His role in those qualifiers was the exact same role that Chris Masters had -- to be fed to someone the WWE actually cares about. And I doubt you're going to hear anyone say that Chris Masters was "part of a main event program" by jobbing to Del Rio. The same could be said for anybody. But they didn't, and it looks like they never had any intentions of doing so. No, they just had no immediate plans. NEver say never.
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
Posts: 4,804
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Post by randomranter on Dec 31, 2010 20:43:01 GMT -5
No, they just had no immediate plans. NEver say never. They told him that they had no plans for him any time in the foreseeable future. It's why he quit. That's basically a polite way of saying "You're gonna be a jobber. Get over it." He was going to be the next Funaki.
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toonami4life
Don Corleone
Better than your favorite crossover
Posts: 1,770
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Post by toonami4life on Dec 31, 2010 20:46:28 GMT -5
They didn't. They fed Kaval to him. His role in those qualifiers was the exact same role that Chris Masters had -- to be fed to someone the WWE actually cares about. And I doubt you're going to hear anyone say that Chris Masters was "part of a main event program" by jobbing to Del Rio. The same could be said for anybody. But they didn't, and it looks like they never had any intentions of doing so. No, they just had no immediate plans. NEver say never. When was those plans involving him coming to fruition? The Rumble? Wrestlemania? Six months from now? Or hell, even a whole year from now? They didn't have anything for him and told him that to his face. They made him lose against everyone and the wins he did get looked like a fluke. His title shot resulted in nothing and he lost to Chavo, a guy that loses to everyone and everything. They basically said this when they told him they had nothing planned for him. "Here's the deal, you're nothing but an enhancement talent for everyone else despite your skill and in ring prowess. You might as well get use to it." I honestly can't blame him for asking for his release with how they treated him.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 31, 2010 20:46:49 GMT -5
Kaval won 3 matches on Smackdown. That's more than Alex Riley, Hennig, or Husky combined has gotten on Raw. Kaval got jobbed out the minute he appeared on Smackdown, and won solely so he'll look like a semi-credible threat when they burned off his title shot. Then he went right back to jobbing, and was told by management that they had no plans for him for the foreseeable future. Kaval was left with two options: Continue jobbing until they finally get around to releasing him in the next round of roster cullings and damaging his marketability on the indy circuit, or quit and go back to the indies now while his name still means something. IMO, he took the smart choice. A-Ri, Harris, and Henning aren't doing any better in terms of win-loss records, but they're at least involved in top-level storylines. Harris and Henning also at least get to occasionally look like credible threats during the Nexus group beatdowns. Kaval would have still had his cred in the indies no matter what his win/lost record was. Colt Cabana didn't get a single win and jobbed out. His only saving grace was his short lived web show. After Colt got the boot, he went right back to the indies and got more bookings than before. So if you are already made your name, you will still make money. If Low Ki had beaten the Chavos, the Reks, and other bottom dwellers, does that mean he can ask for more money? "I beat Curt Hawkins at a house show, that's a extra $100 right there". Point being, fans will come out to see Low Ki not Kaval. Riley is a joke. He lost matches in squashes. Yes it's against main eventers. Yes he is the Miz's right hand man. But Santino has more credibility than Alex. Hennig and Husky are just interchangeable members of Nexus. If they got replaced with someone else, it wouldn't make a difference.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 31, 2010 20:50:46 GMT -5
Kaitlyn had no business winning in the first place, and shouldn't be anywhere near TV for a long time. Possibly ever. But why would we have actual wrestlers who can contribute to the product like AJ or Naomi win, when we can have someone like Kaitlin who has a storyline going that was ultimately dropped after the competition? Blame the fans. They liked Kaitlyn more than AJ or Naomi. Naomi is already doing the house show loop. AJ will be next to be called up. Kaitlyn was a last second replacement for the giant chick. She had only been training for 2 months before getting the call.
