andrew8798
FANatic
on 24/7 this month
Posts: 106,150
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Post by andrew8798 on Jan 21, 2013 19:52:55 GMT -5
Packers C Jeff Saturday is expected to retire.
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Post by darbus alan on Jan 21, 2013 21:09:43 GMT -5
Woody Johnson's mouth continues to be a womb of lies.
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Post by Hugh Mungus on Jan 21, 2013 21:41:06 GMT -5
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2013 22:03:00 GMT -5
On ESPN, Rob Gronkowski is apparently why Tom Brady had a bad game. Despite having Wes Welker, Brandon Lloyd, Aaron Hernandez who can all make plays and the very passable Deion Branch. Despite having a strong offensive line that does an excellent job at protecting him and letting him throw as he pleases. The guy is going to be 36 later this year. He's been playing the game for a long time and his stats are starting to weaken. He's not the player that he used to be. He will never be that player again. New England needs to seriously consider getting a new Quarterback. Maybe not this season, but soon. Their team is based around a QB and talented QBs are never in short supply. Oh sure, there were a few receiver drops. But that happens to every team. That doesn't excuse that kind of play. But they need a younger guy. There were a lot of drive-ending drops. And Brady played well against a good defense, you can throw both interceptions out since one was a tip drill and the other was a garbage-time interception. They got with injuries at exactly the wrong time of the year. I'm a Pats fan, we do this every year where they have a bad loss and now the sky is falling and Brady is starting to lose it. Reality is, he's every bit as good as he's been, and sometimes you just get bad breaks. Drive-ending drops happen to every team. If they were a valid excuse for a quarterback's stats then Colt McCoy would still be the starting QB for the Cleveland Browns (And I do think he has the talent for it, he just needed a half-decent WR or two). The numbers don't lie. Tom Brady's stats have been declining over the past several years. It's not about sporadic Playoff losses, but can you explain why he has better offensive tools than he had in the past and he's doing worse now than he was then? His decline is not a steep one, but he's not the player that he once was and he's going to need a replacement in the near future. That replacement isn't Ryan Mallett. He's a third stringer at best and I'm not totally surprised that Bill Belichick hasn't sought a replacement, given his ass-backward personnel decisions (Cutting Benjarvus Green-Ellis, putting Wes Welker in the doghouse, etc.).
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Sektor
Unicron
The OTHER Big Red Machine.
Posts: 2,808
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Post by Sektor on Jan 21, 2013 22:18:46 GMT -5
There were a lot of drive-ending drops. And Brady played well against a good defense, you can throw both interceptions out since one was a tip drill and the other was a garbage-time interception. They got with injuries at exactly the wrong time of the year. I'm a Pats fan, we do this every year where they have a bad loss and now the sky is falling and Brady is starting to lose it. Reality is, he's every bit as good as he's been, and sometimes you just get bad breaks. Drive-ending drops happen to every team. If they were a valid excuse for a quarterback's stats then Colt McCoy would still be the starting QB for the Cleveland Browns (And I do think he has the talent for it, he just needed a half-decent WR or two). The numbers don't lie. Tom Brady's stats have been declining over the past several years. It's not about sporadic Playoff losses, but can you explain why he has better offensive tools than he had in the past and he's doing worse now than he was then? His decline is not a steep one, but he's not the player that he once was and he's going to need a replacement in the near future. That replacement isn't Ryan Mallett. He's a third stringer at best and I'm not totally surprised that Bill Belichick hasn't sought a replacement, given his ass-backward personnel decisions (Cutting Benjarvus Green-Ellis, putting Wes Welker in the doghouse, etc.). 2009: 65.7% accuracy, 4,398 yards, 7.8 YPA, 28 TDs 13 INTs 2010: 65.9%, 3900 yards, 7.9 YPA, 36 TDs 4 INTs 2011: 65.6%, 5235 yards, 8.6 YPA, 39 TDs 12 INTs 2012: 63%, 4827 yards, 7.6 YPA, 34 TDs 8 INTs So, not only is there not signs of regression, the numbers aren't trending in any particular direction. Unless you're trying to say that he should've duplicated 2011, which I would disagree with simply because I think 2011 should have an asterisk (I don't think many people understand how badly defenses were affected by the lockout). On paper, his receiving corps is fantastic, but he played half the season without Hernandez and the last few games (five? six?) without Gronkowski, and Brandon Lloyd has either regressed or struggled to fit himself into the offensive system. And as far as the line is concerned, it isn't great. It's not bad, but there were some injuries to it this season and they tended to struggle against good front-sevens. That's to be expected, since there is a fair amount of youth. And on your last two points: Have you seen Law Firm with the Bengals? He wasn't secretly a top-10 runner, he was exactly what everyone thought, which is a solid guy. Not only is Stevan Ridley solid, he's shown some flashes of real talent. Not to mention Woodhead and Vereen as change of pace backs. You want depth, but you don't need to carry four starter-level runningbacks. And the Welker thing is complete speculation.
