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Post by CuJ0 Will Keep Dancing on Mar 31, 2016 15:31:06 GMT -5
So most of the marketable stars in the company are part timers and other made himself a star outside the company?
Nice.
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,296
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Post by Fade on Mar 31, 2016 15:45:27 GMT -5
So how many seconds did it take people reading this thread to realize if Ambrose was pushed the way Reigns is, he'd be outselling him in merch and ALSO not making the show look dumb with a bunch of face boos? I got it in about 2 seconds. Think WWE will figure it out by 2018? Ambrose has gotten pushed like Reigns, for the most part, and Rollins got a bigger push than either guy combined. Reigns still outsold both of them. No, he hasn't. Reigns has been pushed in every respect possible. Merch. Advertisements. Booking. Promoting. No one comes close besides a certain Mr. Cena.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 16:00:34 GMT -5
The WWE making so much money in spite of themselves is both comical and sad.
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Post by "Mr Wonderdick" Dick Dastardly on Mar 31, 2016 16:33:26 GMT -5
Yeah, because kids and casuals are just mindless ninnies who can't pick REAL talent like the hardcore fans on the internet. AMITIRE? Well, if nothing else, kids aren't the ones paying hundreds to thousands of dollars to be in PPV crowds, the ones directly spending money on merch, and the ones making up the bulk of the WWE's largely-over-40 audience that's presently rapidly evaporating. The kids are the ones that are helping them stay profitable. They are the ones asking mommy and daddy for the John Cena and Roman Reigns action figures and shirts. They're the ones that will sell extra tickets to shows, because even if the parents don't care for wrestling, they will still buy tickets for themselves and their kids, because their kids want to see it. Which is more than 40 year old Marky Mark going alone to see Roman Reigns in the main event so he can boo him like a BOSS. Also, those people who pay that much money to be in the crowd at major shows will always be there. Because, despite years of supposedly not listening to what "they" want, "they" keep coming back. People can boo Roman all they want, but if they still pay money to show up, then they can't be that upset over the direction of the company.
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Post by Lazy peon on Mar 31, 2016 16:42:05 GMT -5
The guys booked as the strongest are viewed as the strongest? Wtf??
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Post by HMARK Center on Mar 31, 2016 17:00:03 GMT -5
Well, if nothing else, kids aren't the ones paying hundreds to thousands of dollars to be in PPV crowds, the ones directly spending money on merch, and the ones making up the bulk of the WWE's largely-over-40 audience that's presently rapidly evaporating. The kids are the ones that are helping them stay profitable. They are the ones asking mommy and daddy for the John Cena and Roman Reigns action figures and shirts. They're the ones that will sell extra tickets to shows, because even if the parents don't care for wrestling, they will still buy tickets for themselves and their kids, because their kids want to see it. Which is more than 40 year old Marky Mark going alone to see Roman Reigns in the main event so he can boo him like a BOSS. Also, those people who pay that much money to be in the crowd at major shows will always be there. Because, despite years of supposedly not listening to what "they" want, "they" keep coming back. People can boo Roman all they want, but if they still pay money to show up, then they can't be that upset over the direction of the company. Problem is, WWE isn't attracting a young audience, at all. Their audience's average age skews older than Major League Baseball's, and MLB is having a bit of a crisis over the age issue at the moment. Plus, their flagship show is on 8-11pm on a school night and their chief vehicle for watching any material is a monthly charge online network, something that doesn't exactly rope in the youth market with no disposable income. They definitely need to appeal to kids again to get a new generation watching their show, but right now they live and die with their older fans. When you get down to brass tacks, the bulk of WWE's audience came into watching it around the time of Hogan's heyday, and has stuck around or floated in and out at various times since; the eras since haven't exactly attracted a ton of new fans.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 17:26:43 GMT -5
