Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,394
|
Post by Mozenrath on Jan 24, 2019 1:29:55 GMT -5
This really doesn't need to get nasty. No one is here because they don't care about WWE or wrestling on some level. We're invested enough to post here, and even people who don't like WWE anymore once did and have that investment, or care about how the biggest wrestling company affects the landscape of wrestling with its actions and inaction.
We can, and will, discuss this without snapping at each other. Please, treat each other with dignity and respect.
|
|
riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
Posts: 10,323
|
Post by riseofsetian1981 on Jan 24, 2019 1:33:34 GMT -5
Now if only more people would stop watching and attending the shows rather than continually complaining. It's a good sign that people are catching on to the mediocre to horrible quality and actually finding more coherent entertainment.
|
|
Nikki Heyman
Fry's dog Seymour
EXTREEEEEME Pony Manager
✬ Believe In The Fight ✬
Posts: 24,018
|
Post by Nikki Heyman on Jan 24, 2019 1:34:58 GMT -5
They still have to write something that will at least please the PAYING fanbase and not the bitching fanbase. Ha ha yikes. Simple fact is, they're losing their paying fanbase by almost every measurable metric and haven't cared enough to do a damn thing to stop it. Casual and hardcore fans alike are tuning out and dropping the subscriptions. I don't catch Raw most weeks and haven't had a Network sub in months, I hover around waiting for the show to be something I feel like I'd want to watch again, and end up watching PPVs with friends because it's a social activity. Mania season is when a lot of casual fans tune in, and ever year fewer and fewer of them come back. This can't be a slow burn post-Mania evolution if they want to avoid another ratings crash, and whether or not they've decided to be slow about what may or may not be changing isn't the point. Waiting and hoping people stay tuned in isn't going to work and this week's ratings kind of prove it's not going to work. There's no more football to go up against and they still dropped to almost as low an hour three as they were pulling before they had to press the panic button. That's a sign shit's not working, and that their paying fanbase and their "bitching fanbase" are the same goddamn thing. People not being happy with a bunch of panic call-ups having no direction is not people being impossible to please, it's a measurable complaint people have had against the product for years. If you just want to paint everyone with a complaint as impossible to make happy, find better material. I would be happy to supply new material if there was a new complaint. You have already made up your mind and you're not watching anyway, so anything I say shouldn't matter to you. You don't contribute financially so WWE has no obligation to listen to you or please you.
|
|
|
Post by Final Countdown Jones on Jan 24, 2019 1:39:39 GMT -5
Ha ha yikes. Simple fact is, they're losing their paying fanbase by almost every measurable metric and haven't cared enough to do a damn thing to stop it. Casual and hardcore fans alike are tuning out and dropping the subscriptions. I don't catch Raw most weeks and haven't had a Network sub in months, I hover around waiting for the show to be something I feel like I'd want to watch again, and end up watching PPVs with friends because it's a social activity. Mania season is when a lot of casual fans tune in, and ever year fewer and fewer of them come back. This can't be a slow burn post-Mania evolution if they want to avoid another ratings crash, and whether or not they've decided to be slow about what may or may not be changing isn't the point. Waiting and hoping people stay tuned in isn't going to work and this week's ratings kind of prove it's not going to work. There's no more football to go up against and they still dropped to almost as low an hour three as they were pulling before they had to press the panic button. That's a sign shit's not working, and that their paying fanbase and their "bitching fanbase" are the same goddamn thing. People not being happy with a bunch of panic call-ups having no direction is not people being impossible to please, it's a measurable complaint people have had against the product for years. If you just want to paint everyone with a complaint as impossible to make happy, find better material. I would be happy to supply new material if there was a new complaint. You have already made up your mind and you're not watching anyway, so anything I say shouldn't matter to you. You don't contribute financially so WWE has no obligation to listen to you or please you. The problem isn't that your material is old, it's that you're misusing it. When people are already complaining about something, it's an established pattern. The call-ups aren't change, and people upset about the seemingly aimless direction of those call-ups aren't railing against change, it's the same old shit. The same old shit isn't change. I was contributing financially, I do not any longer because of how the product is. With how downard ratings and event attendance have trended, that's true for a lot of people. The company is not in a period of growth at all. They're in a period of audience decline, and the idea of "Eh if you aren't giving us money while we suck now, why should we care to improve down the line?" is baffling. If they didn't care about bringing their audience back they wouldn't have hit the panic button and made promises in the first place. There's no reason I can't speak my mind about it on an open forum either.
