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Post by fizzeewater on Oct 14, 2011 10:29:54 GMT -5
Booked against HHH was who was booked to be a victim and ultimate babyface.
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Post by moneyman20 on Oct 14, 2011 10:31:03 GMT -5
Sounds about right. I would also add "Motives becoming unclear as the storyline progressed".
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W?Y
Hank Scorpio
Old FAN, no tricks.
Posts: 5,532
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Post by W?Y on Oct 14, 2011 10:32:47 GMT -5
I love CM Punk, but point number 2 is so funny because it's kinda true.
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Post by flatsdomino on Oct 14, 2011 10:40:45 GMT -5
Sounds about right. I would also add "Motives becoming unclear as the storyline progressed". This is the biggest reason, to me. He had an objective, and fans were behind it like crazy. There was a story being built there, and people were into it. They were behind HIM because he's a phenomenal in-ring talent and on the mic as well. However, they lost the plot as far as fans wanting to see him succeed in his quest for "change" and to "make this fun again". What is his motive now? Much like the Nexus' "bigger picture", the story's fallen apart. And I'll say this - and I don't care who yells "HHHater" over it - but they shoved Punk's whole motivation aside so they could essentially make the story about Triple H. Round of applause for the WWE, everyone.
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bigbadbull
Don Corleone
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Post by bigbadbull on Oct 14, 2011 10:48:23 GMT -5
Sounds about right. I would also add "Motives becoming unclear as the storyline progressed". This is the biggest reason, to me. He had an objective, and fans were behind it like crazy. There was a story being built there, and people were into it. They were behind HIM because he's a phenomenal in-ring talent and on the mic as well. However, they lost the plot as far as fans wanting to see him succeed in his quest for "change" and to "make this fun again". What is his motive now? Much like the Nexus' "bigger picture", the story's fallen apart. And I'll say this - and I don't care who yells "HHHater" over it - but they shoved Punk's whole motivation aside so they could essentially make the story about Triple H. Round of applause for the WWE, everyone. That's the whole truth. It's all about HHH right now.
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Post by rnrk supports BLM on Oct 14, 2011 10:52:07 GMT -5
Sounds about right. I would also add "Motives becoming unclear as the storyline progressed". That's definitely part of it. They've been booking him to get over as an anti-authority rebel without actually making the authority figure he's rebelling against look all that bad, so he just comes across as an entitled jackass. Maybe Johnny Ace will make a better foil for Punk than Triple H did.
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Post by mystikz on Oct 14, 2011 11:06:51 GMT -5
the definitely killed his momentum. his promos became less edgey. now he's buddy buddy with the guy who he was against. he's not much of a rebel anymore. him teaming with HHH borders on sell out territory. this whole thing went completely down hill when HHH forced the focus to himself.
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El Hijo De Slapnuts
Samurai Cop
Really waiting for Minoru Suzuki to face off with a live gator.....
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Post by El Hijo De Slapnuts on Oct 14, 2011 11:12:28 GMT -5
I can see it,they shot Punk in the foot and gave Triple H a head start of a mile and told them to race.
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Post by turkeysandwich on Oct 14, 2011 11:27:17 GMT -5
Has Punk's heat decreased? It seems he's even more over with the WWEUniverse than ever, he was getting boos from the Cena fans and now it's pretty much 100% cheers. It's just amongst the IWC, which seems to turn on anyone once they become main eventers.
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Post by primetime110 on Oct 14, 2011 11:30:11 GMT -5
His whining every week reminded of when Joe won the TNA title and for some odd reason came out whining every week. He wanted change but never really said what kind of change he wanted. I loved when HHH pointed that out during the contract signing. IMO HHH owned him during the contract signing saying punk was only out for punk and gave his reasons.
Plus when he kept talking about ice cream bars and the fake vomit promo with HHH and Nash it was hard to take him serious and he became "cena like" on the mic.
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Post by angryfan on Oct 14, 2011 11:37:52 GMT -5
Has Punk's heat decreased? It seems he's even more over with the WWEUniverse than ever, he was getting boos from the Cena fans and now it's pretty much 100% cheers. It's just amongst the IWC, which seems to turn on anyone once they become main eventers. Wow, blanket statement there at the end, and a little bit of a low blow if you ask me. Let's avoid those, please. Has his heat decreasd with "smarks"? Sure, but it's understandable. You can't take someone, have them go from uberheel (which he was) to "break the fourth wall, loose cannon" babyface then Pearl Harbor them and not expect some portion of the audience to go "hey, wait a damn minute here". His character HAS been changed, and he is not the focus like he was initially. Thus, when you move someone from edgy focal point to more typical babyface backup singer those who preferred the former will be more apt to voice their displeasure.
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Post by Monster Under Your Bed on Oct 14, 2011 11:46:37 GMT -5
I feel that it's because they took everything that made him a face, specifically his rebelliousness, and made him just another smiley, get-along-with-everyone face.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
Celestial Princess in Exile.
