C.M Lynch/Becky Mcgregor: Women’s champ thread.

[Dub H]

Watching the segment on youtube Charlotte reminds that one shitty family member you have that when you call out or just blow off they start to get bitchy"BUT I NEVER DID ANYTHING WRONG TO YOU.

EVER."

[ryanjoste]

Sept 18, 2018 22:50:50 GMT -5 The Legend of Groose said:

Seeing how she's CM Lynch, I'm expecting this to end with it being about Stephanie somehow.

Stephanie texts herself to "stick the winner".

[sunnytaker]

ya know it just hit me. I wonder if this becky "turn" was planned to coincide with the trailers they've been showing for the new marine movie- where becky is the villain.

[EoE: Well There's Your Problem]

Sept 19, 2018 9:48:55 GMT -5 sunnytaker said:

ya know it just hit me. I wonder if this becky "turn" was planned to coincide with the trailers they've been showing for the new marine movie- where becky is the villain.

Unlikely, because then they’d have kept Miz babyface for all these years instead of turning him back in 2014.

[sunnytaker]

Sept 19, 2018 9:54:49 GMT -5 EoE: Well There's Your Problem said:

Sept 19, 2018 9:48:55 GMT -5 sunnytaker said:

ya know it just hit me. I wonder if this becky "turn" was planned to coincide with the trailers they've been showing for the new marine movie- where becky is the villain.

Unlikely, because then they’d have kept Miz babyface for all these years instead of turning him back in 2014.

well to be fair though miz bragging about all his movie roles IS what has been keeping him heel. the becky thing even had her dressing in black on smackdown, just like she was in the trailer I saw. just thought it was a funny coincidence

[Dub H]

Sept 19, 2018 9:54:49 GMT -5 EoE: Well There's Your Problem said:

Sept 19, 2018 9:48:55 GMT -5 sunnytaker said:

ya know it just hit me. I wonder if this becky "turn" was planned to coincide with the trailers they've been showing for the new marine movie- where becky is the villain.

Unlikely, because then they’d have kept Miz babyface for all these years instead of turning him back in 2014.

Didnt they try to turn him face when he first starred in one of those Marine movies?

And it(the turn,not the movie) failed horribly?

I think it was in the same era Miz said "OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH" to his own mom joke.Which is pretty much the only thing i remember of it

[Pgarodactyl]

I think yesterday accentuated the problem I have buying Charlotte as a face: It's her face. She says all the right words. She vocalizes with conviction. But her face doesn't match the emotion or the words she's saying. When she said her line about wanting to see a small piece of her friend in Becky, her face just didn't show it. It took me right out of her words.

Becky, on the other hand, has been pulling off the best work of her WWE tenure. She's definitely proving that she deserves to be in the position she's in today.

But I may be biased.

[Nosnorb]

I am loving seeing Becky 3:16 kick Charlotte's arse weekly. Best part of Smackdown.

[cabbageboy]

I thought when I first heard of Marine 6 that Becky would be the female member of Miz and HBK's group or something. But she's the villain?

Who would believe the pure as the driven snow Rebecca Lynch as a villain anyway? :-P

[Dub H]

Sept 19, 2018 12:38:35 GMT -5 Pgarodactyl said:

I think yesterday accentuated the problem I have buying Charlotte as a face: It's her face. She says all the right words. She vocalizes with conviction. But her face doesn't match the emotion or the words she's saying. When she said her line about wanting to see a small piece of her friend in Becky, her face just didn't show it. It took me right out of her words.

Becky, on the other hand, has been pulling off the best work of her WWE tenure. She's definitely proving that she deserves to be in the position she's in today.

But I may be biased.

Charlotte doesnt know how to convey emotion. I dont feel emotion on her movements,expression or voice.

[Deleted]

Sept 19, 2018 14:03:30 GMT -5 Dub H said:

Sept 19, 2018 12:38:35 GMT -5 Pgarodactyl said:

I think yesterday accentuated the problem I have buying Charlotte as a face: It's her face. She says all the right words. She vocalizes with conviction. But her face doesn't match the emotion or the words she's saying. When she said her line about wanting to see a small piece of her friend in Becky, her face just didn't show it. It took me right out of her words.

Becky, on the other hand, has been pulling off the best work of her WWE tenure. She's definitely proving that she deserves to be in the position she's in today.

But I may be biased.

Charlotte doesnt know how to convey emotion. I dont feel emotion on her movements,expression or voice.

I actually think she's doing a fantastic job. Both are really hitting it out of the park with the material they've been given, even with the holes in the story.

[Dub H]

Sept 19, 2018 14:15:22 GMT -5 @dax said:

Sept 19, 2018 14:03:30 GMT -5 Dub H said:

Charlotte doesnt know how to convey emotion. I dont feel emotion on her movements,expression or voice.

