Burst
El Dandy
*inarticulate squawking*
Posts: 8,584
|
Post by Burst on Jan 20, 2018 19:19:08 GMT -5
I work in medicine and the development of the opiate epidemic is so ridiculously multifaceted that there really is no easy solution. Now pain management is swinging the other way to the point you have folks that *should* be getting full dose morphine or what have you such as terminal cancer patients with bone metastases, but so many docs are so terrified of prescribing opiates period that you wind up with people suffering because they're past what Caldolor or Ofirmev can deal with and there's nothing stronger that's not an opiate.
A lot of this is born from maybe a decade or so ago when the big push was "Pain: the fifth vital sign" and providers were being too generous in the other direction. It's just finding that happy medium again when the damage is already done is going to be one hell of a tall order.
|
|
|
Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Jan 20, 2018 20:08:20 GMT -5
I used to feel the same way when I was younger.
My mother has suffered from depression all her life, so while always being there for her, (and strangely attracting a lot of depressives in my social circles) I did grow to somewhat resent depression/suicide. My first GF also used suicide as a threat often to maintain our relationship which I always found incredibly selfish.
Over the last few years, I've come to see and rationalize why some decide to end their own lives. Context, context, context..and I am a firm believer that anyone is capable of anything under the right circumstances.
And as for drugs/addictions..I have an incredibly addictive personality. So I somewhat sympathize with addicts but it really comes down to the individual to initiate change. I used to be addicted to food and it made me overweight for 17 years of my life. I got addicted to cigarettes and quit about 3 years ago. I was heavily addicted to weed and quit habitual use 2 years ago and just this last year I got heavily reliant on alcohol and have decided to remain sober for 2018. It's not easy. And like suicide, a lot of it comes to the circumstances of the situation.
|
|
Kyn
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,623
|
Post by Kyn on Jan 20, 2018 20:24:21 GMT -5
(...)If your death is caused by something you did to yourself that could have been prevented, I really have a hard time feeling sad. I feel for their family and friends but I lose my empathy for that person. Even when someone commits suicide I don’t think people should talk of them “passing away”.(...) When you have major depression, your brain lies to you. It tells you you have no worth, that you're a drain on everyone who knows you & especially your family, and that you'd be better off dead, in fact, that YOU'RE the selfish one for sticking around when everyone would be so much better off when you're gone. No matter how many people tell you this isn't true, your brain is telling you they're lying, either to make you feel better or because they think it would be callous to say the truth out loud. It's a fight against your own mind, every single day. Mental illness runs in my family, & several of my family members have committed suicide. I'm not angry with them, and I don't think they deserve condemnation. The fought every day for years, and one day they lost the fight.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2018 20:37:26 GMT -5
...”any man’s death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls, for it tolls for thee.”
Don’t think for a second that suicide or drug use/self destruction can never find you, all that it takes is a trigger.
|
|
|
Post by Porky's Butthole on Jan 20, 2018 20:44:25 GMT -5
With the recent news that the deaths of Tom Petty and Roy Halladay were drug related, does it make anyone else not feel as bad for them? I find myself feeling the same way towards people who commit suicide. If your death is caused by something you did to yourself that could have been prevented, I really have a hard time feeling sad. I feel for their family and friends but I lose my empathy for that person. Even when someone commits suicide I don’t think people should talk of them “passing away”. I know it’s a grim outlook on things and it’s bound to be controversial but is there anyone else that feels the same as me? I think you're missing a key factor on "Drug related deaths." It's not recreation use that caused a substantial chunk of these. It's pain management. Case in point, Prince. He had dual hip-replacement and was in intense, intense pain. He had a DOCTOR'S PRESCRIPTION for opiate-based pain killers. It wasn't working, so a MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL increased the dosage. The morning of Prince's death, he was getting he 100% LEGAL prescription filled at a Walgreen's. You can't label all deaths involving drugs as "caused by something you did to yourself that could have been prevented." Same thing with terms like "Accidental overdose." While it's predominantly used as a euphemism for recreational drug deaths, it's the same term when someone mistakenly takes their legally prescribed doses too close to each other, hence the spike in the need for second autopsies following deaths in 2010 or so. We can't control how we feel, but it would benefit you to explore your own levels of understanding of what would drive someone to suicide. Are there cases where it's a coward fleeing the consequences of his actions while awaiting sentencing in prison or escaping tax evasion? Sure. However, the overwhelming amount of suicides are the result of mental health issues that many struggle to get under control but can't. They don't want to kill themselves. It's not selfish. They're the victims of an illness the same way any other disorder or sickness kills. I wish I could like this 100 more times. This is so spot on, it f***ing hurts.