You know this is bullshit right? It's not bullshit just because you disagree with it. Reigns was the most protected of the three, that much is obvious. But both he and Ambrose have alternated between time in the midcard and the main event pretty evenly - Reigns was main eventing while Ambrose was slumming it with the IC title, and Reigns was in the midcard while Ambrose was main eventing against Rollins, both in 2014 and 2015. Even as recently as the build-up to Fastlane and Roadblock, you had Ambrose being booked just as strongly as Reigns if not more so. And Rollins, for as much as people bitch about Reigns being shoved down people's throats, Rollins was the one who was showing up 5 times per Raw episode, opening and closing nearly every show. Win/loss records aside, all three Shield dudes are obviously being pushed really heavily. What exactly about any of that is bullshit? No, he hasn't. Reigns has been pushed in every respect possible. Merch. Advertisements. Booking. Promoting. No one comes close besides a certain Mr. Cena. Ambrose and Rollins got pushed really, really strongly, dude. Rollins practically had Raw built around him and Ambrose has the largest selection of merchandise out of any non-Cena guy on WWE Shop. Reigns is the most protected in terms of wins and losses but you're acting like Ambrose and Rollins were treated like random-ass midcarders in comparison when that's really, obviously not the case.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 17:36:34 GMT -5
You know this is bullshit right? It's not bullshit just because you disagree with it. Reigns was the most protected of the three, that much is obvious. But both he and Ambrose have alternated between time in the midcard and the main event pretty evenly - Reigns was main eventing while Ambrose was slumming it with the IC title, and Reigns was in the midcard while Ambrose was main eventing against Rollins, both in 2014 and 2015. Even as recently as the build-up to Fastlane and Roadblock, you had Ambrose being booked just as strongly as Reigns if not more so. And Rollins, for as much as people bitch about Reigns being shoved down people's throats, Rollins was the one who was showing up 5 times per Raw episode, opening and closing nearly every show. Win/loss records aside, all three Shield dudes are obviously being pushed really heavily. What exactly about any of that is bullshit? No, he hasn't. Reigns has been pushed in every respect possible. Merch. Advertisements. Booking. Promoting. No one comes close besides a certain Mr. Cena. Ambrose and Rollins got pushed really, really strongly, dude. Rollins practically had Raw built around him and Ambrose has the largest selection of merchandise out of any non-Cena guy on WWE Shop. Reigns is the most protected in terms of wins and losses but you're acting like Ambrose and Rollins were treated like random-ass midcarders in comparison when that's really, obviously not the case. It's bullshit to compare Reigns and his push to Ambrose and Rollins. I'll say it again. Reigns... -Most Rumble eliminations in a Rumble in history -Eliminated 4 men in a Survivor Series match -Royal Rumble winner -2 time WWE Champion -Has never been pinned clean in a 1v1 match since 2012 in FCW -Only Shield member to beat Punk Ambrose and Reigns don't have near the amount of shit Roman has. It. Is. Bullshit. Hell Reigns beat Rollins clean before the HIAC match with Ambrose and gave him his first clean loss on a random Raw. Reigns beat Ambrose clean twice. Ambrose and Rollins have lost clean many times, Reigns hasn't. Ambrose and Rollins have lost 1v1 feuds, Reigns hasn't. I'm not even getting into the fact WON said the whole reason Shield was created was to get Roman over. That was it's main goal. Dawg if you disagree you don't know what a push is. The whole point of it revolves around wins and losses. It's about accomplishments. This isn't debatable.
