|
Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Dec 7, 2013 19:04:23 GMT -5
If you were doing a modern Brawl for All, you should probably do it in an octagon with some MMA influences. I'd much rather have it done on an olympic mat or in a ring than in an octagon. I like watching MMA but I hate that every major promotion puts on their fights in cages, it makes me feel like I'm watching a B-movie from the 80s starring Jean-Claude van Dam and not a serious sport. The cage is part of the "spectacle" of MMA. I know it may carry the negative stigma of "human cockfighting" to some detractors, but I think most nowadays are used to watching MMA in a cage and may find a standard ring to be "awkward". I think the Brawl For All would be conducted in the ring simply because WWE would find it more convenient.
|
|
|
Post by TOK Is the Target Demo on Dec 7, 2013 19:06:52 GMT -5
Upset City: Dolph Ziggler with that Kent State wrestling background FTW. As awesome as it would be, he'd be squashed by anyone bigger than 6"2'. He was a middleweight in college and put on a lot of show muscle, he isn't like Angle who was the same height but wrestled as a 205er. And Catch_Us, I really hope you're joking.
|
|
|
Post by Drillbit Taylor on Dec 7, 2013 19:13:32 GMT -5
Im going to ignore what the OP said, and Im going to go with Big Show. Why not? Everybody else is. The reason I took several people out of competition in the post was for logical reasons. Nobody would risk putting main eventers in a shoot fight scenario--because they don't need it. Putting Lesnar in the tournament, for example, pretty much stacks it in his favor. Could somebody get a good punch in and beat him? Possibly. Is it likely? Hell no. I understand. LOL In all honesty, I would go with Santino, he has some background and seems like a legit fighter.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2013 19:15:05 GMT -5
Upset City: Dolph Ziggler with that Kent State wrestling background FTW. As awesome as it would be, he'd be squashed by anyone bigger than 6"2'. He was a middleweight in college and put on a lot of show muscle, he isn't like Angle who was the same height but wrestled as a 205er. And Catch_Us, I really hope you're joking. That's why I called it an upset. He'd be like that Japanese guy from Rickson Gracies Choke documentary, beating bigger guys with amazing technique (and hopefully two eyes). Still I'd say that with the evolution of MMA and knowledge about the sport, the hypothetical Brawl for All 2 would really require a weight class (or two) of some kind to even the playing field. The 400 pound freakshows in the same bracket as a 175 pound guy is so 1995.
|
|
|
Post by TOK Is the Target Demo on Dec 7, 2013 19:16:50 GMT -5
As awesome as it would be, he'd be squashed by anyone bigger than 6"2'. He was a middleweight in college and put on a lot of show muscle, he isn't like Angle who was the same height but wrestled as a 205er. And Catch_Us, I really hope you're joking. That's why I called it an upset. He'd be like that Japanese guy from Rickson Gracies Choke documentary, beating bigger guys with amazing technique (and hopefully two eyes). Still I'd say with the evolution of MMA and knowledge about the sport, the hypothetical Brawl for All 2 would really require a weight class (or two) of some kind to even the playing field. Yeah, unless they want to see one of their independent contractors seriously injured, they'd need to do a cruiserweight/heavyweight split.