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Post by darbus alan on Jan 21, 2013 22:29:24 GMT -5
BenJarvus Green-Ellis sounds like someone who should be in that East West Bowl skit on Key and Peele.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2013 22:34:34 GMT -5
Drive-ending drops happen to every team. If they were a valid excuse for a quarterback's stats then Colt McCoy would still be the starting QB for the Cleveland Browns (And I do think he has the talent for it, he just needed a half-decent WR or two). The numbers don't lie. Tom Brady's stats have been declining over the past several years. It's not about sporadic Playoff losses, but can you explain why he has better offensive tools than he had in the past and he's doing worse now than he was then? His decline is not a steep one, but he's not the player that he once was and he's going to need a replacement in the near future. That replacement isn't Ryan Mallett. He's a third stringer at best and I'm not totally surprised that Bill Belichick hasn't sought a replacement, given his ass-backward personnel decisions (Cutting Benjarvus Green-Ellis, putting Wes Welker in the doghouse, etc.). 2009: 65.7% accuracy, 4,398 yards, 7.8 YPA, 28 TDs 13 INTs 2010: 65.9%, 3900 yards, 7.9 YPA, 36 TDs 4 INTs 2011: 65.6%, 5235 yards, 8.6 YPA, 39 TDs 12 INTs 2012: 63%, 4827 yards, 7.6 YPA, 34 TDs 8 INTs So, not only is there not signs of regression, the numbers aren't trending in any particular direction. Unless you're trying to say that he should've duplicated 2011, which I would disagree with simply because I think 2011 should have an asterisk (I don't think many people understand how badly defenses were affected by the lockout). On paper, his receiving corps is fantastic, but he played half the season without Hernandez and the last few games (five? six?) without Gronkowski, and Brandon Lloyd has either regressed or struggled to fit himself into the offensive system. And as far as the line is concerned, it isn't great. It's not bad, but there were some injuries to it this season and they tended to struggle against good front-sevens. That's to be expected, since there is a fair amount of youth. And on your last two points: Have you seen Law Firm with the Bengals? He wasn't secretly a top-10 runner, he was exactly what everyone thought, which is a solid guy. Not only is Stevan Ridley solid, he's shown some flashes of real talent. Not to mention Woodhead and Vereen as change of pace backs. You want depth, but you don't need to carry four starter-level runningbacks. And the Welker thing is complete speculation. In your count, you're leaving out 2007, which was essentially his apogee as a QB. Leaving out 2008 is a must since it doesn't represent him at all, with the injury he suffered. But given that 2010 was higher than most of his seasons and he's declined overall, here's his rating from 2007 to the present: 2007: 117.2 2009: 96.2 2010: 111.0 2011: 105.6 2012: 98.7 It is not a strong regression. But it is a regression. Speculation or not, why did he sit out Welker for a number of games? How did that possibly help the Patriots out when Wes is one of the top receivers on the team? It was Bill Belichick being the guy he is and being petty. Green-Ellis is not a top ten running back but cutting him seems to be pointless. He's got way too much value and no downside to explain getting rid of someone in that fashion. They could easily have gotten something for him.
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Sektor
Unicron
The OTHER Big Red Machine.
Posts: 2,808
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Post by Sektor on Jan 21, 2013 23:04:09 GMT -5
He didn't get cut, he was a free agent. And you're using a year where they intentionally ran up the score and he had a first-ballot Hall of Famer at the height of his ability.
