Hypnosis
T
Posts: 99,235
Member is Online
|
Post by Hypnosis on Dec 20, 2014 15:19:29 GMT -5
Hey JBL managed to hold the world title almost a year, here would be his list of moves during a PPV main event. forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back stomp punch punch punch in the corner sleeper hold forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back interference Clothesline Talk to a big Godzilla doll Get knocked down by Joey Styles
|
|
gr1990
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,485
|
Post by gr1990 on Dec 20, 2014 15:41:53 GMT -5
Hey JBL managed to hold the world title almost a year, here would be his list of moves during a PPV main event. forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back stomp punch punch punch in the corner sleeper hold forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back interference Clothesline But JBL didn't have a past in another territory where he was shown to be proficient at a variety of styles. Plus he was 6'6 and 300 pounds, he didn't need to be busting out hurricanranas, particularly since his being limited in the ring was used to draw heat. Again, I'm not saying lots of moves = good match/wrestler, basic moves = bad match/wrestler, I'm saying two technically-sound wrestlers now do nothing more elaborate that a headbutt outside of their finishers. They're small, athletic women with a ton of skill and they now have a Kevin Nash/Torrie Wilson hybrid moveset and that's pretty damn sad.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 16:17:02 GMT -5
Hey JBL managed to hold the world title almost a year, here would be his list of moves during a PPV main event. forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back stomp punch punch punch in the corner sleeper hold forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back interference Clothesline But JBL didn't have a past in another territory where he was shown to be proficient at a variety of styles. Plus he was 6'6 and 300 pounds, he didn't need to be busting out hurricanranas, particularly since his being limited in the ring was used to draw heat. Again, I'm not saying lots of moves = good match/wrestler, basic moves = bad match/wrestler, I'm saying two technically-sound wrestlers now do nothing more elaborate that a headbutt outside of their finishers. They're small, athletic women with a ton of skill and they now have a Kevin Nash/Torrie Wilson hybrid moveset and that's pretty damn sad. Chuck Taylor and Colt Cabana are two of the most technically proficient wrestlers around and yet some of my favorite matches are just them goofing off and having fun. End of the day it's a "Wrestling" show but people are there to get entertained. It's better to know a thousand moves but keep the people who pay you happy while using a dozen of them than to only know 4 holds...
|
|
Dshuks
Bubba Ho-Tep
Posts: 520
|
Post by Dshuks on Dec 20, 2014 19:01:00 GMT -5
I think people are looking back at Paige and Emma's nxt matches with rose colored glasses , their matches ( more-so Emma's) have always been pretty basic. Paige has always been more of a brawler and Emma doesn't even really have a style to speak of she's just really bland.
|
|
Steveweiser
Dalek
Mickie Mickie You're So Fine... Hey Mickie!
THE GRAPS
Posts: 50,249
|
Post by Steveweiser on Dec 20, 2014 19:09:08 GMT -5
You can have really quick matches that are good to great, and really long matches that either suck or completely overdo it. It's what you do in the time given that counts. Of course this wasn't the NXT arRIVAL match, or the first NXT match where Paige won the title, it was never going to be. Paige is in limbo right now waiting for Total Divas to start up, and Emma has even less going on. Hence why they were given very little, but with a point to highlight Paige's character. Of all the things going on in the WWE right now, worrying about a short Divas match on Main Event is the least of them.
|
|
|
Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 20, 2014 19:11:51 GMT -5
It's more important to make the most of less than trying to bust out every move you know. As a fan of Southern style pro wrestling, I seen crowds spellbound by armdrags, headlocks, and bodyslams. Contrast that to matches I seen guys going 90's All Japan strong style and the crowd reacting like a fart in church.
|
|
|
Post by Digital Witness on Dec 20, 2014 19:21:00 GMT -5
Punk's interview provided the best explanation IMO. If Vince is horrified by the prospect of women in MMA, it sheds light on why WWE women's wrestling is relatively timid. He probably feels that the audience doesn't want to see hard hitting women's wrestling, which also explains why things are so different on NXT In order for WWE to make any progress of any kind, Vince needs to go. All there is to it. I'm positive if the women were booked on Raw the way they are on NXT, people would care a whole hell of a lot more about the diva's division. I dare say they could potentially turn a significantly higher profit from giving us a slightly toned down for tv Charlotte vs Banks and the like on a regular basis than what we usually get. It also doesn't hurt to have more than one diva's feud going on at a time and giving them more promo time. I know Vince wants us to see the same promo package 92347823957238523 times a night, but I think there's a better use of tv time.
