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King Koopa
He's just a Sexy Kurt
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Post by 67 more on Dec 22, 2011 13:11:27 GMT -5
I once won a fight with a Diamond Cutter. True story.
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 22, 2011 13:15:15 GMT -5
Answering criticisms of my list. First of all, I suppose I should have included the idea that the current gen of moves are seemingly safer, and less likely to be copied at home in a damaging way. I think one reason you don't see so many powerbombs these days is because they're extremely easy to do by pretty much anybody, yet are also very easy to hurt someone with. Diamond Cutter and RKO are not the same move. DDP uses both arms in a cravate hold. If you were to grab somebody in the same way that ddp does and then try to pull them to the ground they'd probably follow you. Orton uses one arm and would likely fall and bust his ass if he tried it on somebody in real life. Big Show's knockout punch is just a punch. The special part of the move is that it's the big show doing it. Not everybody is 7' tall, 500 lbs. If a 14 year old kid tries to punch the other one in the face it's likely to get dodged, blocked, etc. And if he does land it's not going to put him in the hospital. Sweet Chin Music however hits a particularly vulnerable part of your body and will easily crush your teeth. It happened to me when I was about 17 and I still have completely chipped and sharp teeth all along the left side of my mouth. The LeBelle Lock, Cross Arm Breaker, etc are moves that are easy to control. You're really only going to hurt somebody if you do it very intentionally. The sharpshooter/walls of jericho or any move that puts pressure on the back is a very easy move to overextend on and hurt somebody very quickly. F5 vs Wasteland/Attitude Adjuster is a legit comparison. However, in my mind I always see Brock doing that move outside the ring and slamming the guys side into the ring post. The Stone Cold Stunner looks like a rather easy way to either bust your own ass pretty badly by jumping up and falling straight on your own tailbone, or to crush someone's throat against your shoulder. It's not really any kind of actual useable move in any real life situation. It's very much a "pro wrestling" move and, again, something for teenagers to screw up. If you tried the diamond cutter on someone in real life, they'd be able to just keep standing unless you caught them off guard, and that's no different from the RKO, frankly. Even if we were to accept that as a vital difference, the person taking the moves has the same impact either way. Yeah, the advantage of the Knockout Punch is that it's the Big Show doing it... so what? That's what makes it likely to knock someone out. Not everyone is the size where a Big Boot would be a killer move either. Not everyone is nearly big enough to be able to do a chokeslam. The Torture Rack requires someone at least the build of Luger to every be able to do. You're not going to see a kid ever pull of a torture rack against another kid his same age. A person's size is what makes those moves look good, the punch should be treated no differently. I do agree about the SCM being legit, though. Having been in martial arts for long enough, I don't understand why the cross arm breaker or LaBelle lock being controllable is a bad thing, exactly. Submissions are supposed to be controllable, they're technical moves. Fact is, Cross Arm Breaker is a real move, one that makes people tap out in real martial arts. There's no reason why it's less believable than the overly contrived and ridiculous torture rack. The F5 can be done into a ring post, sure. You can also do the AA off the turnbuckle onto the ground. Or onto a car or metal grates. The stunner is very much a wrestling move, but again, the entire list is that way save a few examples (Punch, kick, Cross Arm breaker). You will never see a Torture Rack outside of a wrestling ring unless it's people screwing around and doing wrestling moves on either other. You'll never see an F5 or an AA or Chokeslam or a Rock Bottom either.
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Magnus the Magnificent
King Koopa
didn't want one.
I could write a book about what you don't know!
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Post by Magnus the Magnificent on Dec 22, 2011 14:29:54 GMT -5
Attitude Adjustement/Wasteland
Have you ever slipped and fallen on your ass/lower back from a standing position? Remember how much it hurt? And knocked the wind out of you? Now imagine a 240+ lbs man dropping you from 6 feet to a hard surface, AFTER you've been in a match.
Semms pretty legit and believable that it would lead to a three-count.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2011 14:38:06 GMT -5
Attitude Adjustement/Wasteland Have you ever slipped and fallen on your ass/lower back from a standing position? Remember how much it hurt? And knocked the wind out of you? Now imagine a 240+ lbs man dropping you from 6 feet to a hard surface, AFTER you've been in a match. Semms pretty legit and believable that it would lead to a three-count. The problem isn't that the moves necessarily look weak, but that we see them take other similar moves that presumably have similar impact. For example what you mentioned above also applies to a standard body slam.
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Post by Old Jack Burton on Dec 22, 2011 14:42:10 GMT -5
Tortue Rack is pretty useless as a combat move. I put it on there due to it being pretty easy to mess up and cause yourself and the other guy to get hurt. It's just awkward as hell to execute. It definitely can be done by one teenager to another, usually ending in one person falling on their neck.
The chokeslam is in the list of dangerous moves because it's something that if you tried to do it you'd end up grabbing the other guys throat and trying to pick him up by it. Pretty easy to grip too hard and hurt someone there too.
And again, the cross arm breaker and lebelle lock are moves that are easy to see what you're doing the opponent, and the opponent will end up with a broken arm if you apply too much pressure. Sharpshooter/boston crab is a move that in wrestling usually is appears to be put on and Bret/Jericho look like they're just going all out. If somebody at home grabbed his friend a then cranked full force he could very easily go too far in a matter of seconds and give someone a severe back injury.
I'm not disputing that armbars are not useful MMA moves. There's a reason you see a million variations of them in the UFC, and exactly 0 sharpshooters. My list is about which moves the WWE has chosen to phase out for one reason or another, the biggest being the copycats at home.
Torture rack is probably not a good example though. I was just thinking of big 90s moves off the top of my head.
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