Spider2024
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Post by Spider2024 on Feb 22, 2019 8:09:57 GMT -5
Guy was a talented wrestler (at least back in his Johnny B. Badd/"Wildman" days) and was a highly touted prospect going from WCW to WWF in 1996 (much like Steve Austin and Mick Foley were at around the same time) and was on the rise for a while. Eventually he tumbled down the card and left in late 1998. I've read and heard theories on basically "wha happun" with Mero and what stunted his climb in WWF. Most of the theories involve him being upstaged and nudged to the side in favor of Sable. I'd like to know, however, why he changed from the "Wildman" gimmick to the "Marvelous" gimmick after he injured his ACL. Was that ACL tear the actual reason he couldn't do the high-flying wrestling style anymore? I guess that would explain the gimmick change if so.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Feb 22, 2019 8:19:53 GMT -5
I'd say it was a couple of things.
Retrospectively there's a lot of negativity, the whole "they hired Johnny B Badd and he couldn't do anything else" but the Wildman was a pretty good gimmick for him.
Then the injury made him need to totally change his in ring style to, frankly, a more boring one.
The other thing was Sable. As the Wildman and paired with her, they were a great couple. But they split them and were dead set on pushing her and it ended up hurting him. Most of the rest of his run was trying to chase after and get one over on her, the match where they faced each other leading to her firing, bringing in Jackie. For various reasons, in no era is "man is obsessed with his ex" a good look.
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Post by realist on Feb 22, 2019 8:25:58 GMT -5
Honestly, I think it was a number of things:
1.) A lot of guys like Steve Austin and Mick Foley were envious of his large contract, so I'd be willing to bet that none of these guys went out of his way to make him look good.
2.) Sable. She debuted alongside Marc Mero and they were to be the new Macho Man and Elizabeth. However, the times were changing. Whereas Elizabeth stayed in the background as a meek, nervous, and innocent valet and Macho Man had more than enough charisma to never be outshone by her. On the other hand, Sable came out during the attitude era. She would wear the skimpiest leather outfits and bikinis and the audience loved it. Marc Mero simply didn't have the charisma to compete with his own valet. Vince McMahon wanted them to be the new Macho Man and Elizabeth. They ended up being the new Shawn Michaels and Marty Janetty.
3.) The Wildman gimmick. I mean, what exactly was that?! He wore leopard print crap and that made him a wild man in Vince McMahon's book.
4.) An untimely injury. He injured his knee right before WrestleMania 13 where he was supposed to face Rocky Maivia for the intercontinental title. If I remember correctly, he was in the midst of a heel turn at the time, being jealous of Sable showing attention to Rocky. It could have been something, but he lost out on that opportunity.
5.) He simply was not selfish enough. He seemed like the type of guy who just went along with whatever the bookers told him. Unfortunately, that meant getting powerbombed and beaten by Sable. After that, he was a joke and none of the top guys wanted to work with him. there is a famous story that he was supposed to work brief program with "Stone Cold" Steve Ausin, and as soon as Austin saw Sable powerbomb him, Austin went to Vince McMahon and said, "Who am I working with now? I ain't working with Marc after that shit."
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Feb 22, 2019 9:05:57 GMT -5
Honestly, I think it was a number of things: 1.) A lot of guys like Steve Austin and Mick Foley were envious of his large contract, so I'd be willing to bet that none of these guys went out of his way to make him look good. 2.) Sable. She debuted alongside Marc Mero and they were to be the new Macho Man and Elizabeth. However, the times were changing. Whereas Elizabeth stayed in the background as a meek, nervous, and innocent valet and Macho Man had more than enough charisma to never be outshone by her. On the other hand, Sable came out during the attitude era. She would wear the skimpiest leather outfits and bikinis and the audience loved it. Marc Mero simply didn't have the charisma to compete with his own valet. Vince McMahon wanted them to be the new Macho Man and Elizabeth. They ended up being the new Shawn Michaels and Marty Janetty. 3.) The Wildman gimmick. I mean, what exactly was that?! He wore leopard print crap and that made him a wild man in Vince McMahon's book. 4.) An untimely injury. He injured his knee right before WrestleMania 13 where he was supposed to face Rocky Maivia for the intercontinental title. If I remember correctly, he was in the midst of a heel turn at the time, being jealous of Sable showing attention to Rocky. It could have been something, but he lost out on that opportunity. 5.) He simply was not selfish enough. He seemed like the type of guy who just went along with whatever the bookers told him. Unfortunately, that meant getting powerbombed and beaten by Sable. After that, he was a joke and none of the top guys wanted to work with him. there is a famous story that he was supposed to work brief program with "Stone Cold" Steve Ausin, and as soon as Austin saw Sable powerbomb him, Austin went to Vince McMahon and said, "Who am I working with now? I ain't working with Marc after that shit." Just on the heel turn, I think it was both him and Sable, right before he went out, Mero and Taker had a match and Sable confronted Taker and even slapped him, just been watching that era on the Network.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2019 9:21:52 GMT -5
he couldn't do his Little Richard gimmick anymore
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2019 9:27:45 GMT -5
Hard to imagine that a guy could get over so big doing a Little Richard gimmick in WCW and then fall so hard in WWE.
