Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2011 16:20:39 GMT -5
Taker did lose clean as a whistle to both The Great Khali and Vladimir Kozlov when both were first being pushed. I don’t think fans really wanted to see those guys in the main event though so they didn’t really work out. That’s not really Taker’s fault though.
And Triple H absolutely played a huge role in Jeff Hardy’s rise to true main event status. Survivor Series 2007 when he was the sole survivor alongside HHH was the beginning of Hardy moving beyond the mid card. Then the following month at Armageddon his win over HHH was by far the biggest win of his career to that point. He was made to look amazing in the Elimination Chamber a couple months later, kicking out of the Pedigree and at one point, kicking both HHH and HBK’s ass at the same time. By the time their series of matches over the WWE title later in the year took place, especially the No Mercy one, there was no doubt that Hardy had arrived.
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Dec 21, 2011 16:21:14 GMT -5
In response to the "guys who made others" thread, this got me thinking about times that clearly WWE tries to use one guy to make someone else, but it doesn't work. The first example that came to mind for me, was WWE trying to use John Cena to "make" Miz, culminating in Miz's WM victory. Problem is, Cena didn't seem too interested in the feud, and didn't really do much to help the Average Miz look like any more of a threat in the ring than he ever has. (For his part, Miz never really figured out how to adapt to Cena's style and mesh with it, either.) What are some other examples where WWE intends to make someone, but for whatever reason, the guy whose back WWE wants to make someone on doesn't hold up their end? I'm kind of on the fence on whether Cena made Miz. In a way he did. Although Miz inevitably lost the feud, it was beneficial to others. Miz's loss to Cena led to Miz bringing Alex Riley up from the lowest guy on the totem pole, to a decent midcarder who can believably beat any main eventer on any given day of the week (credibilty that he never lost in spite of lack of TV time). Riley's victories over the Miz were then one of the factors that led to Miz's storyline frustration and the eventual Awesome Truth pairing, which helped make Truth a bonafide main event threat.
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Sajoa Moe
Patti Mayonnaise
Did you get that thing I sent ya?
A man without gimmick.
Posts: 39,683
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Post by Sajoa Moe on Dec 21, 2011 16:24:01 GMT -5
More of a mentor/protege type of failure rather than opponents, but Gunner Scott failed completely as a Benoit clone.
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agent817
Fry's dog Seymour
Doesn't Know Whose Ring It Is
Posts: 21,168
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Post by agent817 on Dec 21, 2011 16:38:49 GMT -5
They attempted to use 'Taker to put over Great Khali, even letting him get a clean win over him, but Khali sucks, so that didn't work out. And I believe that they were going to use him to put over Mr. Kennedy, but he got injured. And I also believe that they were going to put over Muhammad Hassan by having him beat 'Taker at the Great American Bash '04, but then that whole mess happened. Actually, that was at GAB 05.
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Post by crimsonwolf on Dec 21, 2011 17:24:57 GMT -5
They attempted to use 'Taker to put over Great Khali, even letting him get a clean win over him, but Khali sucks, so that didn't work out. And I believe that they were going to use him to put over Mr. Kennedy, but he got injured. And I also believe that they were going to put over Muhammad Hassan by having him beat 'Taker at the Great American Bash '04, but then that whole mess happened. Actually, that was at GAB 05. And Taker wanted Orton to break the streak at WM21, but it was Orton who backed out of it.
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Post by Cvslfc123 on Dec 21, 2011 17:38:34 GMT -5
you could make a case for Hulk Hogan and The Rock, seeing as The Rock stopped wrestling full time shortly after.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on Dec 21, 2011 17:58:56 GMT -5
I wouldn't say Cena didn't make Barrett, but Orton was the reason Barrett didn't make it considering the two had no chemistry together and it looked like WWE didn't want to have Barrett be a top star while putting on such shitty matches in the main event. Cena vs Barrett matches were good though and the feud was still interesting, but with Orton involved, it went to the shitters.
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sbia
AC Slater
Posts: 127
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Post by sbia on Dec 21, 2011 18:07:00 GMT -5
you could make a case for Hulk Hogan and The Rock, seeing as The Rock stopped wrestling full time shortly after. Uh...no Rock was well established in 2002 before he beat Hogan.In 1999/2000 he was one of the most popular wrestlers ever and a top draw. That match with Hogan gave him a memorable and victorious Mania moment because he lost 3 straight Wrestlemania's before that but it didn't "make" him. If anything WM 18 re-launched Hogan back into the spotlight.It wasn't a "passing of the torch" match.Just like Rock/Cena isn't.
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Post by wrestling4ever on Dec 21, 2011 18:13:23 GMT -5
you could make a case for Hulk Hogan and The Rock, seeing as The Rock stopped wrestling full time shortly after. Uh...no Rock was well established in 2002 before he beat Hogan.In 1999/2000 he was one of the the most popular wrestlers ever and a top draw. That match with Hogan gave him a memorable and victorious Mania moment because he lost 3 straight Wrestlemania's before that but it didn't "make" him. If anything WM 18 re-launched Hogan back into the spotlight.It wasn't a "passing of the torch" match.Just like Rock/Cena isn't. Yep. And god I hate that term. One of the worst wrestling cliches ever IMO.