I actually think she's doing a fantastic job. Both are really hitting it out of the park with the material they've been given, even with the holes in the story.

I mean,that is good,I wish I could.But I never have been able to believe anything Charlotte even does. The way she talks ,moves and expresses are always feels phony or robotic.

She is no kelly kelly or Bella of course.not sayign she is god damn awful at it just...meh.

[Mid-Carder]

Sept 19, 2018 14:15:22 GMT -5 @dax said:

Sept 19, 2018 14:03:30 GMT -5 Dub H said:

Charlotte doesnt know how to convey emotion. I dont feel emotion on her movements,expression or voice.

I actually think she's doing a fantastic job. Both are really hitting it out of the park with the material they've been given, even with the holes in the story.

I completely agree. I've never got the complaints about Charlotte's promos. She has serious presence and she and Becky are two of the few women in WWE that don't make me cringe when they're on a live mic. 

[Deleted]

Sept 19, 2018 14:32:30 GMT -5 Mid-Carder said:

Sept 19, 2018 14:15:22 GMT -5 @dax said:

I actually think she's doing a fantastic job. Both are really hitting it out of the park with the material they've been given, even with the holes in the story.

I completely agree. I've never got the complaints about Charlotte's promos. She has serious presence and she and Becky are two of the few women in WWE that don't make me cringe when they're on a live mic. 

At first, when she was a heel, she was a little rough on the mic when she'd randomly raise her voice, but I think she has turned herself into a really good promo. And even though the stuff with them acting like she's been a perfect angel the whole time she's been friends with Becky bothers me, she's doing a great job selling things with her facial expressions IMO.

[Allie Kitsune]

Sept 19, 2018 14:15:22 GMT -5 @dax said:

Sept 19, 2018 14:03:30 GMT -5 Dub H said:

Charlotte doesnt know how to convey emotion. I dont feel emotion on her movements,expression or voice.

I actually think she's doing a fantastic job. Both are really hitting it out of the park with the material they've been given, even with the holes in the story.

Charlotte has improved her speaking. She's still not amazing on the mic or anything, but she's not as bad as she used to be.

[Prince Petty]

Charlotte would be a better heel promo now than she is a babyface. Like most aspects of her character, she has a coldness that feels far more appropriate to a heel.

Out of character, she seems very warm and personable, but as soon as she gets into that ring, she just comes across as a big time heel.

[Final Countdown Jones]

Sept 19, 2018 1:49:14 GMT -5 @nichotine said:

Sept 19, 2018 0:45:17 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

And then beat Carmella herself and got added to the title match. Making a save doesn't just "make" someone a face and like I said a few weeks ago in a response to another one of your posts in another one of these threads, her "face turn" was a flat nothing and she never as a character had to answer for what she did. Charlotte didn't turn face making that save, we've just been expected to buy for over a year that she is one. When I say she hasn't had a moment of being a face, I mean on the broader sense of some manner of redemption or owning up to anything or just a sign she's a better person. "Is friends with Becky" wasn't anything more than the means by which they tried to milk sympathy for Charlotte when Becky turned on her.

At the very least Charlotte and Becky have been on screen friends for some time now. This isn't like Nia Jax/Alexa Bliss where the friendship was made up and crushed in the span of a month. Charlotte never had an over the top mea culpa but creative put their time into the friendship. Her redemption to me is through the fact that she had been accepted by the babyfaces as a friend since being drafted over to Smackdown.

For me personally I can't fathom how Becky isn't the heel in this feud. She's winning the popularity game because she's one of, if not the most colorful personality in the WWE, while Charlotte is very serious and simple. Even if the writers put a Star Trek level effort in the continuity of it there are a majority of people who just aren't gonna cheer Charlotte over Becky. I think the writing for this feud has been very compelling pro wrestling, and it's fun how polarizing it is, but Becky's being an asshole for sure.

It's not that Becky "isn't" the heel in this feud when it comes to just her actions in the feud itself. It's the broader story, it's the narrative of everything she's done in the time before this, it's how much sympathy she has and how little Charlotte has. A story where the villain has some some justification and the hero is just rampantly unlikable isn't specific to wrestling. Her move to Smackdown wasn't really a redemption; a bunch of heels said "We don't want Charlotte here because she's bad", some people those heels were already feuding with teamed up a bunch with Charlotte, and the idea Charlotte was bad or did things people didn't like was portrayed as the wrong attitude and therefore held by the heels. That's not storytelling or character development that's the kind of narrative depth you get in a weird self-funded vanity project by someone who can't act writing themselves as better than the people in their lives who wronged them.