Overall, I think WWE handled him pretty well early on. The "Wildman" moniker was essentially just a derivative of Johnny B. Badd and it seemed to work just fine. Ultimately, I think the injury is what ended Mero's climb. Sable getting over and eclipsing him was just the writing on the wall.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Feb 22, 2019 9:46:48 GMT -5
Without the Johnny B Badd character, he was a solid, unspectacular dude.
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Feb 22, 2019 9:56:55 GMT -5
He had no character much to speak of. I guess he was Wild, which amount to bugging his eyes out and the Shooting Star Press.
Losing to his 120lbs wife certainly didn’t do him any favours.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2019 10:09:12 GMT -5
Without the Johnny B Badd character, he was a solid, unspectacular dude. Thing about that is, Johnny B. Badd at the end of his WCW run was nothing like Johnny B. Badd in the beginning. In 1995-96, Johnny B. Badd looked pretty much like "Wildman" Marc Mero so it's not as if he was still out there wearing lipstick, rouge and garters right before he left for WWE.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2019 10:14:19 GMT -5
I think the injury is the biggest thing...he was clearly getting a big push and that just derailed all of his momentum. Then he, who was known for this flamboyant character, had to come back as SRS heel #173733 which never stood a chance.
Sable upstaging him, as others have said, really did him no favors although I don’t think that’s THE reason because I think, but for the injury, they would have risen up the card together.
Also, without derailing the thread, I’ve always kind of gotten the vibe that he wasn’t particularly well-liked in the back. And for his part, Mero’s never really had great things to say about his time in the business himself. He was pretty much the most outspoken ex-wrestler on the news and talk show circuit in the Benoit aftermath from what I recall.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2019 11:03:37 GMT -5
Going back and watching it he was phenomenal as a over the top delusional heel personality when he comes back as a heel in late 97 and through the Sable breakup the only problem was he was pretty crappy in the ring at that point and having him sell huge for Sable zapped any credibility he had.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 22, 2019 11:18:53 GMT -5
Cornette explained that the biggest mistake was giving him a valet, Sable, when he was introduced as a babyface, that having a hot girl walk you to the ring gets you heat and contempt from the fans.
I agree with that assessment, that valets are tools to get heat. Macho I think started out as a heel with Miss Elisabeth.
I also think that Sable had so much charisma that she took the attention away from Mero.
Lol Marc probably regrets taking Sable to that first meeting with Vince in which he asked her to also appear on tv.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 22, 2019 11:22:03 GMT -5
He had no character much to speak of. I guess he was Wild, which amount to bugging his eyes out and the Shooting Star Press. Losing to his 120lbs wife certainly didn’t do him any favours. Lol Austin was going to work a program against Mero to win Sable and they were teasing an Austin-Sable partnership, but once she took out Mero, Steve went to Vince and vetoed the program. Marc worked himself out of a money making program against Austin.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Feb 22, 2019 11:32:33 GMT -5
Cornette explained that the biggest mistake was giving him a valet, Sable, when he was introduced as a babyface, that having a hot girl walk you to the ring gets you heat and contempt from the fans. I agree with that assessment, that valets are tools to get heat. Macho I think started out as a heel with Miss Elisabeth. I also think that Sable had so much charisma that she took the attention away from Mero. Lol Marc probably regrets taking Sable to that first meeting with Vince in which he asked her to also appear on tv. I don't totally agree with that. It's about how they act. Just seeing a guy with a hot girl doesn't cause some instinctive reaction, it's when they act like they're hot shit because of it. Savage was a heel, but Liz was a babyface and she was a big reason for both of his face turns. Lita was with the Hardys, never did them any harm. Sable was someone who in kayfabe, Mero had rescued from HHH, her being around wasn't a problem. Basically, he'd got the girl, how much of fiction involves that premise? People don't turn on the guys once it's happened generally.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 22, 2019 11:38:34 GMT -5
