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Post by kamotengkahoy on Jan 15, 2013 9:18:22 GMT -5
Wondered where my thread went. Thought it got deleted. So she's really gone. Time to call up paige and make her and aj the new faces of the division.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2013 9:23:45 GMT -5
Looking at the divas roster, you have 6 faces (Alicia Fox, Cameron, Kaitlyn, Layla, Naomi and Natalya) and 4 heels (AJ, Aksana, Rosa Mendes and Tamina). So if Paige gets called up, she'll probably be called up as a heel.
Which seems to follow the pattern of NXT stars so far.
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Post by kamotengkahoy on Jan 15, 2013 9:28:56 GMT -5
Looking at the divas roster, you have 6 faces (Alicia Fox, Cameron, Kaitlyn, Layla, Naomi and Natalya) and 4 heels (AJ, Aksana, Rosa Mendes and Tamina). So if Paige gets called up, she'll probably be called up as a heel. Which seems to follow the pattern of NXT stars so far. Well Fox and Natalya can become tweeners again. Being a heel I think is naturally suited for Paige with her anti-diva gimmick but because of her popularity in nxt and her looks she can be a face too or they can turn AJ face again make a rookies (AJ, Naomi, Kaitlyn, as the faces) vs veterans (Layla,Nattie, Tamina, etc) divas feud. Let Fox be a face and Paige a heel.
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Toates Madhackrviper
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Post by Toates Madhackrviper on Jan 15, 2013 10:00:21 GMT -5
While I still think its a work (though finding out about her marriage sort of makes me think maybe not) if it is true I'm sorry to hear it. I mean good for Eve the person moving on with her life if thats what she wants to do but I will miss Eve the performer. Some people really unfairly packaged her in with other model divas when she pretty clearly surpassed that standard a looooonnng time ago. Pretty annoying actually. Especially with certain people claiming to "speak for most everyone" by saying they won't miss her now that she's gone. Excuse me but I think I'll decide for myself whether I'll miss her or not, which I will. I mean come on. She rarely if ever put in a less than at least average in ring performance, and over the last year has actually put in some quite impressive ring work. Look at the way she bumped for Kaitlyn in their last couple matches for example. Entertainment wise she was somewhat boring as a face, but ever since her heel turn her character has been entertaining too. I hate when people leave the company at what seems to be their peak. This sort of reminds me of Batista leaving once he finally started to get fun and entertaining too. Annoying.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2013 10:25:19 GMT -5
This is what WWE deserves for pushing girls who aren't interested in being career wrestlers. Even before she got signed she was dating a Gracie, and those guys are made of money...did WWE really expect her to owe them any kind of fealty with their ridiculous travel schedule and demands? Then I guess the WWE shouldn't have signed Trish, McCool, or Beth because they're not in the WWE either. They all left of their own doing. They all pretty much left to start a family, which is what it looks like played a part in Eve leaving. How is that a bad thing? She got out before her body was completely wrecked. Eve was with the company for years, and had multiple good matches with Beth, Natalya, and Kaitlyn. Hell, with Kaitlyn nobody had better matches with her. No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business. -Michelle McCool left more because her residual skeletal injuries were mounting up, and she needed to stop working matches. -Trish left to get married, but also because she had been working with the company for seven years and had been the female face of the company for most of that time and had done everything that a woman wrestler could possibly do. Her injuries were mounting as well. -Beth's reasons for leaving are unclear. But I was never a fan of her and I never thought that WWE should ever have seriously pushed her in the first place. Most of Eve's matches with Beth and Natalya went over very poorly with the crowds. I can't comment on the Kaitlyn matches, but Eve being pushed in 2011 was the reason that Nattie's push ended, and Nattie was over with fans and she was having decent matches. And Nattie is someone who wants to keep wrestling, what's the sense in not rewarding someone like that? WWE knew what they were getting into when they hired Eve and they made her a fixture of their division anyway. She had no reason whatsoever to stick with them due to her relationship with a guy who's overflowing with cash who isn't a part of the wrestling business. It was a stupid choice and they never, ever should have wasted their time in that fashion. Don't underestimate the power of the almighty dollar. Gail Kim's relationship with Robert Irvine was precisely why she was able to leave WWE's payrolls and go back to TNA's paltry ones.