|
|
|
Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Dec 7, 2013 19:21:44 GMT -5
Bat Gunn only won because no one besides Blackman (who was forced to redraw, with no mention of it made) tried a single takedown. It was just all lummoxes out there doing sloppy toughman boxing. A complete uncoordinated abortion out there. Edit: Actually Severn did too, but he dropped out after realizing how much the whole thing could damage his credibility. To me that's all it should have ever been because it is one of the most poorly thought out things in wrestling history. Supposedly it was designed for Dr. Death to win and show how tough that he was, but Dr. Death hadn't wrestled(Olympic) competitively in like 20 years prior, Marc Mero was a golden gloves winner, IIRC Scorpio was at least a golden gloves contender, Severn was a legit fighter and could have stretched anyone had he stayed in, Blackman was a legit fighter, Bradshaw and the Godfather are big barroom brawler types. The E being stupid enough to make it a shoot rendered any chance of it being anything other than a clustersmurf nil from jump street. The wild brawling is the only thing that saved it from being completely ridiculous. It's hard to even verbalize how stupid that it was all around. This was the inherent problem with the Brawl for All. The fact that it was a shoot really wasn't that bad, since that was the appeal, and that's what set it apart from the rest of the product. WWE shouldn't have planned a guy's push entirely around it. They made it a shoot, and then buried Bart Gunn for winning when he wasn't "supposed" to. If WWE makes a modern Brawl for All, it SHOULD be a shoot, but nothing should be planned around it and no angles, storylines, or pushes should hinge upon a specific result. Let them fight each other for real but whoever wins wins. If an upper midcard guy wins, cool beans. If a random jobber wins, keep him in the low card, but just stop booking him like a scrub. You don't have to push a guy to the moon or bury them to hell.
|
|
Perd
Patti Mayonnaise
Leslie needs to butt out for fear of receiving The Bunghole Buster
Posts: 32,416
|
Post by Perd on Dec 7, 2013 19:26:37 GMT -5
Put Brodus, Bray, Tensai, Show, Big E., and a returning Big Daddy V in there. Call it the Bra For All and the winner finally gets some support.
|
|
Crappler El 0 M
Dalek
Never Forgets an Octagon
I'm a good R-Truth.
Posts: 58,479
|
Post by Crappler El 0 M on Dec 7, 2013 19:28:53 GMT -5
Brock would probably win. Jack Swagger would probably do well too since I could see him being able to pull off take-downs. If you remember from the original Brawl for All, Steve Blackman was the only one to really use the take-down to its full potential. He repeatedly took down Marc Mero who had no defense for it. Dan Severn was frustrated with the Brawl for All rules because it was counter-intuitive for him to take someone down and then just let them get right back up. Dan Severn would have destroyed people if he could use his wrestling skills once he took them down. He also hated fighting in big gloves.
Santino has an MMA background and runs an MMA gym in Toronto. Dolph and Cody have amateur wrestling backgrounds (as does Swagger), with Dolph having a very successful career in high school and college.
I sense that Antonio Cesaro is a tough man and could probably fair well.
Since this is hypothetical, I think Brock Lesnar (who obviously wouldn't even participate) and Swagger would be favorites, especially if they studied the Steve Blackman fight.
|
|
|
Post by Amazing Kitsune on Dec 7, 2013 20:22:00 GMT -5
I'd be interested to see Ryback in it as well. He certainly looks like a tough guy. Who knows if those looks mean anything, though.
|
|
|
Post by TOK Is the Target Demo on Dec 7, 2013 20:51:25 GMT -5
I'd be interested to see Ryback in it as well. He certainly looks like a tough guy. Who knows if those looks mean anything, though. He'd get stomped. Sure, he has big muscles and performs out of this world on lifts, but that doesn't mean shit when someone starts tagging you for real. Cesaro's real life stronger, anyway.
|
|
|
Post by Amazing Kitsune on Dec 7, 2013 21:40:26 GMT -5
I'd be interested to see Ryback in it as well. He certainly looks like a tough guy. Who knows if those looks mean anything, though. He'd get stomped. Sure, he has big muscles and performs out of this world on lifts, but that doesn't mean shit when someone starts tagging you for real. Cesaro's real life stronger, anyway. It doesn't mean much when somebody who knows what they're doing tags you, that's true, but size does matter. If he's facing somebody of equal experience I'd bet on him. Size doesn't matter as a rule. However, all things being equal--size matters.
|
|
|
Post by tekkenguy on Dec 7, 2013 21:44:26 GMT -5
IMO, the winner should be someone aggressive.