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Oct 14, 2011 11:51:15 GMT -5
Has Punk's heat decreased? It seems he's even more over with the WWEUniverse than ever, he was getting boos from the Cena fans and now it's pretty much 100% cheers. It's just amongst the IWC, which seems to turn on anyone once they become main eventers. There's the key word. "WWE Universe". People wanted to convince themselves that while he was under his first contract, even after he'd been there for 5 years, that was was still somehow an "outsider", not actually part of WWE, but the "guy from the indies" "taking down" WWE. Him re-upping, plus the face turn, now he's a "system" guy. He's not "indie" anymore. He's fully integrated into WWE, and it's become impossible to argue that he's not.
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Arrow
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Arrow on Oct 14, 2011 11:55:23 GMT -5
For me, it was mostly the second option. Annoying whiner without a clear motive or foil who spent more time taking unnecessary shots at the sympathetic COO than saying anything of real interest. I think he would have done a lot better with a definitive heel to play off of.
I wouldn't really say his heat has decreased, though.
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PKO
King Koopa
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Post by PKO on Oct 14, 2011 12:00:23 GMT -5
Has Punk's heat decreased? It seems he's even more over with the WWEUniverse than ever, he was getting boos from the Cena fans and now it's pretty much 100% cheers. It's just amongst the IWC, which seems to turn on anyone once they become main eventers. Thats what I was thinking. I mean, they're all good points but Punk seems to be getting better reactions from crowds than he ever has, so "heat decrease" doesn't really seem to be what we're talking about. More like why why parts of the IWC (which I don't use as an insult) are not as high on him as they once were.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2011 12:03:51 GMT -5
Has Punk's heat decreased? It seems he's even more over with the WWEUniverse than ever, he was getting boos from the Cena fans and now it's pretty much 100% cheers. It's just amongst the IWC, which seems to turn on anyone once they become main eventers. There's the key word. "WWE Universe". People wanted to convince themselves that while he was under his first contract, even after he'd been there for 5 years, that was was still somehow an "outsider", not actually part of WWE, but the "guy from the indies" "taking down" WWE. Him re-upping, plus the face turn, now he's a "system" guy. He's not "indie" anymore. He's fully integrated into WWE, and it's become impossible to argue that he's not. His face turn has nothing to do with it to me, the fact his promos became cringeworthy and his aims as a character became very flawed and frustrating, that's what made me and quite a few others go "wait, this is crap? How does this make sense?" His face turn was in the works, we knew that, but the way the storyline has progressed since August has made him look like a joke, him losing the title? Okay, got Del Rio over for being a bastard, him ignoring the title in favour of facing Triple H in a losing contest only to prove he knew his whole antics were for nothing and saying "Okay, I blamed you for everything, I was an arsehole with no reason to do it," makes him look like an absolute idiot as a character. It's frustrating, going from a character sort of shooting with true stuff to becoming a mindless conspiracy theorist with no fact behind what he says? He's not R-Truth so obviously that doesn't work. Basically him as a wrestler = fine, his character/this storyline just died on its arse in regards to him 6 weeks back.
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Post by Johnny Truant on Oct 14, 2011 12:05:45 GMT -5
"2) His character becoming an annoying whiner who panders to the "tumblr meme community" with his antics."
hilariously true
except I don't hate CM Punk with a passion like I do Tumblr
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Post by angryfan on Oct 14, 2011 12:25:38 GMT -5
I'll be honest, thinking about it, I see Punk/Cena parallels here. Cena got pushed as a face out the gate, but it was a generic midcard face, then he went heel with the rapper gimmick and went from over heel to being face in the eyes of the fans. Then the switch to RAW and his character was changed from edgy to more family friendly, and the push to the moon really took off.
Punk...well, he was a "addicted to competition" generic midcard face who turned heel as the cult leader, who then became a face when he really started speaking his mind. Now he's a face, so he's been changed to a more family friendly, goofier character to broaden appeal.
It's their formula "this worked, so now that we've got somone at the level we want, we can tweak it and it'll be ok".
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2011 12:33:07 GMT -5
His heat hasn’t decreased.
Go back and watch his July-August segments with Cena and HHH. He was getting a lot of boos mixed in with cheers and coming across as whiny. Especially when he was talking about “what the fans want.“ Ever since he stopped with the cute little insider references the boos have disappeared and he usually gets cheered by even the kids/woman in the audience.
He’s a top babyface now. Some things had to change.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
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Post by Bo Rida on Oct 14, 2011 13:12:26 GMT -5
He might get more cheers but his general presence (is that the right word?) has changed, at one point you expected to see something memorable every time he appeared and that everybody in the arena was hanging on his every word.
Of course that links back to the other points of overexposure, lack of focus, questionable motivation, law of diminishing returns etc.
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