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Post by Hit Girl on Jan 15, 2013 10:58:00 GMT -5
I only liked her in her "Johnny Ace's Assistant" capacity, because I have a thing for the "sexy secretary" look
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Post by crowwreak was WRONG on Jan 15, 2013 11:24:21 GMT -5
Half the forum cheers and the other half burns the forum down. AJ is probably a lock to be around for 5 or more years, unless she like freaks out and pulls a Chyna/Sunny, but if she were to be released the thread would indeed be hilarious. Why does everyone think Chyna was fired due to drugs? We already established that Vince fired her pretty much immediately after she found out HHH was bonking Nipple H Eve pulled a Michelle McCool, except she wasn't around as long once she got good. But McCool was terrible...
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Post by Wolf Hurricane on Jan 15, 2013 13:51:55 GMT -5
Then I guess the WWE shouldn't have signed Trish, McCool, or Beth because they're not in the WWE either. They all left of their own doing. They all pretty much left to start a family, which is what it looks like played a part in Eve leaving. How is that a bad thing? She got out before her body was completely wrecked. Eve was with the company for years, and had multiple good matches with Beth, Natalya, and Kaitlyn. Hell, with Kaitlyn nobody had better matches with her. No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business. -Michelle McCool left more because her residual skeletal injuries were mounting up, and she needed to stop working matches. -Trish left to get married, but also because she had been working with the company for seven years and had been the female face of the company for most of that time and had done everything that a woman wrestler could possibly do. Her injuries were mounting as well. -Beth's reasons for leaving are unclear. But I was never a fan of her and I never thought that WWE should ever have seriously pushed her in the first place. Most of Eve's matches with Beth and Natalya went over very poorly with the crowds. I can't comment on the Kaitlyn matches, but Eve being pushed in 2011 was the reason that Nattie's push ended, and Nattie was over with fans and she was having decent matches. And Nattie is someone who wants to keep wrestling, what's the sense in not rewarding someone like that? WWE knew what they were getting into when they hired Eve and they made her a fixture of their division anyway. She had no reason whatsoever to stick with them due to her relationship with a guy who's overflowing with cash who isn't a part of the wrestling business. It was a stupid choice and they never, ever should have wasted their time in that fashion. Don't underestimate the power of the almighty dollar. Gail Kim's relationship with Robert Irvine was precisely why she was able to leave WWE's payrolls and go back to TNA's paltry ones. But don't underestimate the power of treating your workers right, either. Gail Kim didn't just leave WWE because her husband had money, she left because with money no longer an option, she didn't have to put up with WWE's treatment of the Divas as a "bathroom break segment." Same with Tara; she "retired" in 2008 and showed up in TNA just months later, and she doesn't have a sugar daddy, so to speak. Just a theory, but what are the odds that Beth, among Divas, wouldn't have quit if they felt they had a place in the WWE? Regardless of why Eve's leaving, she may have very well felt there wasn't a reason for her to stay.
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Post by norsisclouds on Jan 15, 2013 14:03:05 GMT -5
Then I guess the WWE shouldn't have signed Trish, McCool, or Beth because they're not in the WWE either. They all left of their own doing. They all pretty much left to start a family, which is what it looks like played a part in Eve leaving. How is that a bad thing? She got out before her body was completely wrecked. Eve was with the company for years, and had multiple good matches with Beth, Natalya, and Kaitlyn. Hell, with Kaitlyn nobody had better matches with her. No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business. -Michelle McCool left more because her residual skeletal injuries were mounting up, and she needed to stop working matches. -Trish left to get married, but also because she had been working with the company for seven years and had been the female face of the company for most of that time and had done everything that a woman wrestler could possibly do. Her injuries were mounting as well. -Beth's reasons for leaving are unclear. But I was never a fan of her and I never thought that WWE should ever have seriously pushed her in the first place. Most of Eve's matches with Beth and Natalya went over very poorly with the crowds. I can't comment on the Kaitlyn matches, but Eve being pushed in 2011 was the reason that Nattie's push ended, and Nattie was over with fans and she was having decent matches. And Nattie is someone who wants to keep wrestling, what's the sense in not rewarding someone like that? WWE knew what they were getting