|
|
Dshuks
Bubba Ho-Tep
Posts: 520
|
Post by Dshuks on Dec 20, 2014 19:38:28 GMT -5
It's more important to make the most of less than trying to bust out every move you know. As a fan of Southern style pro wrestling, I seen crowds spellbound by armdrags, headlocks, and bodyslams. Contrast that to matches I seen guys going 90's All Japan strong style and the crowd reacting like a fart in church. Thats nice but not everyone likes that type of style , I personally find it really boring. I get the idea of making moves matter and not going overboard with spots but the way current divas wrestle nowadays is taking that to the extreme and it kills their matches .Not to mention I don't find Emma's Santino-eqsque silliness or Paige's Pseudo-Lesbain nonsense amusing . I'd much rather see a match like this than Paige and Emma's dull effort. This match wasn't much longer than Paige vs Emma yet had much more substance to it while telling a solid story ( Young small rookie trying to overcome the much bigger monster veteran) No wrestler in this match has more than 4 years of experience with one of them(Koguma) having less than one btw .
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 19:44:34 GMT -5
They should just drop a huge chunk of the Divas division from the main show and make it an NXT thing, It's clear Vince, Dunn & (Un)creative don't give a tom tit and just treat it like a joke. At least in NXT they'll be able to perform how they want. They can still have the Total Divas on RAW and have their crap since that's what they do care about You realize "the Total Divas" includes Paige now, right?
|
|
|
Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 20, 2014 19:46:49 GMT -5
It's more important to make the most of less than trying to bust out every move you know. As a fan of Southern style pro wrestling, I seen crowds spellbound by armdrags, headlocks, and bodyslams. Contrast that to matches I seen guys going 90's All Japan strong style and the crowd reacting like a fart in church. Thats nice but not everyone likes that type of style , I personally find it really boring. I get the idea of making moves matter and not going overboard with spots but the way current divas wrestle nowadays is taking that to the extreme and it kills their matches .Not to mention I don't find Emma's Santino-eqsque silliness or Paige's Pseudo-Lesbain nonsense amusing . I'd much rather see a match like this than Paige and Emma's dull effort. This match wasn't much longer than Paige vs Emma yet had much more substance to it while telling a solid story ( Young small rookie trying to overcome the much bigger monster veteran) No wrestler in this match has more than 4 years of experience with one of them(Koguma) having less than one btw . And that type of match isn't for everyone either. You have to learn to play to the crowd, feeding off their energy & reactions, and give them what they are wanting at the time. Workrate is fine and dandy but it doesn't mean shit if the crowd doesn't care. I don't watch a match and say "I can't like it because he didn't do his patented top rope brainbuster". I like it if it got me caught up in the moment and I want rewatch it to relive that.
|
|
|
Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Dec 20, 2014 19:47:52 GMT -5
Hey JBL managed to hold the world title almost a year, here would be his list of moves during a PPV main event. forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back stomp punch punch punch in the corner sleeper hold forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back forearm to the back interference Clothesline That's all it takes to be a WRESTLING GAWD.
|
|
Dshuks
Bubba Ho-Tep
Posts: 520
|
Post by Dshuks on Dec 20, 2014 20:05:41 GMT -5
Thats nice but not everyone likes that type of style , I personally find it really boring. I get the idea of making moves matter and not going overboard with spots but the way current divas wrestle nowadays is taking that to the extreme and it kills their matches .Not to mention I don't find Emma's Santino-eqsque silliness or Paige's Pseudo-Lesbain nonsense amusing . I'd much rather see a match like this than Paige and Emma's dull effort. This match wasn't much longer than Paige vs Emma yet had much more substance to it while telling a solid story ( Young small rookie trying to overcome the much bigger monster veteran) No wrestler in this match has more than 4 years of experience with one of them(Koguma) having less than one btw . And that type of match isn't for everyone either. You have to learn to play to the crowd, feeding off their energy & reactions, and give them what they are wanting at the time. Workrate is fine and dandy but it doesn't mean shit if the crowd doesn't care. I don't watch a match and say "I can't like it because he didn't do his patented top rope brainbuster". I like it if it got me caught up in the moment and I want rewatch it to relive that. You're being awfully dismissive and seem to place your opinion of wrestling as being more worthwhile than mine. You watch wrestling for the characters and apparently like Paige's whole annoying pseudo lesbianism act. I like wrestling for more of the sporting athletic aspect and like something to actually happen in the match ( a nice counter, innovative spot)). The match I posted was far from being a spot fest and the crowd was into it. Plus they actually used more than one or two wrestling moves. Which to "me" is important not so to you apparently.
