Embracing Albert chants saving the Tensai gimmick?

[Magic knows Black Lives Matter]

Dec 22, 2012 19:05:14 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Dec 22, 2012 18:03:57 GMT -5 Allie Kitsune said:

I don't see this at all. WWE never claimed that he was Japanese. Ever.

Why the Charlie Chan beard and the kanji paint? So what else was he supposed to be, "American Guy who cosplays as Japanese Guy?"

...Actually yeah, I think that was what he was supposed to be.

[Allie Kitsune]

Dec 22, 2012 19:05:14 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Dec 22, 2012 18:03:57 GMT -5 Allie Kitsune said:

I don't see this at all. WWE never claimed that he was Japanese. Ever.

Why the Charlie Chan beard and the kanji paint? So what else was he supposed to be, "American Guy who cosplays as Japanese Guy?"

Matt Bloom has pretty much always had the same crappy facial hair wherever he's gone.

When he first came back, WWE even said he was a former WWE Superstar who had gone over to compete in Japan, not that he was a new guy who really is Japanese.

[Deleted]

Dec 22, 2012 19:06:28 GMT -5 Magic knows Black Lives Matter said:

Dec 22, 2012 19:05:14 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Why the Charlie Chan beard and the kanji paint? So what else was he supposed to be, "American Guy who cosplays as Japanese Guy?"

...Actually yeah, I think that was what he was supposed to be.

If they actually thought that was going to work, then I have no words.

[Allie Kitsune]

Dec 22, 2012 19:10:35 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Dec 22, 2012 19:06:28 GMT -5 Magic knows Black Lives Matter said:

...Actually yeah, I think that was what he was supposed to be.

If they actually thought that was going to work, then I have no words.

I dunno. If they had renamed his old Mist Choke finisher "The Weeaboo", it might have.

[Deleted]

Dec 22, 2012 19:14:41 GMT -5 Allie Kitsune said:

Dec 22, 2012 19:10:35 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

If they actually thought that was going to work, then I have no words.

I dunno. If they had renamed his old Mist Choke finisher "The Weeaboo", it might have.

An Otaku or Weeaboo character would do miles wiht the internet crowd, but the twitter zombies and the live crowds would be confused beyond belief.

[EvenBaldobombHasAJob]

Dec 22, 2012 18:13:57 GMT -5 Magician under the moonlight said:

Dec 22, 2012 18:08:34 GMT -5 The Man That Sanity Forgot said:

Still don't know why they didn't just use the Giant Bernard gimmick with a different name. Instead of this whole Tensai thing.

WWE rule: if they did not create it, it's unnaceptable.

to be fair since CM Punk and Daniel Bryan were both runaway successes they've moved away from that line of thinking.

[crowwreak was WRONG]

Isn't that Kanji on his face actually a tattoo?

[mrjl]

Dec 22, 2012 18:06:46 GMT -5 mrtuesday said:

Dec 22, 2012 18:03:57 GMT -5 Allie Kitsune said:

I don't see this at all. WWE never claimed that he was Japanese. Ever.

He spoke primarily in Japanese for the first few months of the gimmick. That has to go for something.

it means that he found success in Japan and embraced the country.

You know how Chavo tried to become Kerwin White? He wasn't a fake white guy, he was embracing white "culture" Tensai was the reverse of the situation

the fact people can't even get that is why the call for supposedly deeper characterization is ridiculous

[mrjl]

Dec 22, 2012 19:05:14 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Dec 22, 2012 18:03:57 GMT -5 Allie Kitsune said:

I don't see this at all. WWE never claimed that he was Japanese. Ever.

Why the Charlie Chan beard and the kanji paint? So what else was he supposed to be, "American Guy who cosplays as Japanese Guy?"

cosplaying is not claiming. It's dressing up. Or do all the people who wear Jedi robes or dress up as a superhero think they're really those people?

[Johnny B. Decent]

Dec 23, 2012 9:35:42 GMT -5 crowwreak was WRONG said:

Isn't that Kanji on his face actually a tattoo?

No.

[Deleted]

Dec 23, 2012 9:43:57 GMT -5 mrjl said:

Dec 22, 2012 18:06:46 GMT -5 mrtuesday said:

He spoke primarily in Japanese for the first few months of the gimmick. That has to go for something.

it means that he found success in Japan and embraced the country.

