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Post by Milkman Norm on Dec 15, 2016 19:36:25 GMT -5
In England? It's interesting to me because many of the "historic" clubs in the BPL or the FL were founded around the same time period as the founding members of the MLB in America. Let in the States relocation's at some point just became part of the culture. Any idea why it happened here but not with football clubs?
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Post by Father Dougal McGuire on Dec 15, 2016 21:19:33 GMT -5
My guess would be geography. England is smaller than the US. Also it seems that the teams are linked to their cities. They have teams like Manchester City or Chelsea, while our teams are based on mascots like the Expos, Oilers, Lakers, etc.
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 15, 2016 21:34:07 GMT -5
The top 8 leagues in England have a relegation promotion system. And yes, a team in league 8 is vary unlikely to move all the way up, the fact is all these leagues make for a ton of teams. The Top 4 have 94 alone, and it gets to be ridiculous by the time you move down all of the leagues. So if a team gets bad enough, they're relegated down and another team moves up, and chances are most areas that are interested have teams that can move along the chain.
Compare that to, say , the NBA. There are 30 teams, and while there is a minor league, it's really, really, minor. There's no mobility, so if you want to watch pro-level basketball, it's those 30 teams only, and they cover US and parts of Canada, an area geographically much, much larger.
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MolotovMocktail
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Post by MolotovMocktail on Dec 15, 2016 21:50:05 GMT -5
I'm guessing there aren't as many major cities in England that could support pro teams, whereas in most sports in the US, there are at least a handful of untapped markets someone could possibly move into.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2016 3:32:02 GMT -5
Relocation is 99% because of owners with the commissioner of the league backing demanding a city to pay almost all the construction costs for a billion dollar stadium or an arena and demand all the royalties and sole ownership after. I'm not sure what the stadium situation is like in England whether the demand for luxurious sports stadiums isn't that high or owners are willing to pay for all of the construction costs or the Cities and Football team have a healthy working relationship with each other.
Edit: Just look at the Los Angeles NFL Situation. LA the 2nd biggest city in the US loses both of it's football teams because none of the owners could find a proposal to build a new NFL Stadium. St. Louis wins the relocation rights over willingness to build a brand new Football stadium and loses it's team back to LA because LA was willing to build a better stadium while St. Louis wasn't willing to a build a second stadium in 20 years.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2016 6:56:33 GMT -5
If every town, suburb and village had a pro football/basketball/baseball team in the US, nobody would move.
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Post by Nickybojelais on Dec 16, 2016 8:41:59 GMT -5
I'm guessing there aren't as many major cities in England that could support pro teams, whereas in most sports in the US, there are at least a handful of untapped markets someone could possibly move into. I'd say it's completely the opposite to that. We have 92 professional football league clubs and many in the non-league system beneath those. Our towns and cities are so saturated with professional football teams that we have absolutely no need to relocate them to other parts of England. |
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Woo
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Post by Woo on Dec 16, 2016 10:08:22 GMT -5
I'm guessing there aren't as many major cities in England that could support pro teams, whereas in most sports in the US, there are at least a handful of untapped markets someone could possibly move into. It's because every town and city has at least 1 or 2 teams already. My team Crawley Town were in the 6th tier when I first started watching football. Then they reached the fifth tier and incredibly the last 16 of the FA cup facing Manchester United, a side that were 92 places above them in the league to give it some perspective. The following year the magic happened again as they reached the last 16 again after being promoted once more. Now Crawley Town despite being a tiny side with a small stadium are in the 4th tier in the English league system (making the around 70-90th overall) and yet we still have four more professional football sides too. No, the real reason it doesn't happen is because the fans won't allow it. The only time it happened in the last 20 years was when Wimbledon FC moved to Milton Keynes and became MK Dons in 2002. Rather than support their new team Wimbledon fans formed AFC Wimbledon which started in the 9th tier of English football which made them around the 325th best team in England. Now AFC Wimbledon have made it up to the 3rd tier and are 54th overall. |
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Post by Milkman Norm on Dec 16, 2016 21:10:30 GMT -5
