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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 22, 2012 22:17:20 GMT -5
In real life? Yeah, that's up for debate, and it might be proving detrimental to his health. But within kayfabe, this really shouldn't be a hurdle for the adult male crowd.
Why not? Because the "bad-ass anti hero" characters like Austin and Rock were just as much company guys as John. They did roughly the same amount of spokesperson appearances on behalf of WWE and WWE wouldn't shut up about them, even while they feuded with Vince and pissed off officials on TV- just as Cena often does. Their hyping of Rock's appearances on SNL and political conventions and Austin's Nash Bridges run are in the same vein as Cena's Make-A-Wish and Komen segments.
And since we're in an era where real life seems to be bleeding over into the stories more than ever, you'd think more fans would be aware of just how prefab the Austin character's sense of "rebellion" was, and wouldn't hold it against Cena so much. But for some reason people look past that and act as if Cena's somehow more hypocritical than they were.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on Dec 22, 2012 22:21:09 GMT -5
It isn't, people are just stupid
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 22, 2012 22:24:41 GMT -5
It isn't, people are just stupid Yeah, I'm not agreeing with that. Let's not have it go there. All I'm saying is that Cena, at least the character, deserves a lot more respect just for being more "honest" about his convictions. |
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Post by joebob27 on Dec 22, 2012 22:24:45 GMT -5
Didn't we have this thread last week in a different form?
Yeah, they hitched their wagon to the Rock when he blew up, but your recollection of Austin is a tad off. They certainly didn't have the bi-weekly "this is how great John Cena is" pre-tape.
That and Cena's character is a dork and alot of people don't relate to that. It is what it is.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on Dec 22, 2012 22:26:16 GMT -5
Didn't we have this thread last week in a different form? Yeah, they hitched their wagon to the Rock when he blew up, but your recollection of Austin is a tad off. They certainly didn't have the bi-weekly "this is how great John Cena is" pre-tape. That and Cena's character is a dork and alot of people don't relate to that. It is what it is. Stone Cold and The Rock didn't have the record for most wishes granted by a celebrity. That's one of the few records WWE doesn't have to come up with some strange explanation to claim. |
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Post by joebob27 on Dec 22, 2012 22:29:05 GMT -5
Didn't we have this thread last week in a different form? Yeah, they hitched their wagon to the Rock when he blew up, but your recollection of Austin is a tad off. They certainly didn't have the bi-weekly "this is how great John Cena is" pre-tape. That and Cena's character is a dork and alot of people don't relate to that. It is what it is. Stone Cold and The Rock didn't have the record for most wishes granted by a celebrity. That's one of the few records WWE doesn't have to come up with some strange explanation to claim. Which is great, but that doesn't make people like the character more. Neither does the weekly "why don't u like Cena" thread, but I digress. He's also not the only guy on the roster that does them. I don't understand why this is so shocking, the same thing happened to Hogan too, they just had the ability to cover it up more. |
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Dec 22, 2012 22:29:36 GMT -5
People enjoy anti-heroes. Everybody wants to go against the grain, rage against the machine and such. Basically, people want something different. Cena is seen as the ultimate representation of status quo and is shitted on because of it.
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Post by joebob27 on Dec 22, 2012 22:32:20 GMT -5
It also happened to Rock too, and those kinds of segments pimping his movies were probably one of the root causes.
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Post by cahuette on Dec 22, 2012 22:36:27 GMT -5
Do people really have a problem with him being the company guy real life wise? I know my problem is mostly about the kayfabe part, I think a lot of people have the same problem, the guy's incredible and I don't see any denying that, he's kind of destroying himself for the product and yet he can still keep going way above the average and he does stuff on the side(I mostly mean make-a-wish), he's giving his life for the company so if he wants to defend it, just let him do it. But the character is just, for me at least, terrible, not because he's not edgy, even though that's probably the problem with a lot of people, but just because he has nothing to win, no one that he really can't beat, and if he does get beat he just doesn't give a crap, as far as kayfabe goes, he's on top and no one's even making it seem like he might get off of it(Well maybe Ryback will make him go down a notch and take his place as the unbeatable dramaless character in a few month/years, yaaaaay). It isn't, people are just stupid NO YOU! |
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Dec 22, 2012 22:37:46 GMT -5
Also, people don't really hate Cena because he's a company guy. They hate him because he's a complete dork that almost never looks vulnerable. I say this as a fan of the guy.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319 
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Post by mrjl on Dec 22, 2012 22:43:04 GMT -5
People enjoy anti-heroes. Everybody wants to go against the grain, rage against the machine and such. Basically, people want something different. Cena is seen as the ultimate representation of status quo and is s***ted on because of it. no, everybody doesn't. |
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 22, 2012 22:45:15 GMT -5
Do people really have a problem with him being the company guy real life wise? I know my problem is mostly about the kayfabe part, I think a lot of people have the same problem, the guy's incredible and I don't see any denying that, he's kind of destroying himself for the product and yet he can still keep going way above the average and he does stuff on the side(I mostly mean make-a-wish), he's giving his life for the company so if he wants to defend it, just let him do it. I'm only defending him in the kayfabe sense against the accusation that he is a "corporate kiss ass" as Punk claimed- which is not only clearly false if you look back at Cena's post-2005 storylines, but is quite funny considering he's done nothing different from any top face WWE's ever had for him to be maligned for this. |