|
|
|
Post by GuyOfOwnage on Jan 20, 2018 21:24:23 GMT -5
There was a very strong negative attitude towards suicide in mainstream culture for the longest time, basically implying that anyone who committed suicide was a spineless coward and didn't deserve to be mourned. We still have a ways to go, but I'm so glad that attitude is in the process of changing.
|
|
|
Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jan 20, 2018 21:45:39 GMT -5
Not at all; you have no idea what's led a person down a path. And always remember, you can never say with absolute certainty that in certain circumstances any one of us wouldn't go down the same road. A life lost, unless someone is just evil (and I guess even that could have degrees) is a loss.
Certainly someone committing suicide is not 'less' of a loss. Ranking lives is just odd.
|
|
Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
|
Post by Bub (BLM) on Jan 20, 2018 23:17:03 GMT -5
It actually makes me more sad for them. It's heartbreaking to see people go down that road.
|
|
|
Post by Pierre the Renaissance Man on Jan 21, 2018 13:11:43 GMT -5
I understand what everyone is saying but I just can’t understand what leads someone to addiction. If it’s caused by prescription drugs then I get it. However, like in the cases of my friends that I lost, I can’t wrap my head around it. When people come from good backgrounds and good families, why would they risk their lives over something they know can be deadly? I used to smoke a lot of weed back in the day but I would never try coke or heroin because I know what could happen. I probably should have worded it better in my first post but that’s what I meant.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2018 13:16:54 GMT -5
It actually makes me more sad for them. It's heartbreaking to see people go down that road. Agreed 100% My uncle committed suicide at 37 a couple years ago and while I'll admit to not really caring for him when he was alive because of some of his behaviors, I felt terrible for him and I still do, especially since I've dealt with some mental health issues for over half my life now.
|
|
|
Post by Cyno on Jan 21, 2018 13:54:34 GMT -5
I've known at least 3 people who have committed suicide that I considered friends or at the very least, acquaintances. I don't know what drove them to do what they did, though I know all three struggled with mental health issues.
|
|
The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,294
|
Post by The Ichi on Jan 21, 2018 13:59:38 GMT -5
My mum died of lung cancer. She smoked heavily her entire adult life and knew it would kill her. She did it to herself and could have been prevented. Didn’t hurt any less when she died though. Same but with my Dad.
|
|
|
Post by GuyOfOwnage on Jan 21, 2018 14:50:23 GMT -5
I understand what everyone is saying but I just can’t understand what leads someone to addiction. If it’s caused by prescription drugs then I get it. However, like in the cases of my friends that I lost, I can’t wrap my head around it. When people come from good backgrounds and good families, why would they risk their lives over something they know can be deadly? I used to smoke a lot of weed back in the day but I would never try coke or heroin because I know what could happen. I probably should have worded it better in my first post but that’s what I meant. They could be predisposed to addiction, they could've went through a troubling time in their life that clouded their judgment, any number of things. It's impossible to understand why a person made any decision without walking a mile in their shoes first. And because we don't have the insight to know what led to that decision, we're not really in a position to judge that person.
|
|
|
Post by angryfan on Jan 21, 2018 22:11:30 GMT -5
Not at all; you have no idea what's led a person down a path. And always remember, you can never say with absolute certainty that in certain circumstances any one of us wouldn't go down the same road. A life lost, unless someone is just evil (and I guess even that could have degrees) is a loss. Certainly someone committing suicide is not 'less' of a loss. Ranking lives is just odd. Just adding on, since I"ve been on both sides of this. I've lost family to both addiction (alcohol leading to liver failure) and suicide, but I've also fought clinical depression for almost 30 years. I work daily with the mentally ill. I can clinically know "ok, this will pass, if I do this, it will fix this part, and then I can do this other thing", but when it comes to myself, all the knowledge in the world doesn't keep the thought of "maybe I should just do it and get it over with" from popping in my head. You can have all the wherewithall in the world that says "I know what to do, and I can fix this", and from the outside it seems so easy adn step by step. But when you wake up in that dark place where logic doesn't go, it takes a lot to ignore the gut reaction of "just do it and be done".
