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Post by tigermaskxxxvii on Jun 11, 2017 0:01:01 GMT -5
Love the party, hate the disco music. Seriously, what is it with our community and playing heck-awful music? Put on some Against Me or something, I'm sick of hearing the same drag queen badly rendering "I Am What I Am" every year. While I'm not part of the LBGT community, I had my own one man party listening to some Pansy Division songs. A guy I know from doing stand up posted something pretty interesting on Facebook last week to commemorate the beginning of pride month. Which was how when he started becoming active in the gay community he got some static for being into bears (which he is also one as well) and kind of was told that he shouldn't be into other large hairy dudes. And more pertinent to what you posted, he felt out of place because of having different musical tastes than the scene. Basically saying "yeah, Madonna's great and all. But must we constantly worship at her altar?" He tends to be a Bruce Springsteen and Drive-By Truckers fan (at least what I have gleamed) and artists of that nature when it comes to music. So it's interesting for him to mention that (and you to suggest throwing in some Against Me! to the mix), as music in terms of the LBGT community gets pigeonholed as dance music (disco, techno, house music, etc), pop music or songs from Broadway musicals and that tends to be about it. |
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Post by "Trickster Dogg" James Jesse on Jun 11, 2017 0:34:41 GMT -5
My close cousin who I grew up with is a completely over the top stereotype of a gay person and I love him to death like a brother... That being said parades generally suck and I hate parades whether they be celebrating a person's sexuality or thanksgiving, they suck if its a giant inflatable Garfield or a giant rainbow penis. Get off my street What about a giant inflatable Garfield with a rainbow penis? |
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Post by SsnakeBite, the No1 Frenchman on Jun 11, 2017 2:32:29 GMT -5
Considering that every year, I hear stories of bisexual people in a hetero relationship (as in, they're bi, but their current relationship is with someone of the opposite gender) being told they don't belong at the gay pride, that they are, and I quote, "not queer enough" or that they are downright oppressing people with their display of apparent heterosexuality, I can see why bisexual people wouldn't be impressed with it. It's hard to buy the claims that it's not exclusive when, well, I keep hearing firsthand experience from people being excluded. And yeah, I can definitely see the issue about reinforcing stereotypes. I mean, I get that they want to encourage people to embrace their sexual identity and orientation, but does EVERYTHING have to look straight out (no pun intended) of a homophobic propaganda film, or at the very least a misguided aunt trying to be nice but missing the mark by a mile? Isn't it a bit like if Black people tried to celebrate Black history with nothing but gangsta rap and lowriders? Parades in general are annoying. That is also true. |
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Post by ShaolinHandLock on Jun 11, 2017 4:35:09 GMT -5
Weird, huh? I just can't stand the nature of some of these events, where most people get nearly naked and make fools out of themselves. I know it serves a purpose, but I feel like the parades reinforce negative stereotypes about gay culture & it often feels like those who are LGBT and don't like these events feel scapegoated. Obviously, it's my opinion, but I was wondering if there were others with sincere feelings on this topic as well. Speaking in general, and not on the particular issue you're talking about, I don't think you're 'weird' for having such an opinion. People seem to forget that people who have labels, whether the labels are in regards to their sexuality or identity or anything really, are not a hivemind and they all have individual thoughts, feelings and behaviours regardless of whatever label is attached to them. Sorry for going slightly off-topic, but I really hate how people on the internet act as if groups of people are hiveminds. "(Insert group of people here) are all (insert stereotypical thing here)"...no, it doesn't work like that. |
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ERON
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Post by ERON on Jun 11, 2017 7:43:22 GMT -5
My dad is extremely homophobic, and we've had some pretty spirited debates over the years. One thing he likes to do is pick out some of the most extreme behavior he sees in media coverage of pride parades, like what we're discussing here, and say something like "How can they expect us to accept them as normal people when they act like this in public?" Since he's a big football fan, I usually counter by saying that by that logic someone could see a bunch of screaming shirtless guys in body paint and party wigs on an NFL telecast, and use that to condemn all football fans as drunken buffoons. Also, until reading this thread, I never knew so many people hated parades. Jeez, first I find out everyone hates clowns, and now I find out everyone hates parades too. What's next? Are you going to tell me everyone hates milkshakes or picnics or Elvis?  |
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Post by HMARK Center on Jun 11, 2017 7:57:06 GMT -5
I'm not quite sure how you read "Straight culture at large" as "every single straight person, no exceptions". If you think there aren't still major problems with how LGBT people are percieved, no matter how normally they try to live their lives, I'll remind you that even the most developed nations are trying to decide on a political level whether trans women should be allowed to go to the toilet because they're percieved as being creepy sex maniacs, rather than ordinary women needing to go to the toilet. No, I read it correctly. It's exactly what I took offense to. "Straight culture at large" isn't a bunch of backward hicks stereotyping everybody. The vocal minority are the close minded people that stereotype you. I'm going to have to ask you not put words in people's mouths if you wish to engage in a conversation on topics like this. "Culture" and "individuals" do not mean the same thing. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 8:33:08 GMT -5
Weird, huh? I just can't stand the nature of some of these events, where most people get nearly naked and make fools out of themselves. I know it serves a purpose, but I feel like the parades reinforce negative stereotypes about gay culture & it often feels like those who are LGBT and don't like these events feel scapegoated.