|
|
|
Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 20, 2014 20:21:56 GMT -5
And that type of match isn't for everyone either. You have to learn to play to the crowd, feeding off their energy & reactions, and give them what they are wanting at the time. Workrate is fine and dandy but it doesn't mean shit if the crowd doesn't care. I don't watch a match and say "I can't like it because he didn't do his patented top rope brainbuster". I like it if it got me caught up in the moment and I want rewatch it to relive that. You're being awfully dismissive and seem to place your opinion of wrestling as being more worthwhile than mine. You watch wrestling for the characters and apparently like Paige's whole annoying pseudo lesbianism act. I like wrestling for more of the sporting athletic aspect and like something to actually happen in the match ( a nice counter, innovative spot)). The match I posted was far from being a spot fest and the crowd was into it. Plus they actually used more than one or two wrestling moves. Which to "me" is important not so to you apparently. No, I'm just expressing my opinion about pro wrestling. You got it wrong about me liking Paige's fake lesbian gimmick. I hate that gimmick with a passion. Read some of my old posts about that. I like wrestling to be a variety of things. You took my comment about be a fan of the Southern style as my overall mindset. Farthest from it. I watch all types of wrestling. Probably more than the average wrestling fan. And no crowd is the same. One of the important things a wrestler should know is how to read and engage a crowd. That something a lot of wrestling vets like Steve Austin and Dusty Rhodes talk about.
|
|
Dshuks
Bubba Ho-Tep
Posts: 520
|
Post by Dshuks on Dec 20, 2014 20:50:12 GMT -5
You're being awfully dismissive and seem to place your opinion of wrestling as being more worthwhile than mine. You watch wrestling for the characters and apparently like Paige's whole annoying pseudo lesbianism act. I like wrestling for more of the sporting athletic aspect and like something to actually happen in the match ( a nice counter, innovative spot)). The match I posted was far from being a spot fest and the crowd was into it. Plus they actually used more than one or two wrestling moves. Which to "me" is important not so to you apparently. No, I'm just expressing my opinion about pro wrestling. You got it wrong about me liking Paige's fake lesbian gimmick. I hate that gimmick with a passion. Read some of my old posts about that. I like wrestling to be a variety of things. You took my comment about be a fan of the Southern style as my overall mindset. Farthest from it. I watch all types of wrestling. Probably more than the average wrestling fan. And no crowd is the same. One of the important things a wrestler should know is how to read and engage a crowd. That something a lot of wrestling vets like Steve Austin and Dusty Rhodes talk about. Thats fine doesn't change the fact that I personally found this match of Paige Emma's to be very bland, and find Emma to be a boring wrestler overall. I don't think Emma would be capable of putting on a match a joshi type of crowd would enjoy she's on the low end of WWE's indy female signings in terms of pure wrestling talent and soil from a work rate standpoint.
|
|
|
Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 20, 2014 21:06:48 GMT -5
No, I'm just expressing my opinion about pro wrestling. You got it wrong about me liking Paige's fake lesbian gimmick. I hate that gimmick with a passion. Read some of my old posts about that. I like wrestling to be a variety of things. You took my comment about be a fan of the Southern style as my overall mindset. Farthest from it. I watch all types of wrestling. Probably more than the average wrestling fan. And no crowd is the same. One of the important things a wrestler should know is how to read and engage a crowd. That something a lot of wrestling vets like Steve Austin and Dusty Rhodes talk about. Thats fine doesn't change the fact that I personally found this match of Paige Emma's to be very bland, and find Emma to be a boring wrestler overall. I don't think Emma would be capable of putting on a match a joshi type of crowd would enjoy she's on the low end of WWE's indy female signings in terms of pure wrestling talent and soil from a work rate standpoint. Well WWE didn't hire Emma to put on joshi type matches or wow them with workrate. Some people like the match. Some people didn't. Still doesn't change anything about her position on the card.
