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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Sept 20, 2017 16:20:46 GMT -5
I still don't get how they didn't have his character be like the real dude from that workout vid some months back. That's a likable face people could have got behind.
And if the goal is trying to get a new market, would a face not be a better chance for that? It's just weird
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2017 16:56:58 GMT -5
Okay, well now we have the guy who says he's a victim of racism making lazy ethnic jokes about a Japanese person. You could argue, then, that what we have is a hypocritical heel, guilty of behaving in the exact manner he accuses his critics of acting. Fine, but there was no evidence of that. It was never suggested that Jinder was being a hypocrite. While I think last night's promo sucked I will somewhat defend WWE in this regard. Jinder's has consistently been portrayed as someone who is completely full of shit. He plays the race card when he gets booed when he's really getting booed because he's a cheater and uses it as justification to cheat more and insult the fans. Outside of Jinder literally saying "I'm the bad guy, I'm a hypocrite, I'm the real racist" I'm not sure how it could be any more clear WWE is suggesting he's a hypocrite. I think the execution of the story is lowest common denominator trash but I think the intent is pretty obvious. I think Jinder being a racist that's been projecting his racism onto the audience and his opponents fits with what they've been doing with him since he moved to Smackdown. It just took until he feuded with a non-white wrestler for him to completely reveal his true colors.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
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Post by Dub H on Sept 20, 2017 17:02:03 GMT -5
Anyone remember Kung Funaki? To be fair he was apparently the one who kept pushing for that. I doubt still people won't be really pissed by it these days. I mean,if he was enjoying,he did seem to have fun doing silly kung fu things
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
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Member is Online
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Post by Chiral on Sept 20, 2017 19:32:22 GMT -5
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Sept 20, 2017 19:40:24 GMT -5
This 15 year-old is going places.
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Post by Mister Pigwell on Sept 20, 2017 19:44:19 GMT -5
I love how Oakland of all places decided THAT'S the city too high brow for WWE's cheap lazy heat.
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Post by Cyno on Sept 20, 2017 19:46:30 GMT -5
I like the cut of Noumaan's jib. It also baffles me how WWE's idea of trying to strike it big in the Indian market is to have a Canadian wrestler of Punjabi descent be a chickenshit heel who can't win a single match without his goons. But then, that's WWE for you.
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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on Sept 20, 2017 20:01:45 GMT -5
I love how Oakland of all places decided THAT'S the city too high brow for WWE's cheap lazy heat. RAIDER NATION has yet to disappoint
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2017 20:25:08 GMT -5
I like the cut of Noumaan's jib. It also baffles me how WWE's idea of trying to strike it big in the Indian market is to have a Canadian wrestler of Punjabi descent be a chickenshit heel who can't win a single match without his goons. But then, that's WWE for you. As other users pointed out, if you're trying to tap into new markets, should the guy be a hero? This is the #1 thing that bugs me about Jinder as Champion. I think he would make a lousy face, but you can still do face vs. face feuds.
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by Fade on Sept 20, 2017 20:26:29 GMT -5
Kevin Owens bloodied a senior citizen last week and this wasn't brought up. Instead of turning this into a strawman, let's agree there are boundaries to good taste. The thing with Vince, though, is does anybody find him sympathetic? When he's getting the shit beat out of him, yes. Dudes in his 70s. And for all the shit we give him as fans, he's clearly still beloved to a level. I love that the media picked up on this though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2017 20:29:43 GMT -5
My brother, who admitting states he misses the 2008-09 period (he stopped caring when Eddie Fatu died) and is a lapsed fan, saw the bit last night & asked me "Where's the other guy to beat him up? Usually that happens "
I told him I was hoping for that, too. The combination of Jinder's "Look how stupid the Japanese guy looks" & Shinsuke not actually kicking his ass makes this not just awkward but hard to care. If I was insulted for my appearance, I'd probably beat up the Singh Brothers.
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Post by Hit Girl on Sept 20, 2017 21:07:03 GMT -5
Villains should be allowed to be bigoted. As long as they get their comeuppance. The problem with Jinder's promos is that they are terribly written. Racism can be an effective plot device if framed and portrayed correctly. Here's the thing - Jinder's whole gimmick is based around the fact that American fans are disrespectful towards him because he's of Indian descent. Okay, well now we have the guy who says he's a victim of racism making lazy ethnic jokes about a Japanese person. You could argue, then, that what we have is a hypocritical heel, guilty of behaving in the exact manner he accuses his critics of acting. Fine, but there was no evidence of that. It was never suggested that Jinder was being a hypocrite. These were presented as simply lazy ethnic jokes from a guy to generate heel heat. There was nothing nuanced about it. And the other thing is, ethnic and minority performers over the years have faced racism in the WWE and pro wrestling in general. By making a wrestler of Indian descent crack racist humour and have the fans go, "Look, he's just as bad as anybody else," it does a disservice to the very real spectre of racism that these wrestlers come across. I just thought it was a really shitty angle in general and the cheapest possible way to generate heat. And the fact that you used Jinder to do it makes it almost worse. What they should have done is either 1) frame Jinder as a humourous but delusional heel who thinks he's a Bollywood star, kinda like the Miz and his movie star gimmick, although more absurd and comical, or 2) have Jinder be the victim of racism, thus creating sympathy for him. WWE should create a new heel faction, based on their Real Americans gimmick from a few years back, but make it outright xenophobic and racist. As it grows, more wrestlers (mostly bitter jobbers and mid-carders who scapegoat foreigners for their lack of career success. It provides a detestable heel force for faces to fight against.
