donny
Team Rocket
Posts: 770
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Post by donny on Mar 12, 2012 21:50:39 GMT -5
This was made especially worse because she'd been dead for about a week when he started with it. Not to mention that the feud absolutely didnt need that to be dragged in. No feud does. Now see, I didn't have a problem with it because Lawler was involved. It most likely was his idea right out of his Memphis playbook. To get offended by that when Lawler has done far worse in the past boggles my mind. That reminds me of a good one: Lawler once attacked Jake Roberts, a recovering alcoholic, and poured whiskey down his throat. On Roberts' DVD, he confirmed that it was, in fact, real whiskey instead of a smarter substitute.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Mar 12, 2012 21:53:58 GMT -5
The nWo Horsemen skit has some interesting stories behind it. According to quite a few people, Arn thought it was funny but his family was offended, and Ric Flair hated it so it got him all worked up. I'd never heard anything about Arn finding it funny. The only person I've seen say they found it funny is Kevin Nash, and I don't believe him.
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Post by That Mickie Fan on Mar 12, 2012 21:54:29 GMT -5
Tonight, Jericho bringing Punk's father up and Calling him Pathetic and such.
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Post by Andrew is Good on Mar 12, 2012 22:06:41 GMT -5
Tonight, Jericho bringing Punk's father up and Calling him Pathetic and such. I loved it. Punk's used it himself in promos, including one of his more famous ROH ones. Plus, apparently, his dad is a recovered alcoholic.
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Lila
El Dandy
Slip N Slide World Champion 1997
Posts: 8,905
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Post by Lila on Mar 12, 2012 22:19:54 GMT -5
Might as well throw in Cena/Rock.
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pegasuswarrior
El Dandy
Three Time FAN Idol Champion
@PulpPictionary
Posts: 8,748
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Post by pegasuswarrior on Mar 13, 2012 1:03:26 GMT -5
None of the above.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Mar 13, 2012 11:09:20 GMT -5
Michael Cole talking about Jerry Lawler's dead mother. This was made especially worse because she'd been dead for about a week when he started with it. Not to mention that the feud absolutely didnt need that to be dragged in. No feud does. it was even worse because just before Michael Cole said that, Miz (whom, keep in mind was feuding with Jerry at the time) cut a promo where he gave Jerry his deepest condolences. it not only underscored how tasteless Michael Cole's comments were, it made him look like a bratty 5 year old who doesn't understand how wrong it is to say something like that.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Mar 13, 2012 11:11:57 GMT -5
All of these are good examples (to me at least) of the lines of reality being blurred and that everyone involved were putting on a show...You really expect me to believe that a guy like randy Orton doesn't have the kind of pull to look at a line like Eddies in hell, not be able to change the line if he wanted too? no way in hell...and also Eddie seemed like the type of company man who would be ok with it. Look at some of the angles the had participated in. at the time, who knows how much pull Randy had. That was around the time period where he was constantly getting in trouble. In Jericho's second book, he said when he heard the line he was very offended and felt Eddie would never have been okay with the line. The nWo Horsemen skit has some interesting stories behind it. According to quite a few people, Arn thought it was funny but his family was offended, and Ric Flair hated it so it got him all worked up. Eddie would likely not have been okay with it. he had constantly been asked both in AAA and WCW to do angles about Art Barr and he always refused.
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bob
Backup Wench
The "other" Bob. FOC COURSE!
started the Madness Wars, Proudly the #1 Nana Hater on FAN
Posts: 80,478
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Post by bob on Mar 13, 2012 11:38:11 GMT -5
Tonight, Jericho bringing Punk's father up and Calling him Pathetic and such. yeah....that was very uncomfortable
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,789
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Mar 13, 2012 11:41:03 GMT -5
it was even worse because just before Michael Cole said that, Miz (whom, keep in mind was feuding with Jerry at the time) cut a promo where he gave Jerry his deepest condolences. I'd totally forgotten that
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 28,249
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Post by chazraps on Mar 13, 2012 14:00:51 GMT -5
Yes, along with the "Brian Christopher's daddy is Jerry Lawler!", but more importantly, Jerry Jarrett recognized that it exposed the business inappropriately and let Gilbert go soon after. And, as others have said, ethnic/racial slurs were not uncommon in Memphis, back in the day. Heck, any kind of slur that would be considered offensive today was common, and the fans seemed to like them, generally. I sometimes wonder if we're a little too thin-skinned now. I'll take thin skinned over catering to bigots. Agreed. The less blatant racism on my TV, the better.