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
Posts: 4,804
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Post by randomranter on Dec 31, 2010 21:04:46 GMT -5
Kaval would have still had his cred in the indies no matter what his win/lost record was. Colt Cabana didn't get a single win and jobbed out. His only saving grace was his short lived web show. After Colt got the boot, he went right back to the indies and got more bookings than before. So if you are already made your name, you will still make money. If Low Ki had beaten the Chavos, the Reks, and other bottom dwellers, does that mean he can ask for more money? "I beat Curt Hawkins at a house show, that's a extra $100 right there". Point being, fans will come out to see Low Ki not Kaval. A Low-Ki that spent six months in the WWE in a low-card role beating Chavo, Chris Masters, and Curt Hawkins is going to have more market value than "Low-Ki: Former WWE Jobber". He won't lose any indy fans over this. But his WWE run won't attract any new ones. Had he had a short low- to mid-card role in the WWE, he'd have attracted some casual fans who had never heard of him before or seen his indy work. But new fans aren't going to see his name on the ads and flock to see what they consider a former WWE jobber. "Why should I pay my good money to go see some guy who couldn't win a match in months?". Others have said it far better than I do -- Jobbing too long in the WWE does negatively affect your marketability, and Kaval got out before any more damage was done. And they're still at least involved in main event storylines. They're still played up by the announcers as credible threats. They still get to work with Cena, Orton, Miz, and Punk. Kaval was not involved in any storylines, was losing to Chavo of all people, wasn't working with any top talent, and if the announcers acknowledged him at all, it was basically as an afterthought. "Oh, yeah. That's Kaval. He doesn't have a chance. Let's talk about something important now." If I'm going to be a jobber with an 0-X record, I'd rather at least be going 0-X against main eventers instead of being treated as an afterthought on the B show.
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PKO
King Koopa
Posts: 12,604
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Post by PKO on Dec 31, 2010 21:12:02 GMT -5
What I don't get about Kaval and Kaitlyn winning is why didn't they just rig it so they didn't? I say rig, but really the whole 50% pro, 50% fan vote was shady to begin with.
It's pretty obvious now they didn't want Kaval to win, seeing as they've pushed Alex Riley, Michael McGillicutty and Husky Harris more than they pushed Kaval during his short stay on the roster.
And Kailtyn they've had on screen for a combined time of probably just over a minute since winning, and they dropped the storyline that got her over in the first place. Now they've got Naomi on the house show circuit, and AJ's already done that, so clearly WWE could have done more with them winning (rather than a woman with next to no training).
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,432
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Post by FinalGwen on Dec 31, 2010 21:32:04 GMT -5
I do love that even while Barrett has done well, they completely buried the NXT title shot by adding 4 other guys to his match for no real reason, and had one of the extra guys win it. Imagine if they did that with MITB or the Royal Rumble winner.
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KEEZ
Don Corleone
Corre-Nation Street
Posts: 1,288
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Post by KEEZ on Dec 31, 2010 21:33:04 GMT -5
What could this mean for Brodus Clay or Conor O'brian?
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Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 31, 2010 21:34:39 GMT -5
The indies who are going hire Low Ki are not going to be the ones catering to casual fans. How many casual fans are going to indy shows nowadays? Not that many if you go by the number of fans seen on dvds of some of the bigger name independents. Currently mostly the hardcore fans are coming to see indy wrestling. And that is what is hurting them. Casual fans want the big league experience. They don't care about workrate or stiffness. They want the Cenas, the Hardys, the Ortons. That's something the indys can't give them. Putting big names like Christopher Daniels, Davey Richards, Chris Hero, or Mike Quakenbush aren't making a huge difference. I highly doubt Low Ki is the savior. Even Danielson didn't make too impact in his last appearances. And there was a bigger outrage over his firing and demand for his talent.
