Bryan loses, thus "proving Triple H right" (long-ish post)

[mrjl]

Nov 2, 2013 18:21:35 GMT -5 sportatorium said:

Nov 2, 2013 16:38:09 GMT -5 @kn said:

I just read this on the dirtsheets.



Overall it's very upsetting. They could have ended it perfectly if Bryan at least lost the belt through trickery and then beat Triple H in a match. Bryan received nothing from this. After being humiliated constantly week after week he wins but then he's screwed again. It's as if it's the joke all along. I can understand that they don't want him to get over the Authority but at the same time there are ways to go about doing it. Overall the babyface is proven wrong and everything was lined up for Bryan. They didn't capitalize. Hopefully they can somehow keep Bryan in the talks until WM season. If they bring him out of the angle and bring him back in it won't do anyone any good.

It's not about how strong he looks because Bryan appears to be very strong. It's mostly about the heels always getting over on him. Like I said this will be addressed later on. I just hope they keep it fresh in everyone's mind so it'll allow for a greater story.

In a way this feels similar to Booker T/Triple H match at WM years ago without the racial boundaries surrounding it. Didn't do a damn thing for Booker. Hasn't done a damn thing for Bryan.

Wow- I really hope that report is inaccurate. Having him "lose" the feud when the audience is that much behind him is really a bad move. Big Show has gotten more out of this than I ever thought possible, but he & Randy still have to get in the ring & provide an outcome for people putting down $ for a PPV. Mind numbing.

seems to me Mankind lost feuds like that all the time

[Clash, Never a Meter Maid]

Another thing that especially makes Bryan immune to HHH's meta teardowns (and admittedly, they are quite meta) is that the company, outside of kayfabe, already is getting behind him and coronating him as an "A+ player". We know they're not gonna chuck Cena's push aside and turn him into chopped liver so long as he can wrestle, but we're also seeing a lot more front row plants with Bryan gear on as we do Cena and Punk gear. It's also becoming obvious in little ways like how his storyline has main evented the last few PPVs, including closing the show over the triumphantly returning Cena (something that many of Punk's fans wanted him to do as champion, while Cena feuded with Laurinaitis).

Also, holding out hope for Bryan to topple another legend in order to really prove HHH wrong doesn't strike me as that necessary for his rep. He's already KO'ed and pinned the 14 time champion who won his last title off of Rock, so that alone already established in the narrative that HHH and Steph are full of it.

[Jonathan Michaels]

I was at the Raw this past Monday, and merch wise, Bryan was heavily represented, actually, only six wrestlers even had shirts there.

Bryan had 3
Cena had 3
Punk had 3
Orton had 2
Miz had 1
Ziggler had 1

There were also Bryan beards, Bryan rally towels, and several other miscellaneous items.

Believe me, they have a financial interest in Bryan being a top guy.

[nonrev]

I think the main issue is that they've cried wolf on Bryan too many times when it comes to the title. Now if Bryan ever does get another title shot we'll always be looking out for the inevitable screw-job that will come his way during/after the match. For a lot of people, this booking has taken the joy out of being a Daniel Bryan fan. It was a similar feeling when Christian lost to Randy after he just won the title. It just makes some fans feel deflated with disappointment.

[angryfan]

I'll say it, flat out, unless Triple H allows himself to be Vince'ed, or winds up taking a Foley-esque beating like Mick did for him oh so many times, then this thing has gone the way of the Triple H/Punk "feud" and Trips/Booker. Toss in Trips/Hurricane, where it was some weird pissing contest between Hunter and The Rock, while we're at it.

[Deleted]

I think to make everyone feel better, some RAW should open with Bryan just beating Steph with a baseball bat for about 20 minutes or so in the ring.

[Deleted]

Nov 2, 2013 19:22:36 GMT -5 nonrev said:

I think the main issue is that they've cried wolf on Bryan too many times when it comes to the title. Now if Bryan ever does get another title shot we'll always be looking out for the inevitable screw-job that will come his way during/after the match. For a lot of people, this booking has taken the joy out of being a Daniel Bryan fan. It was a similar feeling when Christian lost to Randy after he just won the title. It just makes some fans feel deflated with disappointment.

This is interesting.
I saw the main event of Rage In The Cage Hell In A Cell.
The crowd died a death when Orton pinned Bryan to win. People didn't cheer, people didn't boo. The crowd died.

It was strange.

[Deleted]

I think the fact that we're even having this discussion, and a lot of Bryan's biggest supporters have checked out during an angle in which he's main eventing 4 straight PPVs, speaks volumes. If our interest is shaken by all this, it's going to happen with others in the fanbase too. Bryan can get it back, because he's Bryan and he's done it before. But it feels like just throwing more obstacles in the way instead of just giving the fans what they wanted. He went from world champ getting squashed at Mania to the AJ Lee Vortex to tag champ to face turn to riding a wave of momentum to the WWE title, I think that 18+ month journey was sufficient in terms of holding things off and building anticipation to a peak. This latest installment of his story feels tacked on, it's frustrating as a fan.

[cabbageboy]

Again, the problem with HHH is that he's never really a liar in storyline all that much, nor is he shown to be wrong. Thus, even as a heel his statements still wield a lot of power when it comes to how fans view someone. My problem is that there is no way for Bryan to prove him wrong. Beating Cena and Orton doesn't make Bryan more marketable or capable of being "The Face of the WWE." It would be the equivalent of David Stern doing an interview on national TV before the NBA Finals saying "The San Antonio Spurs are not championship material. Tim Duncan and Co. have no charisma and don't draw any ratings. Lebron James and the Heat are the Face of the NBA."