You know how Chavo tried to become Kerwin White? He wasn't a fake white guy, he was embracing white "culture" Tensai was the reverse of the situation

the fact people can't even get that is why the call for supposedly deeper characterization is ridiculous

Spot on.
They explained the character in his debut, yet everyone seems confused as to what he is. He was a man that honed his craft overseas and adopted the culture of the people that embraced him. It's not that confusing.

[Deleted]

Dec 23, 2012 9:46:13 GMT -5 mrjl said:

Dec 22, 2012 19:05:14 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Why the Charlie Chan beard and the kanji paint? So what else was he supposed to be, "American Guy who cosplays as Japanese Guy?"

cosplaying is not claiming. It's dressing up. Or do all the people who wear Jedi robes or dress up as a superhero think they're really those people?

I think you misunderstood me.

The "claiming" is the yellowface and the Japanese-acting.

The "cosplaying" is me saying that if he isn't claiming to be Japanese, then is his gimmick supposed to be that he's an American guy who dresses up as a Japanese guy?

[mrjl]

Dec 23, 2012 10:12:50 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Dec 23, 2012 9:46:13 GMT -5 mrjl said:

cosplaying is not claiming. It's dressing up. Or do all the people who wear Jedi robes or dress up as a superhero think they're really those people?

I think you misunderstood me.

The "claiming" is the yellowface and the Japanese-acting.

The "cosplaying" is me saying that if he isn't claiming to be Japanese, then is his gimmick supposed to be that he's an American guy who dresses up as a Japanese guy?

yes, pretty much. Even closer would be declaring him a white guy who just really, really likes Japan.

I think when Ace was there they should have used the fact he was also pretty popular in Japan and have them talking about stuff there. Is this restaurant still there, and things like that.

[Deleted]

Dec 23, 2012 11:04:18 GMT -5 mrjl said:

Dec 23, 2012 10:12:50 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

I think you misunderstood me.

The "claiming" is the yellowface and the Japanese-acting.

The "cosplaying" is me saying that if he isn't claiming to be Japanese, then is his gimmick supposed to be that he's an American guy who dresses up as a Japanese guy?

yes, pretty much. Even closer would be declaring him a white guy who just really, really likes Japan.

I think when Ace was there they should have used the fact he was also pretty popular in Japan and have them talking about stuff there. Is this restaurant still there, and things like that.

I don't know how well it would've done with casual fans who know basically nothing about Japan. Almost any kind of foreign heel is bound to fail, worse is that they announced him "From Japan." I mean, Japan is one of the most populous countries on Earth and has numerous large cities, and they couldn't even have gone with a stock location like Osaka or a cultural one like Nara, but they just say "Yeah he's from JAPAN. BOO HIM."

Playing up not being American is such an outated way to draw heat. Fact is, most Americans right now either aren't jingoists and don't really care that someone else is foreign, regardless of background.

[mrjl]

Dec 23, 2012 11:14:22 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Dec 23, 2012 11:04:18 GMT -5 mrjl said:

yes, pretty much. Even closer would be declaring him a white guy who just really, really likes Japan.

I think when Ace was there they should have used the fact he was also pretty popular in Japan and have them talking about stuff there. Is this restaurant still there, and things like that.

I don't know how well it would've done with casual fans who know basically nothing about Japan. Almost any kind of foreign heel is bound to fail, worse is that they announced him "From Japan." I mean, Japan is one of the most populous countries on Earth and has numerous large cities, and they couldn't even have gone with a stock location like Osaka or a cultural one like Nara, but they just say "Yeah he's from JAPAN. BOO HIM."

Playing up not being American is such an outated way to draw heat. Fact is, most Americans right now either aren't jingoists and don't really care that someone else is foreign, regardless of background.

I think it's fairly easy to find different cultures strange or annoying and most people are pretty easily offended and dislike being out of their comfort zone.

Combine overly aggressive and cheating tactics with annoying and strange behaviors and condesending, rude or obnoxious talk and what is there to cheer for?