Someone like....Alberto Del Rio.
|
|
Bad Moon
Unicron
for reasons known only to the goblins that live in my brain
Posts: 3,091
|
Post by Bad Moon on Dec 8, 2013 9:04:31 GMT -5
Isn't Shad from Crime Time supposedly a huge badass with a legit judo, boxing and systema background? What happened to Crime Time anyway, I don't remember them getting released but I don't think they've been on TV in forever either.
|
|
|
Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Dec 8, 2013 9:11:19 GMT -5
If it were to include anyone, Brock easily. The only guy who's been in WWE the last 5 years who I could see maybe beating Brock would be Vladimir Kozlov.
Mid carders it would be Swagger who would win.
|
|
|
Post by jason1980s on Dec 8, 2013 9:32:53 GMT -5
If it was anything like the 1998 version it will be won by a tag team jobber to the stars and in the final match he will have beaten the guy who thinks he's the biggest, baddest man on the planet so I'm thinking finals will be Primo or Epico versus Brock Lesnar.
|
|
|
Post by Hit Girl on Dec 8, 2013 9:41:53 GMT -5
Brock would win
And quite possibly kill several wrestlers along the way.
|
|
Crappler El 0 M
Dalek
Never Forgets an Octagon
I'm a good R-Truth.
Posts: 58,479
|
Post by Crappler El 0 M on Dec 8, 2013 10:22:46 GMT -5
Isn't Shad from Crime Time supposedly a huge badass with a legit judo, boxing and systema background? What happened to Crime Time anyway, I don't remember them getting released but I don't think they've been on TV in forever either. Shad was released a few years ago. JTG is still with WWE, though they don't ever use him. He dresses differently from his Cryme Time days and was a heel last time I remember seeing him. He was one of the early jobbers to Ryback. He had complained on Twitter about WrestleMania pay for lower-card guys and these matches with Ryback appeared to be punishment for him as I think Michael Cole said mockingly said something about complaining on Twitter during the match.
|
|
BigWill
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 16,619
|
Post by BigWill on Dec 8, 2013 10:33:28 GMT -5
If I were to actually listen to the OP's guidelines, I'd have to say Swagger as well.
Not only does he have a legit wrestling background, but he's a big guy as well. He also has good speed for someone his size, ridiculous strength, and a long reach. He's basically built perfectly for this kind of match.
|
|
|
Post by Wolf Hawkfield no1 NZ poster on Dec 8, 2013 16:01:13 GMT -5
Obviously if Brock was involved he would destroy everyone easily so having him be in it would be both pointless and stupid.
While yes Swagger could do well but it would still be a trainwreak of epic proportions as like Jim Cornette said having a bunch of professional wrestlers with no combat sports experience fight each other for real is just plain stupid.
|
|
SEAN CARLESS
Hank Scorpio
More of a B+ player, actually
I'm Necessary Evil.
Posts: 5,770
|
Post by SEAN CARLESS on Dec 8, 2013 16:18:55 GMT -5
If it was anything like the 1998 version it will be won by a tag team jobber to the stars and in the final match he will have beaten the guy who thinks he's the biggest, baddest man on the planet so I'm thinking finals will be Primo or Epico versus Brock Lesnar. That analogy would make more sense if the guy who thinks he's "the biggest, baddest man on the planet" in this case wasn't a professionally trained fighter who was Champion of earth for two straight years. You know, as opposed to a lumbering, flabby ex-football player with zero pro fight experience sloppy toughman boxing a cowboy --a cowboy who got knocked out by a z-level novelty boxer in his first pro fight in seconds. Seriously, and I don't mean to sound like a dick, but I hate these kinds of threads because of the fight ignorance that usually is contained within them. And this thread is riddled with it. Almost comically. If you are going to honestly try and pontificate a guess as to who would win a structured fight, comprised with takedowns and striking, you'd have to go with the guy who A) was the National Champion of the United States college wrestling system, and not just a small time high school or college star who didn't even sniff an NCAA title, and B) a guy who, you know, actually had real national success at the highest professional level there is, and not carny liars, light-heavyweight judoka's who have never beat anything other than tomato cans, a guy whose MMA highlight reel is getting kicked in the face by Cro-Cop in 15 seconds and nearly killed, or a guy who does Gymnasium Sambo.
|
|