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Classy Lady
Don Corleone
Kingston's Part Time Lover
Posts: 1,595
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Post by Classy Lady on Dec 31, 2010 21:44:23 GMT -5
But why would we have actual wrestlers who can contribute to the product like AJ or Naomi win, when we can have someone like Kaitlin who has a storyline going that was ultimately dropped after the competition? Blame the fans. They liked Kaitlyn more than AJ or Naomi. Naomi is already doing the house show loop. AJ will be next to be called up. Kaitlyn was a last second replacement for the giant chick. She had only been training for 2 months before getting the call. To be fair, with the fan voting, they put Kaitlyn opposite the biggest heel in the company, and she was the only one that was seen on a main show past the first few weeks. I'm not arguing the fan votes with you, it's just there are ways of swaying those kind of things, and I think it was clear who WWE WANTED to win.
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Post by Snaptastic on Jan 1, 2011 1:04:17 GMT -5
Blame the fans. They liked Kaitlyn more than AJ or Naomi. Naomi is already doing the house show loop. AJ will be next to be called up. Kaitlyn was a last second replacement for the giant chick. She had only been training for 2 months before getting the call. To be fair, with the fan voting, they put Kaitlyn opposite the biggest heel in the company, and she was the only one that was seen on a main show past the first few weeks. I'm not arguing the fan votes with you, it's just there are ways of swaying those kind of things, and I think it was clear who WWE WANTED to win. And that's what I don't get. Yes I do support her, but Kaitlyn as this stage has no business being in the ring. Why would any organisation want a rookie to win that kind of competition, over much more experienced divas? Kaitlyn is more eye-candy (although I accept she's not to everyones taste) that in-ring technician for sure. With AJ & Naomi, you at least had a more well-rounded package. It wouldn't surprise me if they just did nothing with Kaitlyn from this point on, and eventually released her. It's not her fault, but the company's fault for bringing her up before she was ready.
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Dragonfly
Samurai Cop
...is no Barry Windham.
Posts: 2,486
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Post by Dragonfly on Jan 1, 2011 2:12:42 GMT -5
Well, they picked the best of FCW for NXT1... there were some not-so-ready guys for the second seasons, divas on the third and I think they reached the bottom of the barrel. To me, the fourth season is less "bottom of the barrel" and more "needs special attention." Think about it: Derrick Bateman: Another "face in the crowd" that no one aside from diehard FCW fans and Ohio indy regulars were familiar with. Conor O'Brian: A developmental "second chancer" with an odd look. Byron Saxton: Great mic skills, but not necessarily made for the traditional "30 second introductory skit." Johnny Curtis: Look how long he has been around. They have absolutely no idea what to do with him, yet still don't want to lose him. Jacob Novak: The living embodiment of the phrase "some guy." Brodus Clay (G-Rilla): He's got the look the WWE likes, and isn't all that bad on the mic. He also couldn't put a match together if his life depended on it. The average Raw/Smackdown debut wasn't going to cut it for these guys. They needed a extra little bit to make the fans (and writers) actually care about them. NXT is that "extra little bit."
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Post by pink on Jan 1, 2011 13:21:32 GMT -5
Well, they picked the best of FCW for NXT1... there were some not-so-ready guys for the second seasons, divas on the third and I think they reached the bottom of the barrel. To me, the fourth season is less "bottom of the barrel" and more "needs special attention." Think about it: Derrick Bateman: Another "face in the crowd" that no one aside from diehard FCW fans and Ohio indy regulars were familiar with. Conor O'Brian: A developmental "second chancer" with an odd look. Byron Saxton: Great mic skills, but not necessarily made for the traditional "30 second introductory skit." Johnny Curtis: Look how long he has been around. They have absolutely no idea what to do with him, yet still don't want to lose him. Jacob Novak: The living embodiment of the phrase "some guy." Brodus Clay (G-Rilla): He's got the look the WWE likes, and isn't all that bad on the mic. He also couldn't put a match together if his life depended on it. The average Raw/Smackdown debut wasn't going to cut it for these guys. They needed a extra little bit to make the fans (and writers) actually care about them. NXT is that "extra little bit." I agree with your post 110%. S4 guys really do need NXT because this way their given more of a chance to make an impression than if they just threw them to the sharks on Smackdown or Raw. However, I do think some guys on S1, S2, and S3 could've debuted fine without NXT. In fact, if I remember right I think Bryan and AJ were really close to being called up before NXT.
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