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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jun 20, 2020 19:11:54 GMT -5
Of course it will.
Apart from anything else the names on the shit list are mostly big draws, and rest assured, someone will still book them.
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Square
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Post by Square on Jun 20, 2020 19:13:14 GMT -5
Of course it will. Apart from anything else the names on the shit list are mostly big draws, and rest assured, someone will still book them. They'll never draw decent numbers and any company that does pick up someone like Banks would be WRECKED
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 20, 2020 19:15:30 GMT -5
Has it taken a hit? Absolutely, but many of these companies have an opportunity to grow and become a force for good in the same way it was a force for talent around the time the boom started.
PROGRESS becoming...that is a blow but for every one of those, you have EVE, RIPTIDE, TNT, Resurgence, Breed, etc all making it clear they wouldn’t tolerate behavior like that which trust me, isn’t something you see often in the scene. Also all of those shows were kind of out drawing them anyway so...
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 20, 2020 19:15:48 GMT -5
Does anyone think that BritWres can recover from this? Even if WWE wasn't involved; I can't imagine that, even if shows were running, that people would want to go to them anymore and I wouldn't blame them. If we have to tear it down to the foundation and start again, we will. The scene can recover from this, and it will.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jun 20, 2020 19:16:26 GMT -5
Of course it will. Apart from anything else the names on the shit list are mostly big draws, and rest assured, someone will still book them. They'll never draw decent numbers and any company that does pick up someone like Banks would be WRECKED You're more of an optimist than I am.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 20, 2020 19:20:24 GMT -5
Has it taken a hit? Absolutely, but many of these companies have an opportunity to grow and become a force for good in the same way it was a force for talent around the time the boom started. PROGRESS becoming... that is a blow but for every one of those, you have EVE, RIPTIDE, TNT, Resurgence, Breed, etc all making it clear they wouldn’t tolerate behavior like that which trust me, isn’t something you see often in the scene. Also all of those shows were kind of out drawing them anyway so... Might wanna swap out EVE for Bellatrix on that list. EVE is run by people who helped blackball Pollyanna because the Swords of Essex had a problem with her, and the founder Emily Horror is a massive transphobe and I refuse to let that slide.
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Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by Square on Jun 20, 2020 19:27:33 GMT -5
Has it taken a hit? Absolutely, but many of these companies have an opportunity to grow and become a force for good in the same way it was a force for talent around the time the boom started. PROGRESS becoming... that is a blow but for every one of those, you have EVE, RIPTIDE, TNT, Resurgence, Breed, etc all making it clear they wouldn’t tolerate behavior like that which trust me, isn’t something you see often in the scene. Also all of those shows were kind of out drawing them anyway so... Honestly I can see a good portion of the most passionate fans just washing their hands, especially promotions that have a ton of these performaers in it.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 20, 2020 19:35:25 GMT -5
Has it taken a hit? Absolutely, but many of these companies have an opportunity to grow and become a force for good in the same way it was a force for talent around the time the boom started. PROGRESS becoming... that is a blow but for every one of those, you have EVE, RIPTIDE, TNT, Resurgence, Breed, etc all making it clear they wouldn’t tolerate behavior like that which trust me, isn’t something you see often in the scene. Also all of those shows were kind of out drawing them anyway so... Might wanna swap out EVE for Bellatrix on that list. EVE is run by people who helped blackball Pollyanna because the Swords of Essex had a problem with her, and the founder Emily Horror is a massive transphobe and I refuse to let that slide. Oh...yeah...
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Post by autisticgeordie on Jun 20, 2020 19:39:13 GMT -5
Has it taken a hit? Absolutely, but many of these companies have an opportunity to grow and become a force for good in the same way it was a force for talent around the time the boom started. PROGRESS becoming... that is a blow but for every one of those, you have EVE, RIPTIDE, TNT, Resurgence, Breed, etc all making it clear they wouldn’t tolerate behavior like that which trust me, isn’t something you see often in the scene. Also all of those shows were kind of out drawing them anyway so... Might wanna swap out EVE for Bellatrix on that list. EVE is run by people who helped blackball Pollyanna because the Swords of Essex had a problem with her, and the founder Emily Horror is a massive transphobe and I refuse to let that slide. It's a shame the people who run EVE are assholes because EVE has a roster stuffed with talented women.
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Square
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Official Ambassador
Grand Poobah of Scavenger Hunts 2011
Square-Because he looks good at all the right angles.
Posts: 18,701
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Post by Square on Jun 20, 2020 19:48:30 GMT -5
Isn't it interesting the most punk rock groups seem to be the most problematic?