|
|
Nikki Heyman
Fry's dog Seymour
EXTREEEEEME Pony Manager
✬ Believe In The Fight ✬
Posts: 24,018
|
Post by Nikki Heyman on Jan 24, 2019 1:46:13 GMT -5
I would be happy to supply new material if there was a new complaint. You have already made up your mind and you're not watching anyway, so anything I say shouldn't matter to you. You don't contribute financially so WWE has no obligation to listen to you or please you. The problem isn't that your material is old, it's that you're misusing it. When people are already complaining about something, it's an established pattern. The call-ups aren't change, and people upset about the seemingly aimless direction of those call-ups aren't railing against change, it's the same old shit. The same old shit isn't change. I was contributing financially, I do not any longer because of how the product is. With how downard ratings and event attendance have trended, that's true for a lot of people. The company is not in a period of growth at all. They're in a period of audience decline, and the idea of "Eh if you aren't giving us money while we suck now, why should we care to improve down the line?" is baffling. If they didn't care about bringing their audience back they wouldn't have hit the panic button and made promises in the first place. There's no reason I can't speak my mind about it on an open forum either. When people continue to complain no matter what WWE does or doesn't do, what is WWE supposed to do, then? They give you what you ask for, it's still wrong. They don't give you anything, it's wrong. They come out of left field with something, it's wrong. Doesn't matter what WWE does, it's wrong. And I've never asked for people to stop posting. I've asked for balance.
|
|
|
Post by Final Countdown Jones on Jan 24, 2019 1:54:57 GMT -5
The problem isn't that your material is old, it's that you're misusing it. When people are already complaining about something, it's an established pattern. The call-ups aren't change, and people upset about the seemingly aimless direction of those call-ups aren't railing against change, it's the same old shit. The same old shit isn't change. I was contributing financially, I do not any longer because of how the product is. With how downard ratings and event attendance have trended, that's true for a lot of people. The company is not in a period of growth at all. They're in a period of audience decline, and the idea of "Eh if you aren't giving us money while we suck now, why should we care to improve down the line?" is baffling. If they didn't care about bringing their audience back they wouldn't have hit the panic button and made promises in the first place. There's no reason I can't speak my mind about it on an open forum either. When people continue to complain no matter what WWE does or doesn't do, what is WWE supposed to do, then? They give you what you ask for, it's still wrong. They don't give you anything, it's wrong. They come out of left field with something, it's wrong. Doesn't matter what WWE does, it's wrong. And I've never asked for people to stop posting. I've asked for balance. No, that's just it. It's not that. Objectively not that. I have liked things WWE has done. Hell in a Cell save for the last five minutes? Really good show. Evolution? Had a blast. Last year's Royal Rumble? Only issue I had with it was a 2-out-of-3 falls match going 2-0. Every time my friends have a live viewing party for a Takeover, it's a blast. There's specific matches and bits and angles I have thrown plenty of praise at. There is a ton of stuff WWE has done that I have enjoyed and all I want is for them to consistently be that good again so that I can trust them enough to re-up my subscription and tune in weekly again. I want to regularly enjoy and feel good watching WWE shows and every time a WWE show is good, in hindsight it becomes a really painful view of what the company could be if they could keep it up. The myth that people who complain about WWE will always complain about WWE is through and through bullshit. You're confusing bad ideas with all ideas. Unexpected call-ups isn't a solution to anything when there is an established issue of people being called up and ending up going nowhere. Issues of roster bloat and poor time management that has some people vanish for weeks or even months at a time. There is no way in which people saying "I have this complaint" are going to feel appeased when they are told in response "Well here is more of that thing you are complaining about". I don't think the issue is that there is no balance, it's that you've got your finger on the scale and you'll jump through as many weird reasoning hoops as you have to to keep claiming everyone unhappy with the product can't ever be happy.