into when they hired Eve and they made her a fixture of their division anyway. She had no reason whatsoever to stick with them due to her relationship with a guy who's overflowing with cash who isn't a part of the wrestling business. It was a stupid choice and they never, ever should have wasted their time in that fashion. Don't underestimate the power of the almighty dollar. Gail Kim's relationship with Robert Irvine was precisely why she was able to leave WWE's payrolls and go back to TNA's paltry ones. You are not entirely correct. Michelle also left to spend time with her husband and had a baby. It's logical to conclude that spending time with her husband/leaving over injuries was a good segue into her new stage in life as a wife and mother. Trish Stratus flat out said in an interview with WWE.com that she was leaving to have babies with her husband and start a family and she could not do that while she was traveling on the road with WWE. She said this...what happened is her business and another story. Children and parenting is a complicated thing. Beth Phoenix has given a few interviews since she left and the strong implication seems to be that she left to move onto that next stage of her life, settle down and have children. People aren't just pulling this out of thin air, she's implicated it multiple times since retiring. What actually happens, well, we will have to wait and see.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2013 14:13:12 GMT -5
No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business. -Michelle McCool left more because her residual skeletal injuries were mounting up, and she needed to stop working matches. -Trish left to get married, but also because she had been working with the company for seven years and had been the female face of the company for most of that time and had done everything that a woman wrestler could possibly do. Her injuries were mounting as well. -Beth's reasons for leaving are unclear. But I was never a fan of her and I never thought that WWE should ever have seriously pushed her in the first place. Most of Eve's matches with Beth and Natalya went over very poorly with the crowds. I can't comment on the Kaitlyn matches, but Eve being pushed in 2011 was the reason that Nattie's push ended, and Nattie was over with fans and she was having decent matches. And Nattie is someone who wants to keep wrestling, what's the sense in not rewarding someone like that? WWE knew what they were getting into when they hired Eve and they made her a fixture of their division anyway. She had no reason whatsoever to stick with them due to her relationship with a guy who's overflowing with cash who isn't a part of the wrestling business. It was a stupid choice and they never, ever should have wasted their time in that fashion. Don't underestimate the power of the almighty dollar. Gail Kim's relationship with Robert Irvine was precisely why she was able to leave WWE's payrolls and go back to TNA's paltry ones. But don't underestimate the power of treating your workers right, either. Gail Kim didn't just leave WWE because her husband had money, she left because with money no longer an option, she didn't have to put up with WWE's treatment of the Divas as a "bathroom break segment." Same with Tara; she "retired" in 2008 and showed up in TNA just months later, and she doesn't have a sugar daddy, so to speak. Just a theory, but what are the odds that Beth, among Divas, wouldn't have quit if they felt they had a place in the WWE? Regardless of why Eve's leaving, she may have very well felt there wasn't a reason for her to stay. About Gail, that's the reason why she wanted to leave, but not the reason she was able to leave. As for Tara, keep in mind that she's owned a pizza restaurant and a motorcycle shop. It's not like she doesn't have any money or something like that. If it wasn't there, she wouldn't be able to do those kinds of things. Maryse and the Bellas are other examples of what I'm talking about, with the kinds of money that other people are bringing in to them. And what you say about Beth, I can agree with, but there's other girls who would not be leaving WWE even if left in the periphery. Natalya's held strong despite them ruining her chance after she got over. Mickie James and Melina were both willing to stay on the roster when they each got released. I doubt AJ or Kaitlyn would have a problem doing very little. That sums up both of their careers until the later part of last year, and someone with a small resume isn't going to say "no" to what WWE offers. This isn't a "shame on Eve" situation or anything like that. I don't blame her for leaving the company at all. But WWE should have known better than to hire a girl who dates someone made out of money. If you don't give her precisely what she wants, that gives her all the more reason to leave, and it's not like she's walking away from good money and into destitution. I do think that the way WWE treats their girls is disgraceful. But somehow, some of them can put up with it or survive it. And there's more people like that to be found elsewhere. I can guarantee that.
