Jeff Mangum PI
Hank Scorpio
11 herbs and spices for the rest of eternity; Is Number Two. Number Two!
The 2nd Coming
Posts: 6,957
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Post by Jeff Mangum PI on Aug 29, 2015 11:17:48 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure the main event for the next Takeover is gonna be Balor vs Itami. With Finn as the heel.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Aug 29, 2015 11:19:29 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure the main event for the next Takeover is gonna be Balor vs Itami. With Finn as the heel. Isn't the next Takeover the one in the UK? If so... I don't see him being Heel there.
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Jeff Mangum PI
Hank Scorpio
11 herbs and spices for the rest of eternity; Is Number Two. Number Two!
The 2nd Coming
Posts: 6,957
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Post by Jeff Mangum PI on Aug 29, 2015 11:20:52 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure the main event for the next Takeover is gonna be Balor vs Itami. With Finn as the heel. Isn't the next Takeover the one in the UK? If so... I don't see him being Heel there. That's in December, the next one is in October.
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Post by Mayonnaise on Aug 29, 2015 11:28:31 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure the main event for the next Takeover is gonna be Balor vs Itami. With Finn as the heel. I don't think there will be enough time with the tag tourney event going on and Joe talking about wanting the title. Itami would be more likely in Dec. or Feb. I would think. I can see Balor turning heel to face Joe however. As for the topic. Tough one. Everything seems there but he's not clicking at all. All the supposed blow away matches weren't, they had nothing to them expect Balor bringing the Boogeyman paint. They need to have him have great matches as Finn and not the Demon. I could Him and Joe having a good hard hitting match (that Finn cheats to win). Itami is another.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2015 11:31:05 GMT -5
Honestly I'm not really convinced at this point he has the capability to put on a classic. He's good to be sure, but nothing special from what I've seen.
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Post by basicdugganomix on Aug 29, 2015 11:46:07 GMT -5
Neville, if they bring back him for one night They tore the house down in Korakuen Hall (NJPW) few years ago. They already fought at Takeover, it was average. I don't think Balor is good enough to steal the show like that, honestly. He is good but the weakest of the Indy guys by far. Being fair though, his move list was stolen before he signed like Itami. It's hard to adapt when everyone has already seen your stuff. Itami and Bálor aren't coming from the indies. They are coming from the two top japanese promotions. They worked in front of huge crowds. What it looks like to me is bálor learning the wwe formula and not having a feud worth getting invested in. Owens and Zayn had a great backdrop. Zayn/neville also had a great build. Balor won a tourney and faced owens at bite. Then owens got his rematch in brooklyn. A contract signing and a promo segment where owens shits on full sail do not a great feud make. Good matches are fine. But a good match or average match can be made better with a greatly booked match. A heel Joe talking about taking nxt for himself and how he hates younger guys coming up when he's been at it for years. Came up with bryan and cena. It is his time to say the champ is here. Full on heel joe vs flashy babyface balor. With joe just destroying balor for weeks before the match and promos about joe calling balor his bitch. Heat.
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Post by idislikeeverything on Aug 29, 2015 12:06:05 GMT -5
Joe is a better face though. He can talk for a start, Balor sounds comatose when talking.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2015 12:45:33 GMT -5
It's not the matches he needs a standout of. All of them have been good to great. What he needs is a storyline, he really hasn't had one yet. Hit the nail on the head. Balor's put on a bunch of quality matches and is very over, but he needs a legit storyline to put him over the top.
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Madagascar Fred
El Dandy
TAFKA roidzilla and SUFFERIN' SUCCOTASH SON!
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Post by Madagascar Fred on Aug 29, 2015 17:02:22 GMT -5
Depends on what you consider standout. I've given three of his matches this year ****¼. The one against Adrian Neville at Rival, the Beast in the East match and the ladder match in Brooklyn. I do think his best stuff will be with Hideo Itami when he returns. I'd also love a Finn/Zayn match. Yeah three ****+ matches apparently aren't standout matches according to OP...gotta go ****** I guess
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2015 17:11:01 GMT -5
Depends on what you consider standout. I've given three of his matches this year ****¼. The one against Adrian Neville at Rival, the Beast in the East match and the ladder match in Brooklyn. I do think his best stuff will be with Hideo Itami when he returns. I'd also love a Finn/Zayn match. Yeah three ****+ matches apparently aren't standout matches according to OP...gotta go ****** I guess That just leaves you with Melina vs Alicia Fox.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2015 18:03:53 GMT -5
Depends on what you consider standout. I've given three of his matches this year ****¼. The one against Adrian Neville at Rival, the Beast in the East match and the ladder match in Brooklyn. I do think his best stuff will be with Hideo Itami when he returns. I'd also love a Finn/Zayn match. Yeah three ****+ matches apparently aren't standout matches according to OP...gotta go ****** I guess You know people have different views on matches, right? Personally I thought the ladder match was decent but nothing special and the Neville match was mostly dull and only really started to heat up right before it ended. Not seen the Japan match.