|
|
Nikki Heyman
Fry's dog Seymour
EXTREEEEEME Pony Manager
✬ Believe In The Fight ✬
Posts: 24,018
|
Post by Nikki Heyman on Jan 24, 2019 2:09:33 GMT -5
When people continue to complain no matter what WWE does or doesn't do, what is WWE supposed to do, then? They give you what you ask for, it's still wrong. They don't give you anything, it's wrong. They come out of left field with something, it's wrong. Doesn't matter what WWE does, it's wrong. And I've never asked for people to stop posting. I've asked for balance. No, that's just it. It's not that. Objectively not that. I have liked things WWE has done. Hell in a Cell save for the last five minutes? Really good show. Evolution? Had a blast. Last year's Royal Rumble? Only issue I had with it was a 2-out-of-3 falls match going 2-0. Every time my friends have a live viewing party for a Takeover, it's a blast. There's specific matches and bits and angles I have thrown plenty of praise at. There is a ton of stuff WWE has done that I have enjoyed and all I want is for them to consistently be that good again so that I can trust them enough to re-up my subscription and tune in weekly again. I want to regularly enjoy and feel good watching WWE shows and every time a WWE show is good, in hindsight it becomes a really painful view of what the company could be if they could keep it up. The myth that people who complain about WWE will always complain about WWE is through and through bullshit. You're confusing bad ideas with all ideas. Unexpected call-ups isn't a solution to anything when there is an established issue of people being called up and ending up going nowhere. Issues of roster bloat and poor time management that has some people vanish for weeks or even months at a time. There is no way in which people saying "I have this complaint" are going to feel appeased when they are told in response "Well here is more of that thing you are complaining about". I don't think the issue is that there is no balance, it's that you've got your finger on the scale and you'll jump through as many weird reasoning hoops as you have to to keep claiming everyone unhappy with the product can't ever be happy. You're one of the few who has at least shown that there's something that they have liked about the product. What I usually see is a dick-waving contest on how much one hates the product and how long they've been hating it. To that, I don't think WWE is perfect either, but I have the patience to see if they're willing to own up to it. Vince being uncomfortable and finally realizing that he can't just throw anything on the screen because it makes him happy is a good start. HHH has been trying to show Vince that through how NXT is doing. Vince grumping about "showing you more of what you want and less of what you don't want" should tell everyone where things stand and that this isn't going to be an overnight thing. Thus HHH's clarification. And More often than not, when I come to WWE current I see a lot of negative subject lines, and the positive ones have someone shitting on whatever in the first five posts. That's not balance.
|
|
|
Post by Final Countdown Jones on Jan 24, 2019 2:20:54 GMT -5
No, that's just it. It's not that. Objectively not that. I have liked things WWE has done. Hell in a Cell save for the last five minutes? Really good show. Evolution? Had a blast. Last year's Royal Rumble? Only issue I had with it was a 2-out-of-3 falls match going 2-0. Every time my friends have a live viewing party for a Takeover, it's a blast. There's specific matches and bits and angles I have thrown plenty of praise at. There is a ton of stuff WWE has done that I have enjoyed and all I want is for them to consistently be that good again so that I can trust them enough to re-up my subscription and tune in weekly again. I want to regularly enjoy and feel good watching WWE shows and every time a WWE show is good, in hindsight it becomes a really painful view of what the company could be if they could keep it up. The myth that people who complain about WWE will always complain about WWE is through and through bullshit. You're confusing bad ideas with all ideas. Unexpected call-ups isn't a solution to anything when there is an established issue of people being called up and ending up going nowhere. Issues of roster bloat and poor time management that has some people vanish for weeks or even months at a time. There is no way in which people saying "I have this complaint" are going to feel appeased when they are told in response "Well here is more of that thing you are complaining about". I don't think the issue is that there is no balance, it's that you've got your finger on the scale and you'll jump through as many weird reasoning hoops as you have to to keep claiming everyone unhappy with the product can't ever be happy. You're one of the few who has at least shown that there's something that they have liked about the product. What I usually see is a dick-waving contest on how much one hates the product and how long they've been hating it. To that, I don't think WWE is perfect either, but I have the patience to see if they're willing to own up to it. Vince being uncomfortable and finally realizing that he can't just throw anything on the screen because it makes him happy is a good start. HHH has been trying to show Vince that through how NXT is doing. Vince grumping about "showing you more of what you want and less of what you don't want" should tell everyone where things stand and that this isn't going to be an overnight thing. Thus HHH's clarification. And More often than not, when I come to WWE current I see a lot of negative subject lines, and the positive ones have someone shitting on whatever in the first five posts. That's not balance. But a lot of that comes from how dim esteem of the product really is. After the shows I mentioned, there was a lot of strong, positive feedback, and for a little while people chilled right the hell out. When something fun came along like say the Nakamura dick punch meme, it brought life in the forum because it was something fun people could really get into. When there's something to be positive about, it feels like time and again that positivity shines. Survivor Series even brought out a lot of positivity for a Brock Lesnar match and if there is one thing that should be able to prove that good content will make people happy, it's that a Brock match got praise. But a product in audience decline and that isn't making people happy by and large isn't going to have "balance" in that regard when things are on a downswing in quality. I just feel like the audience at large won't have the patience for it, and this board is actually a "better" kind of fan for WWE than casuals when it comes to leaving the product. There's so many disaffected users who don't bother watching Raw but who hover around the product waiting for it to get good again because they care and want to get back into it when it shows signs of change. It might not seem ideal, but compare it to the people who tune out, move on, never come back. A solid half of the people at the Mania viewing party I went to last year no longer care about wrestling, to the point they've left the Facebook group chat among my friends about wrestling. They're gone. A good show won't bring them back. Takeovers won't even bring them back, they're burnt. It's those people who need to see fast change most of all, because once they're gone, they won't come back. They'll move on to something else like millions of other people who've fallen out of love with WWE have. Raw 25 last year didn't even break 5 million people, and nostalgia shows are usually good for rekindling old interest. This time it couldn't. That's why I feel they need to bring some solid and concrete change while they have the chance to. The audience needs to see and feel something if they want to keep them going, or else by the time the promised change comes, almost everyone who gave them the benefit of the doubt will be gone again. The clock is ticking and a varied entertainment market is working against them here. Again, I point you to this week's hour 3. That's the reality WWE faces if they're looking four months ahead for noticeable change.
|
|
|
Post by Feargus McReddit on Jan 24, 2019 2:40:59 GMT -5
For my own perspective, I stopped watching mostly because of the rumored TV deals (and partially because I couldn’t afford it at the time) for the fact that this is a company that can look at declining ratings, declining attendances and lack of concrete interest (YT doesn’t make them money, Tweets sure as hell don’t make them money) and go “Well, we’re going to make money anyway, why would we even need you?” so I took their bluff. They don’t need me anymore and only really go to big parties for bigger events because the atmosphere’s fun even when the shows aren’t.
The problem with roster call ups, in my mind, go way back to the days of late 2000s OVW for example. You can talk about people sucking and messing up all you want (and there are cases of that) but when you go from a 2002 class that are mostly still going today to calling up people and giving them no direction only to lose to HHH/Cena/Undertaker/Whoever and lose all investment in them, you’d think something would change.
And they did, they spent millions on a performance center, first of its kind in the world, they spent millions on a deal with a university to produce future WWE production people and to use their facilities, they lump their developmental’s events with that performance center because they recognize the talent is the thing that’ll make them money long term, they start work on international versions of that performance center structure...and we still get call ups that might as well be The Highlanders or Mordecai even if the standard is way better.
Along with that, people are probably taking a look at the shows and seeing that, again, just like it has been for 20 (TWENTY) years, McMahons are on TV as the authority figure and the only thing that’s really changed about it is that HHH is an “official” McMahon instead of a storyline one. Like, the fact they thought the solution to this, whether USA said it or they decided it themselves, was they needed to come back and be top dogs and blame Baron Corbin or whoever (Essentially a scapegoat even if it’s helped him get better reactions) is kind of like how in the UK, the soap opera EastEnders might as well be the same show it was in the mid 2000s with all the characters back that made the show popular beforehand. The only difference being that there’s at least new people in charge that use the pieces on the board differently from just slotting a checkers piece on a chess board and calling it a Rook for some reason.