|
|
cait
Trap-Jaw
Posts: 376
|
Post by cait on Dec 21, 2014 1:19:24 GMT -5
Thought it was a professional match and enjoyed it.
|
|
gr1990
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,485
|
Post by gr1990 on Dec 21, 2014 1:41:12 GMT -5
It's more important to make the most of less than trying to bust out every move you know. As a fan of Southern style pro wrestling, I seen crowds spellbound by armdrags, headlocks, and bodyslams. Contrast that to matches I seen guys going 90's All Japan strong style and the crowd reacting like a fart in church. WWE isn't southern-style wrestling though, most WWE fans expect more and these two performers are capable of more. I'm not saying it was the worst match I've ever seen or even the worst thing that's happened to the Divas division in the past fortnight, and I've said repeatedly that a limited amount of moves doesn't equal a bad match necessarily, it's just that it's a sad reflection on the limitations WWE appears to be putting on its women. No one can watch that match and then watch one of either girl's short TV matches from NXT and tell me this was a better showcase for their skills or that they're not working a more restricted style on the main roster. It's very unlikely a WWE men's match in 2014 would ever not have a single suplex, slam or top rope move in it, and would probably be panned if it did.
|
|
Heartbreaker
King Koopa
Is actually Bindi Irwin
RIP Punk's media scrum, Page 54, Muffins, Biting People Bad™ (2022 - 2022)
Posts: 11,846
|
Post by Heartbreaker on Dec 21, 2014 2:23:45 GMT -5
This type of sexist bullshit doesn't surprise me. I believe years ago Mickie James wasn't allowed to punch a certain way because either Cena or one of the guys did it.
|
|
BigWill
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 16,619
|
Post by BigWill on Dec 21, 2014 5:54:28 GMT -5
But JBL didn't have a past in another territory where he was shown to be proficient at a variety of styles. Plus he was 6'6 and 300 pounds, he didn't need to be busting out hurricanranas, particularly since his being limited in the ring was used to draw heat. Again, I'm not saying lots of moves = good match/wrestler, basic moves = bad match/wrestler, I'm saying two technically-sound wrestlers now do nothing more elaborate that a headbutt outside of their finishers. They're small, athletic women with a ton of skill and they now have a Kevin Nash/Torrie Wilson hybrid moveset and that's pretty damn sad. Chuck Taylor and Colt Cabana are two of the most technically proficient wrestlers around and yet some of my favorite matches are just them goofing off and having fun. End of the day it's a "Wrestling" show but people are there to get entertained. It's better to know a thousand moves but keep the people who pay you happy while using a dozen of them than to only know 4 holds... You'd make a sound argument...if anyone was actually happy with the current state of the Divas division.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2014 6:07:23 GMT -5
Chuck Taylor and Colt Cabana are two of the most technically proficient wrestlers around and yet some of my favorite matches are just them goofing off and having fun. End of the day it's a "Wrestling" show but people are there to get entertained. It's better to know a thousand moves but keep the people who pay you happy while using a dozen of them than to only know 4 holds... You'd make a sound argument...if anyone was actually happy with the current state of the Divas division. End of the day, the people who sign their checks are obviously happy with that type of match so we can't blame the ladies for placating them. The problem comes from the fact that, in an ideal world, the Company would only be happy if the Fans were happy. We don't have that at the moment. It's not a matter of the performers pleasing the fans to make the company happy, it's a matter of the Company being happy with their own direction no matter what the f*** the fans think. In that (worst case) scenario, which we're currently in, the fans don't mean dick. The performers aren't even performing for them, but for the guys who sign their paychecks. We mean nothing. We're just kneeling on the floor beside Vince eating his crumbs off the floor and dealing with it. Why? Because crumbs are better than nothing and enough of us keep watching while just bitching about it online. To be fair though, even if a lot less watched, I don't think WWE would change their M.O. very much, and, as a fan, knowing your opinion doesn't mean shit is just about the worst thing possible when it comes to what you're choosing as entertainment.
|
|