|
Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Oct 19, 2012 14:33:45 GMT -5
I do get that, but forget who the Champion is. The person who is the World Heavyweight Champion should have the best record, and the next contender, the strongest contender, should also at least have a strong record. Ryback actually seems like a deserving Champion, just based on the records. And yeah, Sheamus' run has been less then stellar, in regards to storylines and angles, but he's still being pushed like he should. Why should the Heavyweight Champion have a better record than the WWE Champion? It's their sad attempt at maintaining the facade that the titles, and by extension the brands, are equal when they obviously aren't at this point.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 19, 2012 15:01:26 GMT -5
I find it interesting that I get this thread pinned and such debate happens. Kinda brings a smile to my face.
|
|
Arrow
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,122
|
Post by Arrow on Oct 19, 2012 15:18:22 GMT -5
Of course he's disliked by plenty of fans. And yet, he gets cheered most of the time. I remember Sheamus getting booed consistently against three heels - Daniel Bryan, Dolph Ziggler, and CM Punk - two of whom have a dedicated fan following who cheers them no matter what. Against Miz, Otunga, Rhodes, Barrett, Show, and Del Rio, Sheamus tended to do just fine. He's already more over than anyone not named Cena, Punk, or Randy Orton. Maybe Rey Mysterio and Ryback (who has yet to prove that he can hold his reactions long-term) on a couple occasions. Just how much more popular is an upper-midcard face supposed to be? I never compared Sheamus to any of them. I used them in order to show that fans don't hate dominant faces. But that doesn't make sense. Not when you consider that WWE has had several dominant top faces. In fact, historically speaking, dominant top faces (Hogan, Austin, Rock, Cena) tend to connect much more than top faces who aren't dominant (Bret, Shawn). If anything, fans like top faces who dominate more than they like faces who don't. Cena tends to do just fine when he's not going against wrestlers with a dedicated fan following. And even if there's a section of the fanbase who dislikes him no matter what, the money Cena has made would suggest that he's more loved than hated. Despite his being dominant. Sheamus does show vulnerability. I remember Del Rio getting the upper hand on him several times. But even aside from that, Austin was often booked stronger than Sheamus was, and fans flocked to him anyway. You can make his opponents look like they stand a chance without neutering Sheamus in the process. Big Show looks enough like a threat and I haven't seen him KO Sheamus even once. Putting a strong face against a strong heel is a great way to sell pay-per-views. Not a weak face against a strong heel, or vice versa. If the fans saw them as a big deal, WWE would have, too.
|
|
BigWill
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 16,619
|
Post by BigWill on Oct 19, 2012 15:49:07 GMT -5
Why should the Heavyweight Champion have a better record than the WWE Champion? It's their sad attempt at maintaining the facade that the titles, and by extension the brands, are equal when they obviously aren't at this point. That would make sense. They've done similar things to a few of the more recent Smackdown top faces. Sheamus, Orton before him, and Edge before him. Smackdown tends to get really hard to watch when they have face champions.