I get it, people have the same complaints and those complaints are boring at times. But wouldn’t that demonstrate there are systematic problems that aren’t being fixed and haven’t been fixed that much since the mid 2000s when people were being literally shipped back to OVW in a box?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2019 2:57:27 GMT -5
For my own perspective, I stopped watching mostly because of the rumored TV deals (and partially because I couldn’t afford it at the time) for the fact that this is a company that can look at declining ratings, declining attendances and lack of concrete interest (YT doesn’t make them money, Tweets sure as hell don’t make them money) and go “Well, we’re going to make money anyway, why would we even need you?” so I took their bluff. They don’t need me anymore and only really go to big parties for bigger events because the atmosphere’s fun even when the shows aren’t. The problem with roster call ups, in my mind, go way back to the days of late 2000s OVW for example. You can talk about people sucking and messing up all you want (and there are cases of that) but when you go from a 2002 class that are mostly still going today to calling up people and giving them no direction only to lose to HHH/Cena/Undertaker/Whoever and lose all investment in them, you’d think something would change. And they did, they spent millions on a performance center, first of its kind in the world, they spent millions on a deal with a university to produce future WWE production people and to use their facilities, they lump their developmental’s events with that performance center because they recognize the talent is the thing that’ll make them money long term, they start work on international versions of that performance center structure...and we still get call ups that might as well be The Highlanders or Mordecai even if the standard is way better. Along with that, people are probably taking a look at the shows and seeing that, again, just like it has been for 20 (TWENTY) years, McMahons are on TV as the authority figure and the only thing that’s really changed about it is that HHH is an “official” McMahon instead of a storyline one. Like, the fact they thought the solution to this, whether USA said it or they decided it themselves, was they needed to come back and be top dogs and blame Baron Corbin or whoever (Essentially a scapegoat even if it’s helped him get better reactions) is kind of like how in the UK, the soap opera EastEnders might as well be the same show it was in the mid 2000s with all the characters back that made the show popular beforehand. The only difference being that there’s at least new people in charge that use the pieces on the board differently from just slotting a checkers piece on a chess board and calling it a Rook for some reason. I get it, people have the same complaints and those complaints are boring at times. But wouldn’t that demonstrate there are systematic problems that aren’t being fixed and haven’t been fixed that much since the mid 2000s when people were being literally shipped back to OVW in a box? The callups are admittedly the one thing I don’t like. You’ve got so many underutilized talent as it is, especially in the women’s division, so when you call up multiple people, where are those who haven’t even gotten their fair share going to be? When a Johnny Gargano or Lars or Lacey Evans or Bianca Belair get called up, what exactly are the Liv Morgan’s, Sonya’s, Mustafa Ali’s, or even Apollo Crew’s going to do? What are they going to gain aside from figuratively drowning in too much talent?
|
|
|
Post by Feargus McReddit on Jan 24, 2019 3:03:14 GMT -5
The callups are admittedly the one thing I don’t like. You’ve got so many underutilized talent as it is, especially in the women’s division, so when you call up multiple people, where are those who haven’t even gotten their fair share going to be? When a Johnny Gargano or Lars or Lacey Evans or Bianca Belair get called up, what exactly are the Liv Morgan’s, Sonya’s, Mustafa Ali’s, or even Apollo Crew’s going to do? What are they going to gain aside from figuratively drowning in too much talent? It’s something I can’t really understand. Surely you’d want to utilize as much talent as possible to get people invested so that you can make money from those people, even if it isn’t as much as your main eventers. Like, even Rusev at one time was selling a lot of stuff and his reward was not being used that much and only used when they need time to fill. The fact that they’ve decided to reunite the Edgeheads, for example, comes off way more like they don’t want Zack Ryder to go to AEW than it does that they actually have a plan for them long term.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2019 3:16:35 GMT -5
The callups are admittedly the one thing I don’t like. You’ve got so many underutilized talent as it is, especially in the women’s division, so when you call up multiple people, where are those who haven’t even gotten their fair share going to be? When a Johnny Gargano or Lars or Lacey Evans or Bianca Belair get called up, what exactly are the Liv Morgan’s, Sonya’s, Mustafa Ali’s, or even Apollo Crew’s going to do? What are they going to gain aside from figuratively drowning in too much talent? It’s something I can’t really understand. Surely you’d want to utilize as much talent as possible to get people invested so that you can make money from those people, even if it isn’t as much as your main eventers. Like, even Rusev at one time was selling a lot of stuff and his reward was not being used that much and only used when they need time to fill. The fact that they’ve decided to reunite the Edgeheads, for example, comes off way more