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Mar 31, 2016 17:50:11 GMT -5
Yeah AJ Styles is surprising but I imagine being known for the best wrestler to never wrestle in the WWE for nearly 15 years (minus Sting) has helped a lot. Plus AJ Styles looks way more marketable being clean cut and shaven since he looks pretty goofy with his borderline mullet and immaculate groomed facial hair He's also popular within specific communities. Yeah, Blacks, Asians, and people in small Eastern European countries love AJ Styles.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 17:52:05 GMT -5
Ambrose and Reigns don't have near the amount of shit Roman has. Dawg if you disagree you don't know what a push is. This isn't debatable. If you're talking strictly in terms of kayfabe accolades, sure - I said in my opening comment that Reigns was the most protected out of the three. But kayfabe accolades and win/loss record isn't all that constitutes a push. In terms of sheer screentime Rollins trumps Reigns and basically anyone not named Cena. In terms of available merchandise Ambrose has them both beat. Ambrose and Reigns have both alternated between the midcard and the main event pretty evenly, the difference being that Reigns has a better W/L record, while Rollins has basically not left the main event scene since late 2014. All three guys have gotten heavy, heavy pushes in their own way - to deny that is ridiculous.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 17:54:39 GMT -5
Ambrose and Reigns don't have near the amount of shit Roman has. Dawg if you disagree you don't know what a push is. This isn't debatable. If you're talking strictly in terms of kayfabe accolades, sure - I said in my opening comment that Reigns was the most protected out of the three. But kayfabe accolades and win/loss record isn't all that constitutes a push. In terms of sheer screentime Rollins trumps Reigns and basically anyone not named Cena. In terms of available merchandise Ambrose has them both beat. Ambrose and Reigns have both alternated between the midcard and the main event pretty evenly, the difference being that Reigns has a better W/L record, while Rollins has basically not left the main event scene since late 2014. All three guys have gotten heavy, heavy pushes in their own way - to deny that is ridiculous. Saying it again, you don't know what a push is. Pushes are majorly based around wins and loses. You denying this and saying the others are as pushed as Reigns only proves you're defending him again because you are a fan of his. Nowhere did we say the other two arent pushed, they are not, I repeat are it pushed as much as Reigns though. Straight up you don't know what a push is. The accolades of Reigns are his push and if that's your attitude on this I'm done. This is a lost cause.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 17:57:02 GMT -5
Saying it again, you don't know what a push is. Pushes are majorly based around wins and loses. You denying this and saying the others are as pushed as Reigns only proves you're defending him again. Straight up you don't know what a push is. The accolades of Reigns are his push and if that's your attitude on this I'm done. This is a lost cause. Just block me or something if you feel my arguments are inherently invalid, then. Saves us both the trouble of you calling me out in random ass threads.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Mar 31, 2016 18:15:02 GMT -5
Just calm it down before you say something you may regret later, OK guys? Jeez, who knew marketability studies could lead to such heated back-and-forth?
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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Mar 31, 2016 18:18:23 GMT -5
Roman has far more merch than Seth and Dean. Plus he is the marketing face for Tapout. Shirt designs: 18 - Roman 13 - Dean 4 - Seth
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 18:23:25 GMT -5
Just calm it down before you say something you may regret later, OK guys? Jeez, who knew marketability studies could lead to such heated back-and-forth? No worries, I'm done. Roman has far more merch than Seth and Dean. Plus he is the marketing face for Tapout. Shirt designs: 18 - Roman 13 - Dean 4 - Seth This is true, actually, according to WWE shop. Though Ambrose does have Reigns beat in terms of...drinkware? I didn't even know that was a category.
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Post by jabronidrive on Mar 31, 2016 18:36:31 GMT -5
Surveys can be easily manipulated/distributed to get the desired responses.
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Post by "Mr Wonderdick" Dick Dastardly on Mar 31, 2016 18:41:48 GMT -5
Surveys can be easily manipulated/distributed to get the desired responses. If that's the case, wouldn't Triple H be higher?
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Post by Gravedigger's Biscuits on Mar 31, 2016 18:42:22 GMT -5
Reigns wins all of his matches clean or is screwed out of the win, Ambrose wins matches against midcarders but always loses the big matches (usually clean) and Rollins almost always had to cheat to win.
Yes all three have had pretty big pushes but c'mon, Reigns has clearly had a lot stronger one than the other two.
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thecrusherwi
El Dandy
the Financially Responsible Man
Brawl For All
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Post by thecrusherwi on Mar 31, 2016 19:45:10 GMT -5
Its hard to argue. In the 80s, their marketability study said "TV viewers love men who are 1) Balding 2) Have a Bleached Blonde Fu Manchu 3) Wear bright Yellow underwear 4) Yell Constantly 5) Refer to everyone as "Brother"
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Emmet Russell
King Koopa
Quieter
The best wrestler on earth.
Posts: 12,526
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Post by Emmet Russell on Mar 31, 2016 19:52:20 GMT -5
I bet Cena could be off the rest of the year and still top the charts for 2016.
Guy doesn't need to wrestle, and could still make millions.
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