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Post by Mayonnaise on Aug 29, 2015 18:28:05 GMT -5
Yeah three ****+ matches apparently aren't standout matches according to OP...gotta go ****** I guess You know people have different views on matches, right? Personally I thought the ladder match was decent but nothing special and the Neville match was mostly dull and only really started to heat up right before it ended. Not seen the Japan match. Exactly. Balor hasn't blown me away with anything. Call them 4 Star or whatever you want, Meltzer doesn't make my opinions and my opinion is he is missing something.
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Palmer
Trap-Jaw
Noodlemania
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Post by Palmer on Aug 29, 2015 23:28:03 GMT -5
Balor has been fine, but unspectacular. Even in NJPW I thought he was good, not great. I'm fairly certain if he didn't have body paint, he wouldn't be in WWE.
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Abdullah
Hank Scorpio
Thank you, Ishmeal Loves Bayley!
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Post by Abdullah on Aug 30, 2015 5:07:43 GMT -5
Give him an angle as well-built as Zayn/Neville, Zayn/Owens, or Bayley/Banks, and we'll see how it goes. I think this one is it. I begged for a friend who barely watches wrestling to check out Bayley/Sasha. He thought it was pretty good. Possibly the best women's match in WWE was "pretty good." But I get why he'd feel that way; as I said, he barely watches wrestling so he's not invested in the story. That shows you how important the storytelling aspect is to WWE and why, save for some exceptions every year, it feels so stale. WWE don't tell stories. Or, in the case of "The Demon Finn Balor" the stories and characters they do try to get across has no bearing on the match that eventually takes place. Finn's best match was the one where he first debuted the paint because he actually acted differently. They've totally dropped that part though.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Aug 30, 2015 5:09:16 GMT -5
Give him an angle as well-built as Zayn/Neville, Zayn/Owens, or Bayley/Banks, and we'll see how it goes. I think this one is it. I begged for a friend who barely watches wrestling to check out Bayley/Sasha. He thought it was pretty good. Possibly the best women's match in WWE was "pretty good." But I get why he'd feel that way; as I said, he barely watches wrestling so he's not invested in the story. That shows you how important the storytelling aspect is to WWE and why, save for some exceptions every year, it feels so stale. WWE don't tell stories. Or, in the case of "The Demon Finn Balor" the stories and characters they do try to get across has no bearing on the match that eventually takes place. Finn's best match was the one where he first debuted the paint because he actually acted differently. They've totally dropped that part though. It hasn't been completly dropped he usually uses a few different things when he's painted up... I had a list at some point in another thread like this... it's too early for me to remember... but the shotgun kick to the barricades is one and the final move of the ladder match the double foot stomp off the top of the ladder was more of a because f*** Kevin Owens move than something he needed to do to win.
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Abdullah
Hank Scorpio
Thank you, Ishmeal Loves Bayley!
Posts: 6,420
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Post by Abdullah on Aug 30, 2015 5:26:40 GMT -5
I think this one is it. I begged for a friend who barely watches wrestling to check out Bayley/Sasha. He thought it was pretty good. Possibly the best women's match in WWE was "pretty good." But I get why he'd feel that way; as I said, he barely watches wrestling so he's not invested in the story. That shows you how important the storytelling aspect is to WWE and why, save for some exceptions every year, it feels so stale. WWE don't tell stories. Or, in the case of "The Demon Finn Balor" the stories and characters they do try to get across has no bearing on the match that eventually takes place. Finn's best match was the one where he first debuted the paint because he actually acted differently. They've totally dropped that part though. It hasn't been completly dropped he usually uses a few different things when he's painted up... I had a list at some point in another thread like this... it's too early for me to remember... but the shotgun kick to the barricades is one and the final move of the ladder match the double foot stomp off the top of the ladder was more of a because f*** Kevin Owens move than something he needed to do to win. He's just very regular. If he's a demon, and not cosplaying, it should be readily apparent. At the very least if he's a demon, he shouldn't be in a resthold for two-thirds of a match. He should be special. Different.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Aug 30, 2015 5:28:48 GMT -5
I'm not saying he doesn't need to do more if they're going to push the Demon thing but he isn't exactly the same.
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
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Post by nisidhe on Aug 30, 2015 8:25:25 GMT -5
I think there's a sense of disappointment in Balor that's also been creeping into our experience with Daniel Bryan. We've had such high hopes for the0m and our expectations in general are so high that there's nobody now who's 100% capable of meeting them, much less exceeding them and delighting us. We've been pegging them firmly against our memories of some who went before that, even if they who went before by some miracle should return to the ring at the peak of their powers, we would still be disappointed.
Do we blame the WWE style for hobbling the new stars' ability to develop and create as wrestlers? Do we blame the collapse of the independent development system and of so many wrestling schools (who aren't needed if WWE has its Performance Center) for the stifling of diverse styles? Has wrestling simply hit the ceiling of what humans can safely (or even can at all) do?
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