I'm guessing there aren't as many major cities in England that could support pro teams, whereas in most sports in the US, there are at least a handful of untapped markets someone could possibly move into. It's because every town and city has at least 1 or 2 teams already. My team Crawley Town were in the 6th tier when I first started watching football. Then they reached the fifth tier and incredibly the last 16 of the FA cup facing Manchester United, a side that were 92 places above them in the league to give it some perspective. The following year the magic happened again as they reached the last 16 again after being promoted once more. Now Crawley Town despite being a tiny side with a small stadium are in the 4th tier in the English league system (making the around 70-90th overall) and yet we still have four more professional football sides too. No, the real reason it doesn't happen is because the fans won't allow it. The only time it happened in the last 20 years was when Wimbledon FC moved to Milton Keynes and became MK Dons in 2002. Rather than support their new team Wimbledon fans formed AFC Wimbledon which started in the 9th tier of English football which made them around the 325th best team in England. Now AFC Wimbledon have made it up to the 3rd tier and are 54th overall. The fans won't allow it is the point of divergence. Because I know the Story of Wimbledon FC and the formation of AFC Wimbledon from its ashes. But it's not like there wasn't a movement to keep the Dodgers in Brooklyn and let they moved anyway. And fans in the States just accepted it as a thing that happens. I know that the Wimbledon relocation has been very controversial because it was the only time it has happened in the history of the Football League. I guess it's partially a question of geography and size but I'm more interest in how the nature of fandom and relationship between a club and region is or isn't different between the two countries. Oh and congrats to Crawley Town on promotion to League Two. |
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Post by Hurbster on Dec 17, 2016 18:20:24 GMT -5
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Woo
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Post by Woo on Dec 18, 2016 6:06:02 GMT -5
It's because every town and city has at least 1 or 2 teams already. My team Crawley Town were in the 6th tier when I first started watching football. Then they reached the fifth tier and incredibly the last 16 of the FA cup facing Manchester United, a side that were 92 places above them in the league to give it some perspective. The following year the magic happened again as they reached the last 16 again after being promoted once more. Now Crawley Town despite being a tiny side with a small stadium are in the 4th tier in the English league system (making the around 70-90th overall) and yet we still have four more professional football sides too. No, the real reason it doesn't happen is because the fans won't allow it. The only time it happened in the last 20 years was when Wimbledon FC moved to Milton Keynes and became MK Dons in 2002. Rather than support their new team Wimbledon fans formed AFC Wimbledon which started in the 9th tier of English football which made them around the 325th best team in England. Now AFC Wimbledon have made it up to the 3rd tier and are 54th overall. The fans won't allow it is the point of divergence. Because I know the Story of Wimbledon FC and the formation of AFC Wimbledon from its ashes. But it's not like there wasn't a movement to keep the Dodgers in Brooklyn and let they moved anyway. And fans in the States just accepted it as a thing that happens. I know that the Wimbledon relocation has been very controversial because it was the only time it has happened in the history of the Football League. I guess it's partially a question of geography and size but I'm more interest in how the nature of fandom and relationship between a club and region is or isn't different between the two countries. Oh and congrats to Crawley Town on promotion to League Two. Thanks! It's also a case I guess of Milton Keynes being a relatively new town whereas every other town had a football club already and those who didn't would likely create their own rather than takeover someone elses. Wimbledon got all their trophies back anyway so the benefit to taking over the team was automatic entry into the football league system, which admittedly is nothing to sniff at. |
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Post by Hit Girl on Dec 18, 2016 8:54:12 GMT -5
MK could reduce much of the tension between themselves and Wimbledon by simply dropping "Dons" from their name, which needlessly antagonises Wimbledon fans who rightly see it as MK taking the piss.
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Doctor Of Style
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Post by Doctor Of Style on Dec 18, 2016 11:15:17 GMT -5
If every town, suburb and village had a pro football/basketball/baseball team in the US, nobody would move. Nobody would watch either, with such a watered down talent pool. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2016 8:00:16 GMT -5
If every town, suburb and village had a pro football/basketball/baseball team in the US, nobody would move. Nobody would watch either, with such a watered down talent pool. Nobody would watch because every man, woman and child would be on a team. |
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Post by kevthetree on Dec 26, 2016 5:22:40 GMT -5
Nobody would watch either, with such a watered down talent pool. Nobody would watch because every man, woman and child would be on a team. It's more like picturing all college and high school teams (which don't exist to the same degree in the U.K.) as being in the professional structure. You might get the rams for example relocating, but how would it go down if Alabama tried it? |
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