If the endgame in all of this was Orton keeping the title, this should have ended at Night of Champions. Orton needed to win via a screwy finish there and HHH needed to say Bryan gets no further title shots barring something like winning the Rumble. The fact that they had nothing else in mind and dragged this out for another 3 PPVs just wrecked Bryan. The booking is so bizarre in that at NoC no one thought he had a shot given the way he was booked going in, yet he won clean. They did the fast count angle to strip him, then another PPV with a Big Show run in, then finally he jobbed at HIAC. Honestly a clean loss to Orton at NoC would be less damaging. All of these crappy finishes can't help but hurt the overall product and Bryan is hurt by association.

[EoE: Well There's Your Problem]

Nov 2, 2013 22:33:09 GMT -5 cabbageboy said:

Again, the problem with HHH is that he's never really a liar in storyline all that much, nor is he shown to be wrong. Thus, even as a heel his statements still wield a lot of power when it comes to how fans view someone. My problem is that there is no way for Bryan to prove him wrong.

I know what you mean, but I feel like it's different in this situation. If he was saying these things and Bryan was losing clean with no interference, then his statements would hold the weight they've always done, but he's actively meddling in these matches to prevent being proven wrong. Therefore, common sense should dictate that his words no longer hold any value since he's showing a clear bias.

[Bang Bang Bart]

Nov 2, 2013 19:59:57 GMT -5 @bootytime said:

I think to make everyone feel better, some RAW should open with Bryan just beating Steph with a baseball bat for about 20 minutes or so in the ring.

After that, Raw will consist of Bryan attacking every major heel right now: Singlehandedly beating up The Shield, assaulting the Wyatt Family during one of their creepy promos, and finally culminating with Bryan beating the shit out of Triple H for the entirely of the final hour, with the WWE App exclusive video of DB kicking Hunner's ass during the break. Raw ends with the entire roster raising Bryan on their shoulders, with Cena looking on and wiping away tears of happiness.

~ENTERTAINMENT~

[Hit Girl]

The key point is this... Triple H is actively sabotaging the guy, yes? So how the hell does that make Bryan look weak and prove Triple H right?

Because the hero should be taken seriously by the heel and should be booked to ultimately overcome the heel. If WWE were booking Die Hard, Hans Gruber would have dismissed the significance of John McClane, then be proven correct at the end by killing him rather easily.

No one other than HHH (surprise) has come out of this storyline well. DB looks weak, Orton looks like a monkey boy who merely holds the title rather than be a champion, and the Big Show's 473rd push is tiresome and a major distraction. All the fears skeptics had at the start have proven to be true. HHH has sidelined DB (like he did with Punk) and indeed Orton, and made himself and Big Show (this year's Kevin Nash) as the central part of it all.

HHH strikes again. As does WWE's insanely stupid self-defeating booking.

[sportatorium]

Nov 2, 2013 18:46:02 GMT -5 misconduct was wrong said:

Nov 2, 2013 18:21:35 GMT -5 sportatorium said:

Wow- I really hope that report is inaccurate. Having him "lose" the feud when the audience is that much behind him is really a bad move. Big Show has gotten more out of this than I ever thought possible, but he & Randy still have to get in the ring & provide an outcome for people putting down $ for a PPV. Mind numbing.

It doesn't say he'll lose the feud against the Wyatts. Given how this is set up, it would make sense for the Wyatts to beat Punk/Bryan for a month.

There's some good point counterpoint discussion going on here.

I think fans just look for different things to grasp at when defending their guy. Some care more about their guy being booked strong, even if it involves losing, others just want their guy to win. Think about RVD/Cena from One Night Stand. Edge won the match for RVD, and did the crowd care one bit? Hell no! They were chanting thank you Edge the second he revealed himself. They didn't care he wasn't booked that strong, their guy WON.

I'm mostly the same way. I'm less concerned with how strongly a guy is booked and care more about him just winning the important matches.

Bryan's story was great up until the Monday after Summerslam. Ever since then he's looked like a mindless monster. Beating up guys left and right, but oblivious to traps and getting outsmarted at every turn.

I was referring more to him losing the feud to HHH & Randy. No doubt in my mind that Bryan & Punk can elevate the Wyatt family (especially Luke Harper). I just don't understand at all building a babyface star to have him lose to a guy like Orton & transition the top face role to Big Show.

For me, Big Show & Orton are the guys who should be putting people over. Not main eventing with each other.

[Deleted]

Nov 2, 2013 16:28:54 GMT -5 @lovehater said:

I think you guys are missing the point that Bryan winning matches clean is underemphasized and swept under the rug by the angle, and that Bryan is portrayed as being able to win a wrestling match but not able to outsmart/thwart the corporate machinations, something Austin was able to do until that fall in 98 when it all caught up to him.

This is my biggest gripe, and the main reason I haven't even bothered to watch WWE programming in a month.

It doesn't matter if Bryan wins or loses, or even to what degree he beats the competition, when you know that HHH and Stephanie can just come out and say "LOLNOPE!11!!" to every face, they've essentially broken the story.

Whatever was going to happen to threaten their power, babyface Vince or anything else, should have happened long, looong ago.