|
|
|
Post by Andrew is Good on Oct 19, 2012 18:56:31 GMT -5
I do get that, but forget who the Champion is. The person who is the World Heavyweight Champion should have the best record, and the next contender, the strongest contender, should also at least have a strong record. Ryback actually seems like a deserving Champion, just based on the records. And yeah, Sheamus' run has been less then stellar, in regards to storylines and angles, but he's still being pushed like he should. Why should the Heavyweight Champion have a better record than the WWE Champion? I don't know, why should he? Punk should have a better record too. Punk shouldn't be losing to Kane or being pinned by him, because he's the Champion. Even if he's the heel Champion, he's still the Champion. Punk getting pinned by Daniel Bryan earlier in the year, or losing to him, that was fine in the context because Bryan was the top contender. The guy who beats the Champion should automatically be the top contender. I'm a big fan of non-title matches, because you should have to earn a title shot. Like, this past week on Impact. ODB beat Tara, well, after Tessmacher faces Tara next week, ODB should get the next shot, because she beat the Champion. When Gunner beat Sting and Mr. Anderson, the Champion and number one contender, that shouldn't be forgotten. I think with Sheamus, they're over compensating for his lack of a strong story lines with wins, which has it's upsides and it's downsides. Punk is far more focused on, and I think this is one of the negatives of having the two World Titles. If they had the separate brands, it would be fine, but they don't anymore. I wish more Champions were at least dominant and if when they lost, it meant something. And I think this is why CMWaters needs to be praised so much for this thread and keeping track of this, because you get a good look on how everything is booked in regards to wins and losses and how important it can be sometimes and overlooked at others. Antonio Cesaro is a great Champion. He doesn't defend the title, but you know what? Who is there to challenge him? He shouldn't have to defend the title against Justin Gabriel, what did Justin do to deserve it? Now if Justin wins a bunch of matches, or even beats the Champion, then yeah, he deserves a title shot. Pro Wrestling is a fake sport, but I wish more logic would be put in the wins and losses. People want them to mean something, and want Championships to mean something. And with Sheamus, at least with his wins, the title means something. It's on a Champion who wins a lot, he puts on strong matches, and yeah, his storylines are s*** and he's becoming John Cena Jr., but at least the Championship means something because it's on a guy who deserves it. One positive as well is most of the Champions are high up on the list in regards to wins and losses. Especially after Miz lost the title, what a poison he was.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 19, 2012 20:58:48 GMT -5
Updated for Smackdown.
|
|
Cronant
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,556
|
Post by Cronant on Oct 19, 2012 21:04:34 GMT -5
[/b][/u] [li] Layla: 19-4-0 [/li][li] Beth Phoenix: 16-16-0 [/li][li] Kaitlyn: 14-12-0 [/li][li] Tamina Snuka: 13-8-0 [/li][li] Eve Torres (Divas Champion): 13-11-0 [/li][li] Kelly Kelly: 10-7-0 [/li][li] Alicia Fox: 8-19-0 [/li][li] AJ: 7-2-0 [/li][li] Natalya: 7-26-0 [/li][li] Nikki Bella: 6-7-0 [/li][li] Maxine: 5-11-0 [/li][li] Paige: 4-2-0 [/li][li] Brie Bella: 4-10-0 [/li][li] Raquel Diaz: 2-0-0 [/li][li] Sofia Cortez: 2-1-0 [/li][li] Aksana: 2-5-0 [/li][li]Maria Menounos: 1-0-0 [/li][li] Lita: 1-0-0 [/li][li] Audrey Marie: 1-2-0 [/li][li] Kharma: 0-1-0 [/li][li] Caylee Turner: 0-1-0 [/li][li] Rosa Mendes: 0-2-0 [/li][li] Vickie Guerrero: 0-2-0 [/li][/ul][/quote] Sheamus is a lock for the guys, but can anyone catch up to Layla? Beth is on the way out, and Tamina has disappeared, so Eve and Kaitlyn are the only ones with a shot at this point. Eve could do it, but 6 wins is a lot to make up with only a few months left.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 20, 2012 9:29:34 GMT -5
Updated for Slam.
|
|
Waffel113
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Ain't no Rap Mobile with his Waffels
Posts: 19,020
|
Post by Waffel113 on Oct 21, 2012 13:07:39 GMT -5
It is CMWaters' birthday.
LET'S CELEBRATE!
|
|
|
Post by deadstock on Oct 22, 2012 3:11:21 GMT -5
Looking at this makes me hope that the streak continues i want triple digits .