|
|
chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 27,959
|
Post by chazraps on Jan 21, 2018 22:32:23 GMT -5
I understand what everyone is saying but I just can’t understand what leads someone to addiction. If it’s caused by prescription drugs then I get it. However, like in the cases of my friends that I lost, I can’t wrap my head around it. When people come from good backgrounds and good families, why would they risk their lives over something they know can be deadly? I used to smoke a lot of weed back in the day but I would never try coke or heroin because I know what could happen. I probably should have worded it better in my first post but that’s what I meant. Well, to be blunt, you aren't everyone. Not everyone has your resolve, your foresight, your perspective etc. That doesn't make them "lesser than" or not worthy of your empathy or us mourning them. Please try to keep this in mind.
|
|
|
Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Jan 21, 2018 22:37:47 GMT -5
Nobody wants to be a junkie. Nobody wants to need a substance to just make them exist. It doesn't end well.
|
|
Urethra Franklin
King Koopa
When Toronto sports teams lose, Alison Brie is sad
Posts: 11,089
|
Post by Urethra Franklin on Jan 21, 2018 23:22:54 GMT -5
I used to feel the same way when I was younger. My mother has suffered from depression all her life, so while always being there for her, (and strangely attracting a lot of depressives in my social circles) I did grow to somewhat resent depression/suicide. My first GF also used suicide as a threat often to maintain our relationship which I always found incredibly selfish. Over the last few years, I've come to see and rationalize why some decide to end their own lives. Context, context, context..and I am a firm believer that anyone is capable of anything under the right circumstances. And as for drugs/addictions..I have an incredibly addictive personality. So I somewhat sympathize with addicts but it really comes down to the individual to initiate change. I used to be addicted to food and it made me overweight for 17 years of my life. I got addicted to cigarettes and quit about 3 years ago. I was heavily addicted to weed and quit habitual use 2 years ago and just this last year I got heavily reliant on alcohol and have decided to remain sober for 2018. It's not easy. And like suicide, a lot of it comes to the circumstances of the situation. Good for you, dude. I don’t think I ever had a problem, but I decided that I was drinking too much a few years back, so I did what you did and chose to take a year off. Well, the year came and went and I didn’t miss it at all. I saved a lot of money and lost some weight and I felt really good. That was nearly four years ago now and I’m not even remotely tempted to return.
|
|
|
Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Jan 21, 2018 23:29:14 GMT -5
I used to feel the same way when I was younger. My mother has suffered from depression all her life, so while always being there for her, (and strangely attracting a lot of depressives in my social circles) I did grow to somewhat resent depression/suicide. My first GF also used suicide as a threat often to maintain our relationship which I always found incredibly selfish. Over the last few years, I've come to see and rationalize why some decide to end their own lives. Context, context, context..and I am a firm believer that anyone is capable of anything under the right circumstances. And as for drugs/addictions..I have an incredibly addictive personality. So I somewhat sympathize with addicts but it really comes down to the individual to initiate change. I used to be addicted to food and it made me overweight for 17 years of my life. I got addicted to cigarettes and quit about 3 years ago. I was heavily addicted to weed and quit habitual use 2 years ago and just this last year I got heavily reliant on alcohol and have decided to remain sober for 2018. It's not easy. And like suicide, a lot of it comes to the circumstances of the situation. Good for you, dude. I don’t think I ever had a problem, but I decided that I was drinking too much a few years back, so I did what you did and chose to take a year off. Well, the year came and went and I didn’t miss it at all. I saved a lot of money and lost some weight and I felt really good. That was nearly four years ago now and I’m not even remotely tempted to return. Thanks man. And thank you for sharing that, its encouraging!
|
|