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Dec 22, 2012 22:46:07 GMT -5
People enjoy anti-heroes. Everybody wants to go against the grain, rage against the machine and such. Basically, people want something different. Cena is seen as the ultimate representation of status quo and is s***ted on because of it. no, everybody doesn't. EXCUUUSSSSEEE MEEE! A good chunk of the audience. That better?  |
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Post by joebob27 on Dec 22, 2012 22:49:36 GMT -5
Do people really have a problem with him being the company guy real life wise? I know my problem is mostly about the kayfabe part, I think a lot of people have the same problem, the guy's incredible and I don't see any denying that, he's kind of destroying himself for the product and yet he can still keep going way above the average and he does stuff on the side(I mostly mean make-a-wish), he's giving his life for the company so if he wants to defend it, just let him do it. I'm only defending him in the kayfabe sense against the accusation that he is a "corporate kiss ass" as Punk claimed- which is not only clearly false if you look back at Cena's post-2005 storylines, but is quite funny considering he's done nothing different from any top face WWE's ever had for him to be maligned for this. He's also the longest reigning top face the WWE has had since Bruno, especially when you take into account how many TV appearances that are made. There is a decent segment of the audience that is just tired of John Cena. You are not going to get cut many breaks by people who are tired of you. It's happened to alot of workers before, why can't it happen to John Cena? |
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 22, 2012 22:51:07 GMT -5
Also, people don't really hate Cena because he's a company guy. They hate him because he's a complete dork that almost never looks vulnerable. I say this as a fan of the guy. And I could point to Rock throughout all of his face runs as an even dorkier character that often looked even less vulnerable. I can see how his godly charisma allows him to get away with a lot of the stuff he says, but if we're gonna call out Cena for being a hammy goof, then jeez, he's nowhere as bad as the guy he faced at WM28. I say that as both a fan of Cena and Rock. Hammy nigh-invulnerable goofs deserve more love. |
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Dec 22, 2012 22:52:53 GMT -5
Also, people don't really hate Cena because he's a company guy. They hate him because he's a complete dork that almost never looks vulnerable. I say this as a fan of the guy. And I could point to Rock throughout all of his face runs as an even dorkier character that often looked even less vulnerable. I can see how his godly charisma allows him to get away with a lot of the stuff he says, but if we're gonna call out Cena for being a hammy goof, then jeez, he's nowhere as bad as the guy he faced at WM28. I say that as both a fan of Cena and Rock. Hammy nigh-invulnerable goofs deserve more love. The difference is that Cena has been on top of the mountain for a lot longer. People are just tired of the guy. It's not even his fault. ANYBODY with this much exposure would be considered stale. |
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Post by Mayonnaise on Dec 22, 2012 22:59:59 GMT -5
To me it's not him being A company guy but THE company guy. For as best I can remember WWE usually had at least 2 sometimes up to 4 people they'd push as that. If you didn't like Hogan, there was Savage or Warrior, don't like Hart there is HBK, didn't like Austin there was Rock, Foley, HHH or even Big Show depending on WWE's mood. Just seems like once Cena came along they abandoned the idea of having multiple people as company guys. When people would see an Austin to Cena's Rock, WWE either shipped them off to SD where they became unimportant or had Cena beat them and launch them down the card. That caused people to see what Cena was doing as disingenuous and forced. It became "Edge is awesome and the fans love him so why isn't WWE pushing him for media stuff or talking about it when he does something?" or "Why aren't Christian/Orton/Jericho getting getting the same opportunities? WWE must be protecting Cena" which to be fair it did seem like they were doing constantly in the 06-08 timeframe. Since about late 09- early10 with WWE being more open with other guys getting exposure (and/or WWE pushing that more) a lot of the hate started to die down. There was that brief period it picked back up but WWE was also running packages telling us how great Cena is while the announcers basically demanded we love (not respect which I think most would admit to doing) or we had no heart which went back to pissing people off with how ridiculous it was.
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Post by Hobby Drifter on Dec 22, 2012 23:07:48 GMT -5
Their hyping of Rock's appearances on SNL and political conventions and Austin's Nash Bridges run are in the same vein as Cena's Make-A-Wish and Komen segments. If you can't tell the difference between "cross promotion for outside media appearances" and "donating a record amount of time to help sick kids and cancer patients" then I can not help you. John Cena the character: Usually not the most interesting person to watch on TV, for me. John Cena the human being: Nothing but praise. A legit role model for kids and a great spokesperson for THIS BUSINESS.  |
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Dec 22, 2012 23:16:55 GMT -5
EXCUUUSSSSEEE MEEE! A good chunk of the audience. That better? I suppose. Although considering WWE does aim for kids more nowadays I'm not sure how true even that would be. |
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amaron
Samurai Cop
I yam what I yam.
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Post by amaron on Dec 22, 2012 23:22:38 GMT -5
IMO, Cena is now Hogan in spirit, or at least he was until recently and it's not really HIS fault.
WWE refuses to turn him and books him as this super hero who can get hit by a truck and then kick out at 2 3/4.
He was always around the title scene.
He never really took a break so people couldn't "miss" him.
Whomever writes his promos must have just hit puberty.
He has no equals on the active roster. CM Punk is probably the closest.
He's by all intents and purposes a really nice guy who doesn't get in trouble and likes being around the younger fans.
And he's the face of the watered down, homogenized, and sterilized product of the last few years for better or worse.
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