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 21, 2020 9:37:17 GMT -5
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 21, 2020 9:44:23 GMT -5
Well, I'm apologising for ever recommending Bellatrix as a women's promotion. (I honestly had no idea) We’re all still learning a lot from this so don’t beat yourself up about it.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 21, 2020 11:03:13 GMT -5
So as someone who doesn't know the inner workings of PROGRESS is it safe to say that since Jim Smallman left the company has really taken a nose dive in how they are ran? even before the scandal it kind of felt like him leaving caused a negative turn there
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 21, 2020 11:18:23 GMT -5
So as someone who doesn't know the inner workings of PROGRESS is it safe to say that since Jim Smallman left the company has really taken a nose dive in how they are ran? even before the scandal it kind of felt like him leaving caused a negative turn there Well, yes and no. Yes because it feels like as a business, the parties that have taken over have demonstrated themselves to be inadequate to deal with booking halfway decent shows and especially in this situation, being good with PR at all. I haven't watched much but others might be more of an expert at specific stuff but there's less of a buzz around PROGRESS than there once was. And no because, well, a lot of those problems were around before Jim left and might have been leftovers from him. And it's very hard to book things around WWE talent without getting that "We all know you're just EVOLVE UK and you're not good at hiding it" stink off of it. And to be more serious, Millie's story, in particular, didn't have a timeframe so for all we know, this happened during the times he was there so it might be the only difference is that people are knowing about this now regardless.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 21, 2020 11:34:29 GMT -5
So as someone who doesn't know the inner workings of PROGRESS is it safe to say that since Jim Smallman left the company has really taken a nose dive in how they are ran? even before the scandal it kind of felt like him leaving caused a negative turn there Well, yes and no. Yes because it feels like as a business, the parties that have taken over have demonstrated themselves to be inadequate to deal with booking halfway decent shows and especially in this situation, being good with PR at all. I haven't watched much but others might be more of an expert at specific stuff but there's less of a buzz around PROGRESS than there once was. And no because, well, a lot of those problems were around before Jim left and might have been leftovers from him. And it's very hard to book things around WWE talent without getting that "We all know you're just EVOLVE UK and you're not good at hiding it" stink off of it. And to be more serious, Millie's story, in particular, didn't have a timeframe so for all we know, this happened during the times he was there so it might be the only difference is that people are knowing about this now regardless. The fact he mentioned Fairytale of New York for some reason and Millie's claimed age during the time place it at November or December 2017. Travis was Progress World Champion at that point.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 21, 2020 11:46:49 GMT -5
Well, yes and no. Yes because it feels like as a business, the parties that have taken over have demonstrated themselves to be inadequate to deal with booking halfway decent shows and especially in this situation, being good with PR at all. I haven't watched much but others might be more of an expert at specific stuff but there's less of a buzz around PROGRESS than there once was. And no because, well, a lot of those problems were around before Jim left and might have been leftovers from him. And it's very hard to book things around WWE talent without getting that "We all know you're just EVOLVE UK and you're not good at hiding it" stink off of it. And to be more serious, Millie's story, in particular, didn't have a timeframe so for all we know, this happened during the times he was there so it might be the only difference is that people are knowing about this now regardless. The fact he mentioned Fairytale of New York for some reason and Millie's claimed age during the time place it at November or December 2017. Travis was Progress World Champion at that point. I figured as much but I wanted someone to clarify so I appreciate that.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 21, 2020 11:47:54 GMT -5
Scott Davis has responded to allegations today. Of the people who have released statements his seems the most... i dunno if genuine is the right word, but the least artifical I feel.
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Post by Jaws the Shark on Jun 21, 2020 12:00:25 GMT -5
Well, yes and no. Yes because it feels like as a business, the parties that have taken over have demonstrated themselves to be inadequate to deal with booking halfway decent shows and especially in this situation, being good with PR at all. I haven't watched much but others might be more of an expert at specific stuff but there's less of a buzz around PROGRESS than there once was. And no because, well, a lot of those problems were around before Jim left and might have been leftovers from him. And it's very hard to book things around WWE talent without getting that "We all know you're just EVOLVE UK and you're not good at hiding it" stink off of it. And to be more serious, Millie's story, in particular, didn't have a timeframe so for all we know, this happened during the times he was there so it might be the only difference is that people are knowing about this now regardless. Creatively I think the downturn creatively and the disappearance of the buzz long predates Smallman's departure. I would argue that it goes all the way back to before the Wembley show even; the way they hotshotted the Dunne/Dragunov match on that card was quite weird, for example. It became very clear throughout 2019 that WWE had really got their claws in, and Smallman is very much complicit in that.
They did have their fair share of scandal before too, like the whole Pollyanna affair and Strangler Davis and I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting, but they were just never on the scale of this and didn't involve wrestlers as high profile as the ones involved now. And regardless of whether Smallman should shoulder any responsibility for these things, his departure didn't suddenly open the floodgates, these were issues that existed before.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 21, 2020 12:27:24 GMT -5
Scott Davis has responded to allegations today. Of the people who have released statements his seems the most... i dunno if genuine is the right word, but the least artifical I feel. Even then, it isn't far off from Devlin's one except less harsh language in terms of "I believe everyone whose told a story except this one specific person who is lying". I'll be honest, the Davis one hurts in particular. You hear certain things at times being with other people but Scotty was supportive to me in training and when we saw each other, he'd ask how I was doing but seeing it all in black and white...man... But even from my side, it's nothing compared to what Amy went through.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 21, 2020 16:04:28 GMT -5
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