Obviously, it's my opinion, but I was wondering if there were others with sincere feelings on this topic as well. Whether or not you like to get down like that yourself is up to you, but you'll run yourself crazy on trying to change things you can't change to appear more "acceptable" to people. Because think about the bolded part... "Reinforce negative stereotypes" amongst whom? Why is it that even in a Pride parade, people still have to conform to rules made by people who'd have nothing to do with them or even outright hate them? Nah, man. You don't get any kind of rights or respect by being "respectable." ....massive issues with the parade that's damn near sponsored by LexCorp. and Hyperion aside... I'm still waiting for people to even recognize that my orientation is actually a thing... *is asexual* |
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Post by HMARK Center on Jun 11, 2017 9:05:37 GMT -5
I think part of the deal for many people is that they want to say "I refuse to call these 'negative stereotypes', because I don't see the behavior as negative." And that's fair. Each of us can have our own view of what constitutes positive or negative representation, but there are people out there who can't express themselves without fear of enormous repercussions, so as long as they have a space where they can freely express themselves and aren't hurting anybody, that's fine and dandy.
Like, I'd dislike if an Italian-American ethnic pride parade dedicated itself to tons of "let's do mafia stereotypes" floats, but that's much more overtly harmful toward the community and toward others. People at a pride parade espousing sexual liberation, on the other hand, arent peddling an overtly harmful message, just one where there can be grey areas of disagreement over what constitutes "appropriate" or what have you among people within that community.
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Post by Hit Girl on Jun 11, 2017 13:58:19 GMT -5
I tend to agree. I think they do reinforce negative stereotypes and making the parades about overtly sexual things often distracts from issues concerning legal rights in areas such as marriage, adoption, consumer rights, inheritance, next-of-kin issues etc...
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Post by Surfer Sandman on Jun 11, 2017 14:03:17 GMT -5
I support people that wish to express their pride and determination regarding their sexual identity. I identify as a pansexual and unfortunately, we don't get parades or much recognition of anything. Honestly, the less you try to fit into a box, the better.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 14:07:17 GMT -5
Honestly, even within the LGBTQ community, there's this weird erasure of bisexual folk and their existence. I feel like it's an issue, along with the similar treatment of transsexuals, that is getting a little better, but it is very slow going. It's a shame but that's people for ya, it's a lot to ask for widespread acceptance for some insane reason. |
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Post by Surfer Sandman on Jun 11, 2017 14:08:08 GMT -5
Meh, straight culture at large will believe stereotypes about LGBT people regardless of how respectable we try to act. I kind of hate pride parades in the modern day but it's not really because of how people are acting (beyond the fair share of bigotry that occurs even in ostensibly positive spaces) but because the organisers have forgotten the entire meaning of what Pride was about. The first Pride was a riot, and even decades after it was more akin to a political protest with additional focus on visibility. This year's London Pride has parade groups for Barclays Bank, Nandos and Starbucks, but claimed there wasn't enough room for a bisexual group. At some point it transformed into a commercial exercise to squeeze money out of LGBT people. I don't understand why sometimes, bisexual people are cast out and/or demonized by their gay and lesbian peers. I tried to come out years ago and I was told that it was a "phase" or didn't exist. After some thinking and a little experimentation across the gender spectrum, I decided that I was more of a pansexual. |
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Post by GuyOfOwnage on Jun 11, 2017 14:14:32 GMT -5
I'm straight and have never actually been to a pride parade, but you're going to have both private, more quiet types and more outlandish, in-your-face types regardless of what sexual orientation or gender you're talking about. So I don't think the more outlandish types of pride fare are meant to represent the whole community. Those people would still be that way if they were gay, straight, or anywhere in between. It's more about those people's ideas of sexual expression than it is about their orientation.