like they don’t want Zack Ryder to go to AEW than it does that they actually have a plan for them long term. I actually see the Edgeheads reuniting as reintroducing a veteran tag team and giving both something to do rather than wanting Hawkins and Ryder to go to AEW. I believe Ryder has stated how comfortable he’s been in his position due to making enough money for his wife and such. Hawkins might be in the same boat as he has a daughter. You’re spot on with that though. I assume they only do it due to there being so many hours on both shows, but they can’t just stay on main event forever. I actually liked what they did with Crews because he was actually used to his strength and got the crowd behind him. If they can do that with more of their talent rather than just sending them out there at random times (This is a Raw only issue it seems.) then I’d have no issue with it, but the influx of newer talent will only hurt the other “new” talent than haven’t been given much to work with.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2019 3:24:34 GMT -5
The problem isn't that your material is old, it's that you're misusing it. When people are already complaining about something, it's an established pattern. The call-ups aren't change, and people upset about the seemingly aimless direction of those call-ups aren't railing against change, it's the same old shit. The same old shit isn't change. I was contributing financially, I do not any longer because of how the product is. With how downard ratings and event attendance have trended, that's true for a lot of people. The company is not in a period of growth at all. They're in a period of audience decline, and the idea of "Eh if you aren't giving us money while we suck now, why should we care to improve down the line?" is baffling. If they didn't care about bringing their audience back they wouldn't have hit the panic button and made promises in the first place. There's no reason I can't speak my mind about it on an open forum either. When people continue to complain no matter what WWE does or doesn't do, what is WWE supposed to do, then? They give you what you ask for, it's still wrong. They don't give you anything, it's wrong. They come out of left field with something, it's wrong. Doesn't matter what WWE does, it's wrong. And I've never asked for people to stop posting. I've asked for balance. You can certainly try multiple things and still be wrong repeatedly. WWE is very good at that. It's silly to imply they can do no right, when the obvious, much more likely conclusion to reach is that they have just been f***ing up a ton and their attempts to "change" have also been f***ups. The general response and consensus of their main, vocal fanbases would seem to support this conclusion.
|
|
|
Post by Feargus McReddit on Jan 24, 2019 3:26:24 GMT -5
It’s something I can’t really understand. Surely you’d want to utilize as much talent as possible to get people invested so that you can make money from those people, even if it isn’t as much as your main eventers. Like, even Rusev at one time was selling a lot of stuff and his reward was not being used that much and only used when they need time to fill. The fact that they’ve decided to reunite the Edgeheads, for example, comes off way more like they don’t want Zack Ryder to go to AEW than it does that they actually have a plan for them long term. I actually see the Edgeheads reuniting as reintroducing a veteran tag team and giving both something to do rather than wanting Hawkins and Ryder to go to AEW. I believe Ryder has stated how comfortable he’s been in his position due to making enough money for his wife and such. Hawkins might be in the same boat as he has a daughter. You’re spot on with that though. I assume they only do it due to there being so many hours on both shows, but they can’t just stay on main event forever. I actually liked what they did with Crews because he was actually used to his strength and got the crowd behind him. If they can do that with more of their talent rather than just sending them out there at random times (This is a Raw only issue it seems.) then I’d have no issue with it, but the influx of newer talent will only hurt the other “new” talent than haven’t been given much to work with. Oh no, I can buy that they’re happy in their spot and content and that factors in too for re-forming the team but it also feels like way too much of a coincidence even if it comes to that. It just comes down simply to me about importance and such and how weird that seems in a company designed to make money however way possible and coming up with ways to do that with what they have. I’ve talked about this before and you’ve mentioned this briefly but the forward thinking of call ups needs to change. You either build them with some kind of momentum and establish a character you want with them or you keep doing what they always do and tear said talents down before rebuilding them up and expecting people to suddenly care. And when they don’t, because they won’t, start the process again with new call ups.
|
|
MAGGLE
Dennis Stamp
Sigs/Avatars cannot exceed 1MB
Posts: 4,511
|
Post by MAGGLE on Jan 24, 2019 3:57:40 GMT -5
So one of the reasons why I love wrestling is that 1st time world champion feel. Someone works their entire life and finally achieves what he wanted.
I think this is also a new thing that I love: The WWE did everything in its powers NOT to do what the audience wanted...and they finally achieved the result of that. People are leaving. Vince being on TV is not saving anything. There is so much wrestling in the world out there right now. that a lot of fans that prefer different wrestling, switched over already to different promotions.