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Post by Starshine on Sept 20, 2017 21:20:13 GMT -5
I'm struggling to think of a whole lot of other fanbases that have some members questioning whether there should be more racism in the show.
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Post by Hit Girl on Sept 20, 2017 21:24:20 GMT -5
I'm struggling to think of a whole lot of other fanbases that have some members questioning whether there should be more racism in the show. It's not so much about wanting more racism on the show, but to what extent WWE could or should use real world issues in their storylines. If racism was written properly, then there's no reason why it couldn't work as a plot device, considering that it's used in literature, TV, movies and video games, and used very effectively.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2017 21:33:46 GMT -5
I'm struggling to think of a whole lot of other fanbases that have some members questioning whether there should be more racism in the show. It's not so much about wanting more racism on the show, but to what extent WWE could or should use real world issues in their storylines. If racism was written properly, then there's no reason why it couldn't work as a plot device, considering that it's used in literature, TV, movies and video games, and used very effectively. Frigging Thomas the Tank Engine has this where steam engines & diesel engines have animosity towards one another. Before the 985 sequels, the original Land Before Time presented triceratops looking down on Brachiosaurus. Good or even competent medium can discuss the topic of racism. But incompetent medium, you just shake your head at.
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Post by Hit Girl on Sept 20, 2017 21:42:41 GMT -5
It's not so much about wanting more racism on the show, but to what extent WWE could or should use real world issues in their storylines. If racism was written properly, then there's no reason why it couldn't work as a plot device, considering that it's used in literature, TV, movies and video games, and used very effectively. Frigging Thomas the Tank Engine has this where steam engines & diesel engines have animosity towards one another. Before the 985 sequels, the original Land Before Time presented triceratops looking down on Brachiosaurus. Good or even competent medium can discuss the topic of racism. But incompetent medium, you just shake your head at. Devious Diesel was a better heel on TTTE than any current WWE heel. Hell even Daisy generated heat with me when she said she it beneath her to pull a milk truck. I remember when the engines made fun of Toby because he had brown paint and was square shaped.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2017 22:01:56 GMT -5
It's not so much about wanting more racism on the show, but to what extent WWE could or should use real world issues in their storylines. If racism was written properly, then there's no reason why it couldn't work as a plot device, considering that it's used in literature, TV, movies and video games, and used very effectively. Frigging Thomas the Tank Engine has this where steam engines & diesel engines have animosity towards one another. Before the 985 sequels, the original Land Before Time presented triceratops looking down on Brachiosaurus. Good or even competent medium can discuss the topic of racism. But incompetent medium, you just shake your head at. The stupid thing about how WWE handles it is that they never take the other side. Jinder's whole deal of feeling like he's being racially discriminated by fans and co-workers would be perfectly fine if you had another guy up against him who said "it's never been the color of your skin, you're a cheater." But all the faces can do is make cute faces to the camera and hit finishing moves on the guy. I think it would be interesting to see a proper racially driven storyline in WWE, but it's never been a back and forth, just one side says something racist and the other side skirts around it. I'm not too bothered either way because I'm pretty used to WWE having their formula and this is right up to par with their quality of work. I get that WWE are trying to give this feud a more personal vibe, but Shinsuke doesn't really seem equipped for personal rivalries in the first place and the stuff that Jinder's coming at him with especially seems out of the Shinsuke character's wheelhouse. There's just nothing here for the two guys to play around with and actually make interesting. Right now heels can say pretty much anything to Shinsuke and the feud is exactly the same.
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Post by BD Punk AKA SUSPENDED! on Sept 20, 2017 22:08:18 GMT -5
If everyone just skipped through all of Jinder's promos like I do, then there'd be no reason for this thread.
Seriously though, Jinder just all around sucks. Time to drop the strap to Nakamura and start the long slow build to AJ vs Nakamura for the belt at Mania
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Post by Hit Girl on Sept 20, 2017 22:12:13 GMT -5
They are rehashing the Muhammed Hassan storyline, but the difference is that Jinder is Indian, so it's less controversial. The problem is that where Hassan had a legit point in how Muslims were treated in America post-9/11, no one gives a shit about Jinder. He hasn't been received with hostility based on his race. He's been greeted with apathy. The people didn't turn against him, they never cared about him to begin with. It also doesn't help that his target is a semi-mute, mostly incomprehensible opponent who can't really respond, so it means Jinder, who is already mediocre on the mic and further bogged down by shitty writing to begin with, is having to carry the promo workload.
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Post by Cyno on Sept 20, 2017 22:41:31 GMT -5
I wonder if anyone here knows Punjabi and can translate what Jinder says then. Like is he doing the same promo? Is he saying really nice things about Shinsuke? Is he even a fluent speaker or just speaking jibberish?
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