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NOwave
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,735
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Post by NOwave on Mar 13, 2012 17:42:49 GMT -5
This is the irony: the Memphis audience was heavily african-american, and everybody knew. They seemed to enjoy it as much as white viewers did. At least, they never stopped attending matches or watching TV. I'll say it again: we were less ready to pounce on any percieved insult than we are today. And I'm not sure that's really progress. The true elimination of racism will be when we all laugh at any racial stereotype.
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kidkamikaze10
Dennis Stamp
Trying to think of a new avatar
Posts: 4,324
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Mar 13, 2012 18:21:59 GMT -5
This is the irony: the Memphis audience was heavily african-american, and everybody knew. They seemed to enjoy it as much as white viewers did. At least, they never stopped attending matches or watching TV. I'll say it again: we were less ready to pounce on any percieved insult than we are today. And I'm not sure that's really progress. The true elimination of racism will be when we all laugh at any racial stereotype. I'm sorry, but that doesn't excuse a thing. For instance, some women buy into, perpetuate, believe, and even preach misogynistic crap. Doesn't change that that stuff is detrimental to women in general. If anything, the fact that people are pouncing on perceived insults and terrible depictions shows an advancement of freedom of speech: freedom of criticism. You don't progress by laughing, allowing, and conforming to status quos, cliches, traditions, and stereotypes. You progress by challenging them. And if we really want to get sociological about this, it also showed another long running trend: minorities are much more willing to buy, watch, and read material were they aren't the target audience than the other way around (unless said material plays into negative stereotypes ie: gangster rap and interracial adult films). They've been indoctrinated to do just that.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Mar 13, 2012 21:16:29 GMT -5
Warrior's debut promo in WCW I honestly don't know why but it really pissed Hogan off (Every man and his Dog knew Warrior had beaten Hogan in 1990). The thing that I've never understood is this: When Roddy Piper debuted for WCW, he cut a promo saying that he was one of the few guys who Hogan was never able to defeat. It was generally regarded as a great promo by all involved. When Warrior debuted for WCW, he cut a promo saying that he was one of the few guys who Hogan was never able to defeat. The people involved (Hogan, Bischoff, and WWE) act as though it's one of the biggest blunders in wrestling promo history. Am I missing something here? the problem was Warrior said beating Hogan was easy. If it was easy there'd be no drama, so why would people buy it? he should have followed up with a claim he'd prove how easy it was, making like he realized people might question that claim
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Post by rapidfire187 on Mar 13, 2012 21:45:11 GMT -5
This is the irony: the Memphis audience was heavily african-american, and everybody knew. They seemed to enjoy it as much as white viewers did. At least, they never stopped attending matches or watching TV. I'll say it again: we were less ready to pounce on any percieved insult than we are today. And I'm not sure that's really progress. The true elimination of racism will be when we all laugh at any racial stereotype. I'm sorry, but that doesn't excuse a thing. For instance, some women buy into, perpetuate, believe, and even preach misogynistic crap. Doesn't change that that stuff is detrimental to women in general. If anything, the fact that people are pouncing on perceived insults and terrible depictions shows an advancement of freedom of speech: freedom of criticism. You don't progress by laughing, allowing, and conforming to status quos, cliches, traditions, and stereotypes. You progress by challenging them. And if we really want to get sociological about this, it also showed another long running trend: minorities are much more willing to buy, watch, and read material were they aren't the target audience than the other way around (unless said material plays into negative stereotypes ie: gangster rap and interracial adult films). They've been indoctrinated to do just that. Are you a minority? If not, it's pretty obnoxious to speak for them.
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kidkamikaze10
Dennis Stamp
Trying to think of a new avatar
Posts: 4,324
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Mar 13, 2012 22:28:22 GMT -5
I'm sorry, but that doesn't excuse a thing. For instance, some women buy into, perpetuate, believe, and even preach misogynistic crap. Doesn't change that that stuff is detrimental to women in general. If anything, the fact that people are pouncing on perceived insults and terrible depictions shows an advancement of freedom of speech: freedom of criticism. You don't progress by laughing, allowing, and conforming to status quos, cliches, traditions, and stereotypes. You progress by challenging them. And if we really want to get sociological about this, it also showed another long running trend: minorities are much more willing to buy, watch, and read material where they aren't the target audience than the other way around (unless said material plays into negative stereotypes ie: gangster rap and interracial adult films). They've been indoctrinated to do just that. Are you a minority? If not, it's pretty obnoxious to speak for them. Yup. Nigerian American. Even if I wasn't, I'm not speaking "for" anyone. I'm just talking about stuff I've researched. If this is turning into a "what if some of them are cool with it" thing, then again, that's just anecdotal, and doesn't really refute anything I said. Just because it doesn't harm some individuals (visually/consciously), doesn't mean it doesn't have some short or long term negative affects within society. So back to wrestling, I'd rather see more awareness (as in, if some offensive material is shown, have it be for legit storyline reasons and openly acknowledged for what it is, in story or out), than having to stomach bigoted junk for the appeasement of the target audience, whoever that may be. IE: Briscoes using homophobic slurs towards the Young Bucks or Chikara is fine because it fits the characters. As long as the storyline doesn't deem them right for saying said bigoted stuff.