Stories always have an obstacle to overcome when they're trying to make the audience feel the exact opposite of what they already feel. This might be a good story in general beats and ideas on paper, but the execution is lacking because the only real face narrative of any value Charlotte's ever had is "being betrayed by her friend", but she betrayed Becky and they never had any kind of moment where it was addressed. People have been calling Dean turning on Seth for a while, and that will be the inverse of what happened in the first place, but because of the ways they have rekindled their bond and worked out their problems on screen--something that the crowd was on fire for--the emotional connection between the fans and the story is there again, and narratively it becomes an interested step to see how things developed past forgiveness and into the tragedy of betrayal. Charlotte and Becky lacked this, and no matter how much Becky's actions may be the overtly heelish one, there's going to be a lot of people who can't quite get past how ineffective a face Charlotte is and actually sympathize with her, and a story where you root for the villain and the hero just nags at you is one that won't be looked at quite the same way.

[Dub H]

Sept 19, 2018 18:15:16 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

Sept 19, 2018 1:49:14 GMT -5 @nichotine said:

At the very least Charlotte and Becky have been on screen friends for some time now. This isn't like Nia Jax/Alexa Bliss where the friendship was made up and crushed in the span of a month. Charlotte never had an over the top mea culpa but creative put their time into the friendship. Her redemption to me is through the fact that she had been accepted by the babyfaces as a friend since being drafted over to Smackdown.

For me personally I can't fathom how Becky isn't the heel in this feud. She's winning the popularity game because she's one of, if not the most colorful personality in the WWE, while Charlotte is very serious and simple. Even if the writers put a Star Trek level effort in the continuity of it there are a majority of people who just aren't gonna cheer Charlotte over Becky. I think the writing for this feud has been very compelling pro wrestling, and it's fun how polarizing it is, but Becky's being an asshole for sure.

It's not that Becky "isn't" the heel in this feud when it comes to just her actions in the feud itself. It's the broader story, it's the narrative of everything she's done in the time before this, it's how much sympathy she has and how little Charlotte has. A story where the villain has some some justification and the hero is just rampantly unlikable isn't specific to wrestling. Her move to Smackdown wasn't really a redemption; a bunch of heels said "We don't want Charlotte here because she's bad", some people those heels were already feuding with teamed up a bunch with Charlotte, and the idea Charlotte was bad or did things people didn't like was portrayed as the wrong attitude and therefore held by the heels. That's not storytelling or character development that's the kind of narrative depth you get in a weird self-funded vanity project by someone who can't act writing themselves as better than the people in their lives who wronged them.

Stories always have an obstacle to overcome when they're trying to make the audience feel the exact opposite of what they already feel. This might be a good story in general beats and ideas on paper, but the execution is lacking because the only real face narrative of any value Charlotte's ever had is "being betrayed by her friend", but she betrayed Becky and they never had any kind of moment where it was addressed. People have been calling Dean turning on Seth for a while, and that will be the inverse of what happened in the first place, but because of the ways they have rekindled their bond and worked out their problems on screen--something that the crowd was on fire for--the emotional connection between the fans and the story is there again, and narratively it becomes an interested step to see how things developed past forgiveness and into the tragedy of betrayal. Charlotte and Becky lacked this, and no matter how much Becky's actions may be the overtly heelish one, there's going to be a lot of people who can't quite get past how ineffective a face Charlotte is and actually sympathize with her, and a story where you root for the villain and the hero just nags at you is one that won't be looked at quite the same way.

That is not even touching in the fact that for the fans Charlotte had it coming just form the fact that it was about Becky,fans knew Charlotte had all the opportunitie sbefore and didnt work as hard as Becky did.

There is no reason to see Charlotte as the good guy.

[King Devitt and the Woke Mob]

Sept 19, 2018 14:36:45 GMT -5 @dax said:

Sept 19, 2018 14:32:30 GMT -5 Mid-Carder said:

I completely agree. I've never got the complaints about Charlotte's promos. She has serious presence and she and Becky are two of the few women in WWE that don't make me cringe when they're on a live mic. 

At first, when she was a heel, she was a little rough on the mic when she'd randomly raise her voice, but I think she has turned herself into a really good promo. And even though the stuff with them acting like she's been a perfect angel the whole time she's been friends with Becky bothers me, she's doing a great job selling things with her facial expressions IMO.

agreed.

A few posts up it was said that Charlotte can't convey emotions, and I'm thinking, "are we watching the same matches/promos?"

She sold "betrayal" (her POV) at Summerslam perfectly.
She sold disappointment and trying to be a good sport at HIAC.
She sold being "disrespected" (again, her POV) on SDL fantastically.

What's the opposite of rose coloured glasses? Shit stained ones? Because that's how I feel Charlotte is looked at by some.
Even though I know the inverse could be said of me.

I think like most things (Roman for awhile before he started to appear lazy) people are taking the booking out on the performer.

[deezy]

Just now seen the segment. Maybe it's because I read about it in this thread before seeing and my expectations were high but I thought Becky was Avg at best.

Her promo (not the attack) is nothing more than Charlotte heel 2.0