Cornette explained that the biggest mistake was giving him a valet, Sable, when he was introduced as a babyface, that having a hot girl walk you to the ring gets you heat and contempt from the fans. I agree with that assessment, that valets are tools to get heat. Macho I think started out as a heel with Miss Elisabeth. I also think that Sable had so much charisma that she took the attention away from Mero. Lol Marc probably regrets taking Sable to that first meeting with Vince in which he asked her to also appear on tv. I don't totally agree with that. It's about how they act. Just seeing a guy with a hot girl doesn't cause some instinctive reaction, it's when they act like they're hot shit because of it. Savage was a heel, but Liz was a babyface and she was a big reason for both of his face turns. Lita was with the Hardys, never did them any harm. Sable was someone who in kayfabe, Mero had rescued from HHH, her being around wasn't a problem. Basically, he'd got the girl, how much of fiction involves that premise? People don't turn on the guys once it's happened generally. Lita was also a wrestler and did the high flying Hardy style which is why the fans accepted her. She was seen as a wrestler first and not a valet. Savage started as a heel and would berate Liz and even use her as a distraction. I believe that it’s a mental reaction on most people that for some weird reason when they see a couple and the girl is really really hot, they get mad and jealous like f*** this guy what he has that I don’t.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Feb 22, 2019 11:40:51 GMT -5
I don't totally agree with that. It's about how they act. Just seeing a guy with a hot girl doesn't cause some instinctive reaction, it's when they act like they're hot shit because of it. Savage was a heel, but Liz was a babyface and she was a big reason for both of his face turns. Lita was with the Hardys, never did them any harm. Sable was someone who in kayfabe, Mero had rescued from HHH, her being around wasn't a problem. Basically, he'd got the girl, how much of fiction involves that premise? People don't turn on the guys once it's happened generally. Lita was also a wrestler and did the high flying Hardy style which is why the fans accepted her. She was seen as a wrestler first and not a valet. Savage started as a heel and would berate Liz and even use her as a distraction. I believe that it’s a mental reaction on most people that for some weird reason when they see a couple and the girl is really really hot, they get mad and jealous like f*** this guy what he has that I don’t. I must be weird, literally never had that reaction when watching a show lol
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2019 11:45:13 GMT -5
Cornette explained that the biggest mistake was giving him a valet, Sable, when he was introduced as a babyface, that having a hot girl walk you to the ring gets you heat and contempt from the fans. I agree with that assessment, that valets are tools to get heat. Macho I think started out as a heel with Miss Elisabeth. I also think that Sable had so much charisma that she took the attention away from Mero. Lol Marc probably regrets taking Sable to that first meeting with Vince in which he asked her to also appear on tv. I don't totally agree with that. It's about how they act. Just seeing a guy with a hot girl doesn't cause some instinctive reaction, it's when they act like they're hot shit because of it. Savage was a heel, but Liz was a babyface and she was a big reason for both of his face turns. Lita was with the Hardys, never did them any harm. Sable was someone who in kayfabe, Mero had rescued from HHH, her being around wasn't a problem. Basically, he'd got the girl, how much of fiction involves that premise? People don't turn on the guys once it's happened generally. Also, Kimberly Page was babyface with Johnny B. Badd. Same angle as Sable, he rescued her from DDP. She didn't have an adverse effect on Mero, nor Booty Man nor DDP when she managed him during his face run.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 22, 2019 11:50:28 GMT -5
Lita was also a wrestler and did the high flying Hardy style which is why the fans accepted her. She was seen as a wrestler first and not a valet. Savage started as a heel and would berate Liz and even use her as a distraction. I believe that it’s a mental reaction on most people that for some weird reason when they see a couple and the girl is really really hot, they get mad and jealous like f*** this guy what he has that I don’t. I must be weird, literally never had that reaction when watching a show lol Rasslin isn’t a normal show.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Feb 22, 2019 11:53:56 GMT -5
I must be weird, literally never had that reaction when watching a show lol Rasslin isn’t a normal show. Very true. I still think Cornette has a old fashioned and somewhat low opinion of audiences though. Like how he got annoyed with Jericho and Storm because they wouldn't go around banging rats like the good old days and that hurt them as babyfaces. By the mid 90s at least, there wasn't as much of a knee jerk reaction in these kinds of situations.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on Feb 22, 2019 12:10:16 GMT -5
Vince tried making him Macho Man 2.0. Theres the first problem.
Seriously watch Wildman with Sable and tell me they weren't going for Savage/Liz in the 90s.
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