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 22, 2012 22:05:45 GMT -5
Updated for Raw.
|
|
|
Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Oct 23, 2012 4:15:40 GMT -5
[/b][/u] [li] Layla: 19-4-0 [/li][li] Beth Phoenix: 16-16-0 [/li][li] Kaitlyn: 14-12-0 [/li][li] Tamina Snuka: 13-8-0 [/li][li] Eve Torres (Divas Champion): 13-11-0 [/li][li] Kelly Kelly: 10-7-0 [/li][li] Alicia Fox: 8-19-0 [/li][li] AJ: 7-2-0 [/li][li] Natalya: 7-26-0 [/li][li] Nikki Bella: 6-7-0 [/li][li] Maxine: 5-11-0 [/li][li] Paige: 4-2-0 [/li][li] Brie Bella: 4-10-0 [/li][li] Raquel Diaz: 2-0-0 [/li][li] Sofia Cortez: 2-1-0 [/li][li] Aksana: 2-5-0 [/li][li]Maria Menounos: 1-0-0 [/li][li] Lita: 1-0-0 [/li][li] Audrey Marie: 1-2-0 [/li][li] Kharma: 0-1-0 [/li][li] Caylee Turner: 0-1-0 [/li][li] Rosa Mendes: 0-2-0 [/li][li] Vickie Guerrero: 0-2-0 [/li][/ul][/quote] Sheamus is a lock for the guys, but can anyone catch up to Layla? Beth is on the way out, and Tamina has disappeared, so Eve and Kaitlyn are the only ones with a shot at this point. Eve could do it, but 6 wins is a lot to make up with only a few months left.[/quote] I also just noticed something. Every Diva match this year has had a winner and loser. Not a single draw or no-contest at all.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 23, 2012 9:23:35 GMT -5
Sheamus is a lock for the guys, but can anyone catch up to Layla? Beth is on the way out, and Tamina has disappeared, so Eve and Kaitlyn are the only ones with a shot at this point. Eve could do it, but 6 wins is a lot to make up with only a few months left. I also just noticed something. Every Diva match this year has had a winner and loser. Not a single draw or no-contest at all. You say that now, and then next Divas match we get...
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 24, 2012 19:58:13 GMT -5
Updated for Main Event.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 26, 2012 18:01:15 GMT -5
Updated for NXT and Superstars.
Since Sheamus is a lock for the guys, who will be the top winner for the NXT roster? Will Percy Watson keep his spot, or will Percy's relative inactivity cause a Connor O'Brian or Seth Rollins to get there?
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 26, 2012 20:54:13 GMT -5
Updated for Smackdown since there are no matches.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 27, 2012 9:30:08 GMT -5
Updated for Slam.
Been a while since I updated Derrick Bateman's name.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 29, 2012 18:19:22 GMT -5
Just realized I didn't update for Hell in a Cell. Done now.
Now to get ready to update for Raw tonight.
|
|
|
Post by Andrew is Good on Oct 29, 2012 23:24:46 GMT -5
I know Raw isn't updated yet, but my hope is Slater gains all his wins back by the end of the year. It maybe too late, but I'm wondering if it's mathematically possible for Slater to get above .500. That's my hope this year.
Ok, so if Slater shows up and has wins on both Raw and Smackdown, AND both the remaining pay per views, and never loses, he should end up with like, 29-44-0. Though, if they just go Slater crazy, and he appears on every WWE show during the week, wins all his matches, and doesn't lose, I think he's got a mathematical chance. But, he'll at least be on two of those shows. So, now the predictions could come in. Will his record be better then The Miz's. I say it will.
|
|
CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,078
|
Post by CMWaters on Oct 29, 2012 23:27:14 GMT -5
I know Raw isn't updated yet, but my hope is Slater gains all his wins back by the end of the year. It maybe too late, but I'm wondering if it's mathematically possible for Slater to get above .500. That's my hope this year. He'd most likely have to have a match on every show (Raw, Smackdown, NXT, Superstars, Main Event and Slam) and on the two remaining PPVs and win them to have it count. And reason I didn't update Raw was because I'm waiting to see if they count that AJ/Beth thing as one match or two seperate matches.
|
|