[Kitty Shamrocks]

I thought they should have embraced it from the get-go. Have him yell about how he's not Albert anymore and tell the fans to shut up. Throw fits and demolish people when the crowd won't stop. It would get good heat and it's not like this character was going to go past the midcard anyway.

[Deleted]

Dec 23, 2012 11:21:33 GMT -5 mrjl said:

Dec 23, 2012 11:14:22 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

I don't know how well it would've done with casual fans who know basically nothing about Japan. Almost any kind of foreign heel is bound to fail, worse is that they announced him "From Japan." I mean, Japan is one of the most populous countries on Earth and has numerous large cities, and they couldn't even have gone with a stock location like Osaka or a cultural one like Nara, but they just say "Yeah he's from JAPAN. BOO HIM."

Playing up not being American is such an outated way to draw heat. Fact is, most Americans right now either aren't jingoists and don't really care that someone else is foreign, regardless of background.

I think it's fairly easy to find different cultures strange or annoying and most people are pretty easily offended and dislike being out of their comfort zone.

Combine overly aggressive and cheating tactics with annoying and strange behaviors and condesending, rude or obnoxious talk and what is there to cheer for?

There's nothing to cheer for, but there's also very little to boo. Foreign heels have just been done to death in the most one-dimensional way possible.

[klapaucius]

Dec 23, 2012 11:30:09 GMT -5 Kitty Shamrocks said:

I thought they should have embraced it from the get-go. Have him yell about how he's not Albert anymore and tell the fans to shut up. Throw fits and demolish people when the crowd won't stop. It would get good heat and it's not like this character was going to go past the midcard anyway.

this.

[Deleted]

Dec 23, 2012 11:30:36 GMT -5 @mightykretzler said:

Dec 23, 2012 11:21:33 GMT -5 mrjl said:

I think it's fairly easy to find different cultures strange or annoying and most people are pretty easily offended and dislike being out of their comfort zone.

Combine overly aggressive and cheating tactics with annoying and strange behaviors and condesending, rude or obnoxious talk and what is there to cheer for?

There's nothing to cheer for, but there's also very little to boo. Foreign heels have just been done to death in the most one-dimensional way possible.

Then there's the stupidity in 1), painting part of the world as full of one-note bad guys when you're a company that has business worldwide, and 2), depicting not being from America as a reason to boo someone all on its own when one of the top faces is Irish.

[Deleted]

Dec 23, 2012 9:43:57 GMT -5 mrjl said:

Dec 22, 2012 18:06:46 GMT -5 mrtuesday said:

He spoke primarily in Japanese for the first few months of the gimmick. That has to go for something.

it means that he found success in Japan and embraced the country.

You know how Chavo tried to become Kerwin White? He wasn't a fake white guy, he was embracing white "culture" Tensai was the reverse of the situation

the fact people can't even get that is why the call for supposedly deeper characterization is ridiculous

I can see both sides of it. I really wish the Tensai character worked just because Tensai is such a talented and experienced guy, he deserves a successful career in WWE and I'm not sure WWE has the patience to try and build him back up a different way.

I'm weary of the "I'm not Albert" gimmick because it can so easily delve into pure comedy and continue to be robbed of great matches like the ones he had with Sheamus. I want him in a position where we can keep getting crazy matches like that.

I think the gimmick itself could have been successful if he didn't have that run as Albert. I think the character could have been on the same level as Umaga was, just as a credible monster with main even spots peppered in here and there. Although I can see why people shit on it, I know they had Michael Cole give us the background on Tensai, we know he went through some stuff in Japan, but we don't really know why he just up and changed his name to Tensai. I think part of the backlash could be because we never heard a promo from Albert himself cut a promo saying something like "yeah I was Albert, but Japan helped me find who I really was". Because even though Michael Cole gave us that story, from a fan perspective the Tensai character itself was so buried in the Japanese gimmick that it was really hard to buy into the shift from the typical WWE monster wrestler he was in his first run, to the over the top Japanese caricature like guy he turned into upon his return. I think a big part of the backlash was that it was just too much of an overhaul with not enough explanation that it just ended up feeling like they were trying to get one over the fans.

I give them credit for not completely ignoring his history, but the transition just wasn't smooth enough, the detail of his transformation wasn't fully fleshed out on screen so I can see the difficulty in getting behind it.