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BHB
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,778
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Post by BHB on Dec 21, 2011 19:07:04 GMT -5
Cena.
His selling/psychology/character just isn't good enough to make anyone seem like a threat to him and therefore his equal.
How many times has a new young guy (or group) viciously attacked Cena (often more than once) only for Cena to come out the next week and act like it was nothing?
How many times has Cena taken an absolute beating in a match only to make an unrealistic comeback, undermining anything his opponent had done to him?
Cena is unable to make the audience care about his opponents which is essential to establish them as stars. As over as Cena is, the lack of this essential skill stops him from being effective as a top guy IMO.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 27,959
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Post by chazraps on Dec 21, 2011 19:09:09 GMT -5
They attempted to use 'Taker to put over Great Khali, even letting him get a clean win over him, but Khali sucks, so that didn't work out. And I believe that they were going to use him to put over Mr. Kennedy, but he got injured. Actually, I think you could make a case for Kennedy becoming an *it* guy from his 3-month series with Taker in 2006, leading to him challenging for the title at the Rumble and then winning Money in the Bank. I wasn't watching at the time, but from what I've read and seeing the clips on YouTube it sure seems like that's what made him hot again after injury.
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Arrow
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,122
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Post by Arrow on Dec 21, 2011 19:32:35 GMT -5
They attempted to use 'Taker to put over Great Khali, even letting him get a clean win over him, but Khali sucks, so that didn't work out. And I believe that they were going to use him to put over Mr. Kennedy, but he got injured. Actually, I think you could make a case for Kennedy becoming an *it* guy from his 3-month series with Taker in 2006, leading to him challenging for the title at the Rumble and then winning Money in the Bank. I wasn't watching at the time, but from what I've read and seeing the clips on YouTube it sure seems like that's what made him hot again after injury. True. I'd forgotten about that feud. And who says 'Taker doesn't put anyone over? I guess what I was thinking about more was that he was supposed to be the one who cashed in on Undertaker in 2007 instead of Edge.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,850
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Post by Dub H on Dec 21, 2011 19:36:22 GMT -5
I think they tried to use Nexus and Ziggler AND Ryder to put over Mason Ryan...and failed
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Post by Zaq "That Guy" Buzzkill on Dec 21, 2011 19:37:45 GMT -5
Cena. His selling/psychology/character just isn't good enough to make anyone seem like a threat to him and therefore his equal. How many times has a new young guy (or group) viciously attacked Cena (often more than once) only for Cena to come out the next week and act like it was nothing? How many times has Cena taken an absolute beating in a match only to make an unrealistic comeback, undermining anything his opponent had done to him? Cena is unable to make the audience care about his opponents which is essential to establish them as stars. As over as Cena is, the lack of this essential skill stops him from being effective as a top guy IMO. He put Edge over huge with their matches together, and that whole feud cemented Edge in the Main even for the rest of his career.
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Arrow
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,122
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Post by Arrow on Dec 21, 2011 19:39:41 GMT -5
Cena. His selling/psychology/character just isn't good enough to make anyone seem like a threat to him and therefore his equal. How many times has a new young guy (or group) viciously attacked Cena (often more than once) only for Cena to come out the next week and act like it was nothing? How many times has Cena taken an absolute beating in a match only to make an unrealistic comeback, undermining anything his opponent had done to him? Cena is unable to make the audience care about his opponents which is essential to establish them as stars. As over as Cena is, the lack of this essential skill stops him from being effective as a top guy IMO. He put Edge over huge with their matches together, and that whole feud cemented Edge in the Main even for the rest of his career. He also put CM Punk over big this summer.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Dec 21, 2011 19:47:45 GMT -5
Taker's sort of immune because WWE had never really made it look like they planned to have Taker put over a midcarder/upper-midcarder in the first place. HHH not putting over Booker doesn't really count either, because even though the plan was to make Booker at WM, the backpedaling was mostly Goldberg's fault (and not HHH's), apparently. HHH, for all his burying, is usually pretty good about putting people over when he deems them fit. He was a strong advocate for Benoit, loved the idea of having Batista (friend or otherwise) go over him, was willing to put over Cena, and of course, orchestrated the cultivation of Jeff Harvey. He put over Shelton in 2004. Shelton's first night on Raw, and he beats Triple H. The following week with all of Evolution at ringside, and having roles as officials, he beat Trips again. Shelton's injury stopped his momentum. Trips and HBK also made Cody and Ted, but creative did f*** all with them after the feud.
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Post by Citizen Snips Has Left on Dec 21, 2011 20:28:22 GMT -5
Neither Cena or Triple H made Sheamus in their feuds with him. Possibly did him more harm than good.
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Dec 21, 2011 20:33:09 GMT -5
To be fair, in a lot of these examples, it wasn't necessarily the opponent that failed to make someone, it was a horribly booked feud that failed to make them.
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Post by Starshine on Dec 21, 2011 20:58:24 GMT -5
I always felt that Orton always came out looking worse whenever he was feuding with Triple H.
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Post by themagnificentmoo on Dec 21, 2011 21:13:10 GMT -5
I can't remember exactly but I think Mick Foley once mentioned that he tried his best to but failed to help bring Val Venis to that next level.
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