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Jan 15, 2013 14:14:35 GMT -5
Then I guess the WWE shouldn't have signed Trish, McCool, or Beth because they're not in the WWE either. They all left of their own doing. They all pretty much left to start a family, which is what it looks like played a part in Eve leaving. How is that a bad thing? She got out before her body was completely wrecked. Eve was with the company for years, and had multiple good matches with Beth, Natalya, and Kaitlyn. Hell, with Kaitlyn nobody had better matches with her. No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business. -Michelle McCool left more because her residual skeletal injuries were mounting up, and she needed to stop working matches. -Trish left to get married, but also because she had been working with the company for seven years and had been the female face of the company for most of that time and had done everything that a woman wrestler could possibly do. Her injuries were mounting as well. -Beth's reasons for leaving are unclear. But I was never a fan of her and I never thought that WWE should ever have seriously pushed her in the first place. Most of Eve's matches with Beth and Natalya went over very poorly with the crowds. I can't comment on the Kaitlyn matches, but Eve being pushed in 2011 was the reason that Nattie's push ended, and Nattie was over with fans and she was having decent matches. And Nattie is someone who wants to keep wrestling, what's the sense in not rewarding someone like that? WWE knew what they were getting into when they hired Eve and they made her a fixture of their division anyway. She had no reason whatsoever to stick with them due to her relationship with a guy who's overflowing with cash who isn't a part of the wrestling business. It was a stupid choice and they never, ever should have wasted their time in that fashion. Don't underestimate the power of the almighty dollar. Gail Kim's relationship with Robert Irvine was precisely why she was able to leave WWE's payrolls and go back to TNA's paltry ones. And why exactly is being married to a famous person bad? If anything it shows that these women have a passion for wrestling. Eve has been with Rener Gracie for years, yet she stuck around for WWE for a really long time. That shows that she did have some passion for the company. And Gail Kim continuing to wrestle even though despite her relationship with Robert Irvine shows that she has passion for the wrestling business. She doesn't need the big WWE money, but she still loves wrestling and will wrestle somewhere else like TNA. Maybe Eve will hit the indy scene after she's created her dream family. What else could Eve have done? She had her time as champion, and she went out on her back and put Kaitlyn over, which is traditionally the "right thing to do". I'd rather see Eve quit than see someone who wants to be in the company get cut.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2013 14:21:36 GMT -5
No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business. -Michelle McCool left more because her residual skeletal injuries were mounting up, and she needed to stop working matches. -Trish left to get married, but also because she had been working with the company for seven years and had been the female face of the company for most of that time and had done everything that a woman wrestler could possibly do. Her injuries were mounting as well. -Beth's reasons for leaving are unclear. But I was never a fan of her and I never thought that WWE should ever have seriously pushed her in the first place. Most of Eve's matches with Beth and Natalya went over very poorly with the crowds. I can't comment on the Kaitlyn matches, but Eve being pushed in 2011 was the reason that Nattie's push ended, and Nattie was over with fans and she was having decent matches. And Nattie is someone who wants to keep wrestling, what's the sense in not rewarding someone like that? WWE knew what they were getting into when they hired Eve and they made her a fixture of their division anyway. She had no reason whatsoever to stick with them due to her relationship with a guy who's overflowing with cash who isn't a part of the wrestling business. It was a stupid choice and they never, ever should have wasted their time in that fashion. Don't underestimate the power of the almighty dollar. Gail Kim's relationship with Robert Irvine was precisely why she was able to leave WWE's payrolls and go back to TNA's paltry ones. You are not entirely correct. Trish Stratus flat out said in an interview with WWE.com that she was leaving to have babies with her husband and start a family and she could not do that while she was traveling on the road with WWE. She said this...what happened is her business and another story. Children and parenting is a complicated thing. Yeah and about all those babies that she's having... Re-read the first thing that I said: "No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business." I'm not saying that marriage and kids weren't important or didn't play a role. In fact, you and Wolf aren't wrong at all in the things that you are stating. But what I was saying is that signing someone who's in a relationship with a rich guy and has all the conditions to basically bail on her contract at the drop of a hat is a bad idea. Trish's decision, Michelle's decision, and ostensibly Beth's decision, all came up while they were still on the roster, but that doesn't happen for everybody. Eve was already with someone though, and as soon as she was signed, she had a backup plan in case she wanted to leave for whatever reason.
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Post by Indiana Miz on Jan 15, 2013 16:35:44 GMT -5
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Post by ben:friendship frog on Jan 15, 2013 18:09:51 GMT -5
Nice message.
I skimmed through the conversation, am I right in thinking someone's practically saying that no woman who dates a successful rich guy would ever want a career and that it's inevitable that the woman will fall back on his money?
Eeeesh..
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BigWill
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by BigWill on Jan 15, 2013 18:17:05 GMT -5
Nice message. I skimmed through the conversation, am I right in thinking someone's practically saying that no woman who dates a successful rich guy would ever want a career and that it's inevitable that the woman will fall back on his money? Eeeesh.. I've seen people giving a similar argument when Gail Kim was released.
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Post by George. on Jan 15, 2013 18:20:47 GMT -5
Good for Eve.
Nice to know that she's ready to move on in life and progress with bigger and better things.