I think Smackdown is doing a lot of things right and Raw...well they are are trying something alright. I think the ratings won´t pick up again, like ever. I know around 20 wrestling fans personally and I am the only one that is actually following WWE
There are no real casual fans in my area of the world and the fans here are mostly Internet Fans. I am starting to see more consistently full arenas for small promotions then when WWE comes around. Of course they are different arenas, but it shows the direction of the fans. And Triple H is seeing this. The NXT expansion is going to be more important than people actually think. Creating a product for the preferences of the entire world is almost impossible. But if you split your content on every continent...that could actually work.
So lets say NXT UKs entire booking is only to entertain the core british audience. And NXT Latin America as well And NXT China And NXT India.
I think HHH thinks that people would actually stop watching the other NXT shows and focus on their own brand if given the choice. So therefore you can have territorial wrestlers again but on a global scale with talent exchanges.
Even if they get these huge TV deals, you have to think super long term. Just from the numbers alone both of these TV Shows are losing viewers and this has been happening for so many years. Even if they found people like Fox to pay insane amounts of money for it. Vince knows that this is just a project for Fox, getting that thing renewed is going to be next to impossible (since they won´t have more viewers then now). Vince should stop putting so much priority on those shows and just focus on the actual WWE Network. I think the time to safe the ship is long over.
|
|
|
Post by HMARK Center on Jan 24, 2019 7:40:59 GMT -5
Going by what I've seen/read, it does seem like Raw is at least trying to begin constructing show-long narratives that give people a reason to keep watching (e.g. the build up to Balor winning the #1 contendership), but that's a change that many people won't notice right away, so expecting ratings to go up immediately would be wishful thinking.
Issues do seem to remain aplenty: the promos aren't really much different outside of very few exceptions, the match layouts and psychology seem to be the same, and the general layout and format of the show hasn't seemed to change. I think it's clear that this format isn't going to hook people, and it's unlikely WWE will stumble onto a big angle or star with it any longer.
|
|
|
Post by corndog on Jan 24, 2019 11:05:13 GMT -5
Now if only more people would stop watching and attending the shows rather than continually complaining. It's a good sign that people are catching on to the mediocre to horrible quality and actually finding more coherent entertainment. People have stopped watching, but the big money television contracts leading to record revenues will justify whatever they do in the short term. I wouldn't expect them to make major changes until those deals come close to expiration or AEW/New Japan actually catch up to them, which will take a while.
|
|
|
Post by sunnytaker on Jan 24, 2019 11:06:34 GMT -5
hey now RAW did bring us the greatest special guest ref of all time Curt Hawkins this week.
|
|
The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,379
|
Post by The Ichi on Jan 24, 2019 12:44:00 GMT -5
The problem isn't that your material is old, it's that you're misusing it. When people are already complaining about something, it's an established pattern. The call-ups aren't change, and people upset about the seemingly aimless direction of those call-ups aren't railing against change, it's the same old shit. The same old shit isn't change. I was contributing financially, I do not any longer because of how the product is. With how downard ratings and event attendance have trended, that's true for a lot of people. The company is not in a period of growth at all. They're in a period of audience decline, and the idea of "Eh if you aren't giving us money while we suck now, why should we care to improve down the line?" is baffling. If they didn't care about bringing their audience back they wouldn't have hit the panic button and made promises in the first place. There's no reason I can't speak my mind about it on an open forum either. When people continue to complain no matter what WWE does or doesn't do, what is WWE supposed to do, then? They give you what you ask for, it's still wrong. They don't give you anything, it's wrong. They come out of left field with something, it's wrong. Doesn't matter what WWE does, it's wrong. And I've never asked for people to stop posting. I've asked for balance. Or...they could just start doing things right. Seems a lot of people don't think they are. Stop with the "there's no answer" crap. Wrestling fans aren't as difficult to please as you claim. Step 1: STOP BEING BORING. There.
|
|
Rican
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
July 17, 2011 - HHHe called it
Posts: 16,566
|
Post by Rican on Jan 24, 2019 12:50:44 GMT -5
The ad money they're making from the third hour can't be worth the disaster it is for the ratings. Like yeah there are huge systemic issues and writing problems that need to be addressed but...the show is soooo f***ing LONG. Like, just axing that would surely have to help?
|
|