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Post by Heinz Doofenschmirtz on Jun 11, 2017 21:02:18 GMT -5
Meh, straight culture at large will believe stereotypes about LGBT people regardless of how respectable we try to act. I kind of hate pride parades in the modern day but it's not really because of how people are acting (beyond the fair share of bigotry that occurs even in ostensibly positive spaces) but because the organisers have forgotten the entire meaning of what Pride was about. The first Pride was a riot, and even decades after it was more akin to a political protest with additional focus on visibility. This year's London Pride has parade groups for Barclays Bank, Nandos and Starbucks, but claimed there wasn't enough room for a bisexual group. At some point it transformed into a commercial exercise to squeeze money out of LGBT people. I don't understand why sometimes, bisexual people are cast out and/or demonized by their gay and lesbian peers. I tried to come out years ago and I was told that it was a "phase" or didn't exist. After some thinking and a little experimentation across the gender spectrum, I decided that I was more of a pansexual. People's perception of bisexuality, generally speaking, is weird. Men are often seen as gay but faking the attraction to women. Women are seen as straight and also faking the attraction to women. It sucks. |
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Post by Surfer Sandman on Jun 12, 2017 3:23:54 GMT -5
I don't understand why sometimes, bisexual people are cast out and/or demonized by their gay and lesbian peers. I tried to come out years ago and I was told that it was a "phase" or didn't exist. After some thinking and a little experimentation across the gender spectrum, I decided that I was more of a pansexual. People's perception of bisexuality, generally speaking, is weird. Men are often seen as gay but faking the attraction to women. Women are seen as straight and also faking the attraction to women. It sucks. Exactly. Damned if you are, damned if you're not. |
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Post by The Legend of Groose on Jun 12, 2017 9:53:04 GMT -5
I can understand it. It gives the "I'm gay/bi,ect look at me! I'm different!" vibe. It's like making a big parade for people who like both hawaiian and pepperoni pizza. If people are having fun with it, good on them. But I can understand why LGBT people are not a fan of the parades. It's glorifying the perception of "All LGBT people are like this."
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Fade
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Post by Fade on Jun 12, 2017 18:00:16 GMT -5
Also, until reading this thread, I never knew so many people hated parades. Jeez, first I find out everyone hates clowns, and now I find out everyone hates parades too. What's next? Are you going to tell me everyone hates milkshakes or picnics or Elvis? f*** picnics. I acted with a friend for years who shared OPs sentiment. Except he was just gay. But you could never tell. Good looking gruff cat that most assumed was a straight guy. He wasn't in the closet at all, he just didn't like the overtly flamboyant stereotype(s) and being attached to it. As a straight dude, I don't care either way. I just judge people on their character. That's it. That being said the gay club in Hollywood, Tigerheat, was one of my favorite clubs for years. |
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Post by Long A, Short A on Jun 12, 2017 21:22:48 GMT -5
People of all shades and places on the Kinsey scale can be introverted or hate big goofy crowds, so I don't think it's that weird that an LGBTQIA person doesn't want to participate in a big old loud Pride event. I was listening to a podcast this morning and the guest host talked about how she does not like big pride event, so she does small personal things with her girlfriend instead. They hosts also talked about how people skip Pride because they think it's too corporate. Whatever you do, don't do it to subvert a stereotype. I've learned that people believe stereotypes because they want to and not because that's all they see.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2017 7:18:28 GMT -5
I've railed about what I feel is selective enforcement of the rule before, but like...isn't this clearly a political thread? Don't we have a no politics rule?
Anyway: This argument happens at my place every year. I've got two moms and a sister. All of them are gay. And every year the argument kicks up because Mom 1 hates the parades and sees them as needlessly showy. She says they keep them separate from the larger community. Mom 2 believes they're important because they show how many everyday institutions like banks and police forces support LGTBQ folks in our community.
I do not weight in. Because I don't feel particularly passionate, or think it's my place to say anything.
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Allie Kitsune
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Jun 13, 2017 7:27:44 GMT -5
There are things I want to say, but I've never been able to say things in a way that doesn't come off as too blunt for this sort of subject and set people off/give them the completely wrong impression.
So, instead of trying to go into any sort of detail, I'm just going to say that sometimes there is pressure to live up to certain things in order to "count" within "the community", and that that's personally just not worth the hassle to me, especially as I get older.
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