Some... a lot of people in WWE need to learn that.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2013 18:41:57 GMT -5
Nice message. I skimmed through the conversation, am I right in thinking someone's practically saying that no woman who dates a successful rich guy would ever want a career and that it's inevitable that the woman will fall back on his money? Eeeesh.. No. No you're not. I'm sorry, but I find that really offensive because that's by no means what I'm saying. I wouldn't mind if it didn't feel to me like people are taking incorrect generalizations out of statements that I'm saying, but I've spent the majority of my time in this thread trying to explain my argument to people. Look at the women who have voluntarily left WWE. Gail Kim, the Bellas, Maryse, Beth Phoenix, Trish Stratus, Tara, Eve, Michelle McCool. What do these women all have in common? Strong financial resources when they left the company. It's easy to leave when you're in that position because you've basically got ensured financial stability. People who don't have a lot of spare money are a lot more willing to work a difficult job if it pays well. That's why garbage carriers, accountants and trial lawyers continue to exist. When Eve was signed, she already had that kind of financial strength. If for whatever reason she thought she was being mistreated and WWE didn't meet her demands, she could have left at the drop of a hat, and WWE couldn't really buy her off with money or threaten to boot her since she has so much to begin with. That's what I mean when I referred originally to the "fealty." From the get-go, she was never in a position where she really needed to protect her career. That Eve enjoyed what she did is a huge plus, but there's not guaranteed for everyone who you sign, especially when the financial value of the contract is meaningless for them. In short: -A person with no money outside of their contract is more likely to work for the company. -A person with more money outside of their contract is less likely to work for the company. -And it's unfortunate that this can't go without saying, but people pool their money when they're married or living together more often than not. This does NOT mean that a person will refuse to work or leech off of the other person. But financial shocks sure aren't going to hit them as hard as someone who has no other source of income.
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Post by Wolf Hurricane on Jan 16, 2013 0:03:43 GMT -5
Nothing like a heartfelt thank you with tears to tug at the heartstrings. Then again, I've always had a soft spot for her; way underrated in the ring and on the mic. The WWE lost a really great performer last Monday, they're gonna keep losing them if they don't give them better reasons to stay, and I truly don't believe they care.
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Post by celticjobber on Jan 16, 2013 0:07:51 GMT -5
AJ is probably a lock to be around for 5 or more years, unless she like freaks out and pulls a Chyna/Sunny, but if she were to be released the thread would indeed be hilarious. Why does everyone think Chyna was fired due to drugs? We already established that Vince fired her pretty much immediately after she found out HHH was bonking Nipple H No, Chyna was released because her ego got out of control and she was a bit of a headcase. She was demanding to only wrestle against men, and she wanted a guaranteed WWE title program. That was all over the news online when she left WWE.
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Post by norsisclouds on Jan 16, 2013 0:17:31 GMT -5
You are not entirely correct. Trish Stratus flat out said in an interview with WWE.com that she was leaving to have babies with her husband and start a family and she could not do that while she was traveling on the road with WWE. She said this...what happened is her business and another story. Children and parenting is a complicated thing. Yeah and about all those babies that she's having... Re-read the first thing that I said: "No, the difference with all three of the people that you mentioned was that they were each signed, they weren't romantically linked to anyone who's relevant outside the wrestling business." I'm not saying that marriage and kids weren't important or didn't play a role. In fact, you and Wolf aren't wrong at all in the things that you are stating. But what I was saying is that signing someone who's in a relationship with a rich guy and has all the conditions to basically bail on her contract at the drop of a hat is a bad idea. Trish's decision, Michelle's decision, and ostensibly Beth's decision, all came up while they were still on the roster, but that doesn't happen for everybody. Eve was already with someone though, and as soon as she was signed, she had a backup plan in case she wanted to leave for whatever reason. Sorry, but you are still extrapolating. What we have are the reasons that were given to us explicitly by those performers. Trish was ready to move on with her life. She may have changed her mind, she may have a hard time having children, we don't know and I felt it would be disrespectful to imply that she was really leaving for other reasons if that's what she said. And while I usually agree with you I think it is very gross and in poor taste to call someone's personal romantic relationship a freaking BACK UP plan. What the hell is that? Eve Torres is an engineer, who is personally accomplished and by all reports a very nice and hard working person. That is so disrespectful, to think that she was leaving because she finally got her man. Perhaps she's leaving because she just doesn't want to spend time away from her husband, you know, like Trish, Michelle, and Beth (obstensibly) would like to do. There's this thing where you're female and your fertility starts running out and you have to think about having children, by the age of about 30 it enters your mind. Devaluing her contributions or her as a worker because of this personal issue is f***ed up and beyond disrespectful to both her, her fiance and the roster. I'm really galled that you would say this. It's a privacy/respect issue. I don't think it's fair to start making assumptions as to the why and how people left when it concerns something so personal and sensitive. I would rather take her word for it if that's how she felt/what she wanted to do at the time. It's not up to us to sit here and say she was lying because she couldn't take WWE anymore.
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