All Japan vs New Japan

[David-Arquette was in WCW 2000]

I know very little of the histories of both New Japan and All Japan, though I do know that New Japan seems more well known. Has it always been this way or was All Japan as big or bigger back in the 80s and 90s?

[Deleted]

I'm not a Japanese wrestling historian but from my understanding they went back and forth on being the #1 company in Japan in the 70s through the 90s. Baba was a bigger star than Inoki when they wrestled in the same company and the early years of AJPW and NJPW.

[cabbageboy]

I'd say NJPW was more popular at the gate in terms of big shows that drew like 50-60,000 people. AJPW never really did much beyond the standard 15,000 seat buildings, did they? I'd say in the 1990s that AJPW was more of the critical darling though with Misawa, Kawada, Kobashi, etc. It's kind of sad that the two both cratered around the same time period, AJPW due to Baba's death and everyone of note defecting to form NOAH, while NJPW went into Inoki's whole MMA fascination that nearly wrecked the entire company.

[Convoy]

The following is just my opinion, but this is how I've always viewed them.

Both companies came to be in the same year, so neither has a true historical edge over the other in that way. However, New Japan has a richer history and is seen as the overall top company in Japan. I can't rattle-off decades of attendance numbers or anything, but they just have better angles (NOTE: not storyline angles; I'm referring to their ability to be seen by the most people and maintain a stronger following) than All Japan. It also helps perspective that they are outperforming All Japan currently and expanding worldwide better than any other puroresu company.

They've had the Tokyo Dome show on January 4th for over 25 years, which is THE pro-wrestling show in Japan. They have invited other companies to be a part of it, but it is their show. They also had working relationships with both WWF and WCW from the 70s-90s, which got them exposure in the West and allowed a lot of well-known western talent to be a part of their native shows. AJPW was a bit more insular, though obviously they had some NWA ties in the early years and some fantastic Gaijin stars in their peak years.

All that being said, and here is where it I may veer off on a different path than most: from solely my perspective, All Japan was bigger in the 90s. Now I wasn't alive to see New Japan stars in New York in the late-70s/early-80s, nor was I a WCW viewer in the 90s. So a lot of what I previously mentioned was more historical knowledge than my opinion as a fan. I didn't know or care about The Three Musketeers of NJPW as much as I loved The Four Pillars of Heaven in AJPW. As a tape-trader, I found AJPW to be a better product during this period and it was this decade that really made me a fan of puroresu as a whole. The only thing that captured me about NJPW was Jushin Liger and the junior matches, which while amazing, always felt second-fiddle to guys like Mutoh and Chono in the heavyweight division.

This doesn't even touch on Pro Wrestling NOAH as a company, which was arguably the top promotion in Japan from 2000-2006 while both NJPW and AJPW were having problems and needed to reshuffle. NOAH's success was due to taking the top All Japan talent and doing things in ways one could call similar to New Japan - building a junior division and allowing more outsiders to wrestle for the company. It was a nice blending for a few years.

[OVO 40 hunched over like he 80]

Historian Fumi Saito explained the early story of both promotions in the 605 superpodcast.

Rikidozan, the father of Japanese wrestling, found a young baseball player and turned him into a star, Giant Baba. During the same time, Rikidozan also found another protege but he never treated him as a star, matter of fact Rikidozan made him a flunkie who would wash his clothes and do other young boy duties, that was Antonio Inoki. Inoki grew jealous of Giant Baba and resented that Rikidozan chose him instead of Inoki.

Once Rikidozan died, both men broke away to start their promotions. It was easier for Giant Baba because of his stardom, Nippon TV went with him. Over time All Japan became an nwa affiliate and had the biggest stars in the world tour the company.

The path for Inoki was more difficult. He had to prove himself to be better than Baba, so his legend started growing because of matches that turned into shoots. Over time Inoki made people believe that he was the biggest badass in the world, a lot of that was thanks to the Ali fight fiasco.

Both companies eventually became huge and million dollars businesses. Unfortunately both almost croaked in the early 2000s. Inoki got so delusional that he fed his top guys to real mma fighters, they got exposed after receiving huge beatings in the first round. Inoki eventually had to sell New Japan. On All Japan’s side, after Giant Baba died, Misawa and about ninety percent of the roster, defected to create a new company called NOAH.

New Japan survived thanks to Hiroshi Tanahashi, who put the company on his back and carried it through the dark ages. Slowly he rebuilt it. Unfortunately All Japan never recovered.

[David-Arquette was in WCW 2000]

Thanks guys. That gives me some perspective on the two companies. It's a shame that All Japan never recovered, but I guess NOAH is kind of the spiritual successor.

[AwamoriRock]

Sept 21, 2018 4:43:26 GMT -5 David-Arquette was in WCW 2000 said:

Thanks guys. That gives me some perspective on the two companies. It's a shame that All Japan never recovered, but I guess NOAH is kind of the spiritual successor.

AJPW’s tag and main event scene is on fire and NOAH is very fun top top bottom match quality wise but they are just very inconsistent in drawing.

[Fundertaker]

AJPW was bigger than NJPW in the short period in the 80's when Riki Choshu was in AJPW and increased the pace of the big matches in the company.

Aside from the very beginnings of both companies and that period, NJPW was always the bigger company of the two.

[KAMALARAMBO: BOOMSHAKALAKA!!!]

Sept 21, 2018 5:19:26 GMT -5 Fundertaker said:

AJPW was bigger than NJPW in the short period in the 80's when Riki Choshu was in AJPW and increased the pace of the big matches in the company.

Aside from the very beginnings of both companies and that period, NJPW was always the bigger company of the two.

Yeah AJPW was almost always the smaller company, but it’s ridiculous how far they’ve fallen in recent years. Not quality wise but in terms of stature they’re almost the Impacf of Japan now. Once a number 2 company with potential fallen to being an indie.

[corndog]

Sept 21, 2018 4:43:26 GMT -5 David-Arquette was in WCW 2000 said:

Thanks guys. That gives me some perspective on the two companies. It's a shame that All Japan never recovered, but I guess NOAH is kind of the spiritual successor.

Actually nowadays, I would say All Japan is in better shape than NOAH, at least in terms of drawing power. Jun Akiyama taking over All Japan has been good for the company. Dragon Gate is the clear #2 to New Japan, with DDT and Big Japan behind it. So All Japan is not as popular as those companies, but it is doing better as of late, thanks to a great tag division and Kento Miyahara. They also have been bringing top indie stars from outside of the company, which has helped out a lot.