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Post by canceled4truth on Jan 21, 2013 23:07:19 GMT -5
2009: 65.7% accuracy, 4,398 yards, 7.8 YPA, 28 TDs 13 INTs 2010: 65.9%, 3900 yards, 7.9 YPA, 36 TDs 4 INTs 2011: 65.6%, 5235 yards, 8.6 YPA, 39 TDs 12 INTs 2012: 63%, 4827 yards, 7.6 YPA, 34 TDs 8 INTs So, not only is there not signs of regression, the numbers aren't trending in any particular direction. Unless you're trying to say that he should've duplicated 2011, which I would disagree with simply because I think 2011 should have an asterisk (I don't think many people understand how badly defenses were affected by the lockout). On paper, his receiving corps is fantastic, but he played half the season without Hernandez and the last few games (five? six?) without Gronkowski, and Brandon Lloyd has either regressed or struggled to fit himself into the offensive system. And as far as the line is concerned, it isn't great. It's not bad, but there were some injuries to it this season and they tended to struggle against good front-sevens. That's to be expected, since there is a fair amount of youth. And on your last two points: Have you seen Law Firm with the Bengals? He wasn't secretly a top-10 runner, he was exactly what everyone thought, which is a solid guy. Not only is Stevan Ridley solid, he's shown some flashes of real talent. Not to mention Woodhead and Vereen as change of pace backs. You want depth, but you don't need to carry four starter-level runningbacks. And the Welker thing is complete speculation. In your count, you're leaving out 2007, which was essentially his apogee as a QB. Leaving out 2008 is a must since it doesn't represent him at all, with the injury he suffered. But given that 2010 was higher than most of his seasons and he's declined overall, here's his rating from 2007 to the present: 2007: 117.2 2009: 96.2 2010: 111.0 2011: 105.6 2012: 98.7 It is not a strong regression. But it is a regression. Speculation or not, why did he sit out Welker for a number of games? How did that possibly help the Patriots out when Wes is one of the top receivers on the team? It was Bill Belichick being the guy he is and being petty. Green-Ellis is not a top ten running back but cutting him seems to be pointless. He's got way too much value and no downside to explain getting rid of someone in that fashion. They could easily have gotten something for him. BenJarvus Green-Ellis was not cut. He left the Pats as a free agent. I attribute Brady's slight decline in stats this season to the emergence of a strong running game for the first time since Corey Dillon was a Patriot. Would you have considered Brady "declining" in 2009?
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Post by darbus alan on Jan 21, 2013 23:17:55 GMT -5
I think Sektor's stats are a more accurate picture of Brady's performance. I've never liked QB rating much.
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Post by Hugh Mungus on Jan 21, 2013 23:36:49 GMT -5
Here's my guessing of how I would describe NE's offense evolution: 2001-2003(?): Run-heavy, with some passing 2004-2006: Pass-run balanced 2007-2011: Pass-heavy, with some running Since 2012: Pass-run balanced? OT: Has anyone seen this pic?
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BearDogg-X
Vegeta
Still lurking in the shadows....
Posts: 9,382
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Post by BearDogg-X on Jan 22, 2013 0:09:19 GMT -5
Tom Brady has pulled out of the Pro Bowl, Andrew Luck replaces him on the roster. Vince Wilfork also pulled out due to injury, Dolphins DT Randy Starks replaces him
Meaning none of the New England players selected to the Pro Bowl are playing in the game.
Bills S Jairus Byrd replaces Ed Reed
Falcons S Thomas DeCoud replaces Donte Whitner Falcons S William Moore replaces Dashon Goldson
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2013 0:15:33 GMT -5
In your count, you're leaving out 2007, which was essentially his apogee as a QB. Leaving out 2008 is a must since it doesn't represent him at all, with the injury he suffered. But given that 2010 was higher than most of his seasons and he's declined overall, here's his rating from 2007 to the present: 2007: 117.2 2009: 96.2 2010: 111.0 2011: 105.6 2012: 98.7 It is not a strong regression. But it is a regression. Speculation or not, why did he sit out Welker for a number of games? How did that possibly help the Patriots out when Wes is one of the top receivers on the team? It was Bill Belichick being the guy he is and being petty. Green-Ellis is not a top ten running back but cutting him seems to be pointless. He's got way too much value and no downside to explain getting rid of someone in that fashion. They could easily have gotten something for him. BenJarvus Green-Ellis was not cut. He left the Pats as a free agent. I attribute Brady's slight decline in stats this season to the emergence of a strong running game for the first time since Corey Dillon was a Patriot. Would you have considered Brady "declining" in 2009? Oh okay, you're right about the free agency thing. My mistake. No, I wouldn't say he was declining in 2009, because a drop between two years is statistically unreliable. That's the difference between having an off year and an on-year. But between 2007 and 2012 is a five-year difference in the time period in a Quarterback's career where quality becomes a concern. It's a trend that I can say with the utmost confidence will continue because I think it's been going on for a while. Some guys still play at a sublime level late into their 30's but I don't think that Brady is in that group.