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Post by Andrew is Good on Mar 13, 2012 22:58:05 GMT -5
Are you a minority? If not, it's pretty obnoxious to speak for them. Yup. Nigerian American. Even if I wasn't, I'm not speaking "for" anyone. I'm just talking about stuff I've researched. If this is turning into a "what if some of them are cool with it" thing, then again, that's just anecdotal, and doesn't really refute anything I said. Just because it doesn't harm some individuals (visually/consciously), doesn't mean it doesn't have some short or long term negative affects within society. So back to wrestling, I'd rather see more awareness (as in, if some offensive material is shown, have it be for legit storyline reasons and openly acknowledged for what it is, in story or out), than having to stomach bigoted junk for the appeasement of the target audience, whoever that may be. IE: Briscoes using homophobic slurs towards the Young Bucks or Chikara is fine because it fits the characters. As long as the storyline doesn't deem them right for saying said bigoted stuff. In regards to the Briscoes and it fitting their characters, aren't they baby faces? And with a lot of the racist wrestlers, they were all heels it seems. Racist seemed to be a quality associated with a lot of heels, some who ran with it like Piper, and others who fell on their face like Valentine. But, yeah, aren't the Briscoes baby faces? At least in ROH anyway.
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kidkamikaze10
Dennis Stamp
Trying to think of a new avatar
Posts: 4,324
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Mar 13, 2012 23:08:52 GMT -5
Yup. Nigerian American. Even if I wasn't, I'm not speaking "for" anyone. I'm just talking about stuff I've researched. If this is turning into a "what if some of them are cool with it" thing, then again, that's just anecdotal, and doesn't really refute anything I said. Just because it doesn't harm some individuals (visually/consciously), doesn't mean it doesn't have some short or long term negative affects within society. So back to wrestling, I'd rather see more awareness (as in, if some offensive material is shown, have it be for legit storyline reasons and openly acknowledged for what it is, in story or out), than having to stomach bigoted junk for the appeasement of the target audience, whoever that may be. IE: Briscoes using homophobic slurs towards the Young Bucks or Chikara is fine because it fits the characters. As long as the storyline doesn't deem them right for saying said bigoted stuff. In regards to the Briscoes and it fitting their characters, aren't they baby faces? And with a lot of the racist wrestlers, they were all heels it seems. Racist seemed to be a quality associated with a lot of heels, some who ran with it like Piper, and others who fell on their face like Valentine. But, yeah, aren't the Briscoes baby faces? At least in ROH anyway. Briscoes have been flip flopping as of late. They weren't acting very face like against the guys of Chikara, but yeah, they are supposed to be. Even then, I still think it'd be in character for them to say stuff like that. I'd just want them to pay for it via a beatdown or losing, acknowledging their opponents as a legit threat, and then moving on to either winning or losing the feud.
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Post by Danimal on Mar 15, 2012 0:17:13 GMT -5
Hell, didn't WWE themselves temporarily re-name the Molly Go Round the "Junk in the Trunk"? yeah they did. apparently they didnt understand that having Junk in the Trunk is a good thing. Bad part about that angle is that not only is a female being chastised just for not looking just like the others but it's a face doing the chastising. Having Trish basically being a prototypical bully makes a poor statement. At least in the "Piggie James" angle Mickie was the face and her critics were the heels.
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Post by Dr. Bunsen Honeydew on Mar 16, 2012 13:43:17 GMT -5
Now see, I didn't have a problem with it because Lawler was involved. It most likely was his idea right out of his Memphis playbook. To get offended by that when Lawler has done far worse in the past boggles my mind. That reminds me of a good one: Lawler once attacked Jake Roberts, a recovering alcoholic, and poured whiskey down his throat. On Roberts' DVD, he confirmed that it was, in fact, real whiskey instead of a smarter substitute. Case in point...
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