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Post by canceled4truth on Jan 22, 2013 1:16:42 GMT -5
BenJarvus Green-Ellis was not cut. He left the Pats as a free agent. I attribute Brady's slight decline in stats this season to the emergence of a strong running game for the first time since Corey Dillon was a Patriot. Would you have considered Brady "declining" in 2009? Oh okay, you're right about the free agency thing. My mistake. No, I wouldn't say he was declining in 2009, because a drop between two years is statistically unreliable. That's the difference between having an off year and an on-year. But between 2007 and 2012 is a five-year difference in the time period in a Quarterback's career where quality becomes a concern. It's a trend that I can say with the utmost confidence will continue because I think it's been going on for a while. Some guys still play at a sublime level late into their 30's but I don't think that Brady is in that group. Out of curiosity, who would you put in that group?
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Post by Hugh Mungus on Jan 22, 2013 2:05:41 GMT -5
Peyton does the same thing, and yet no one calls him out on it. Probably because of the current, public perceptions of Peyton and Belichick? Don't forget that Peyton blamed his O-line for losing to the Steelers in the 05 Divisionals. Also, last year, Jim Harbaugh declined to be interviewed after the 49ers lost in the NFC Championship. Is there a double standard?
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Sektor
Unicron
The OTHER Big Red Machine.
Posts: 2,808
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Post by Sektor on Jan 22, 2013 2:29:14 GMT -5
Tom Brady has pulled out of the Pro Bowl, Andrew Luck replaces him on the roster. Vince Wilfork also pulled out due to injury, Dolphins DT Randy Starks replaces him Meaning none of the New England players selected to the Pro Bowl are playing in the game. Bills S Jairus Byrd replaces Ed Reed Falcons S Thomas DeCoud replaces Donte Whitner Falcons S William Moore replaces Dashon Goldson Good, Jairus Byrd is absolutely the second best safety in the AFC behind Reed, never should have gotten left off.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,816
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Jan 22, 2013 7:30:20 GMT -5
Peyton does the same thing, and yet no one calls him out on it. Probably because of the current, public perceptions of Peyton and Belichick? Don't forget that Peyton blamed his O-line for losing to the Steelers in the 05 Divisionals. Also, last year, Jim Harbaugh declined to be interviewed after the 49ers lost in the NFC Championship. Is there a double standard? In a word, yes
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bigbadbull
Don Corleone
Enter your message here...
Posts: 1,489
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Post by bigbadbull on Jan 22, 2013 9:38:42 GMT -5
Ravens' Head Coach John Harbaugh announced today that Jim Caldwell will be promoted to OC next season. No real surprise, and no more complaning about minorities not getting jobs. The complaints will never stop and the ridiculous And embarrassing Rooney rule is here to stay The Rooney Rule IS needed. The point is to give a minority coach a chance for an interview.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,816
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Jan 22, 2013 9:56:02 GMT -5
The complaints will never stop and the ridiculous And embarrassing Rooney rule is here to stay The Rooney Rule IS needed. The point is to give a minority coach a chance for an interview. Bit it fails when said minority canidate is there just to comply to a rule
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Post by Ishmeal Loves BBL Bayley on Jan 22, 2013 9:56:32 GMT -5
The complaints will never stop and the ridiculous And embarrassing Rooney rule is here to stay The Rooney Rule IS needed. The point is to give a minority coach a chance for an interview. But if it leads to an under-qualified minority coach getting a job over a qualified coach who doesn't happen to be a minority, then yes, it is ridiculous.
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