Meltzer: ROH is in a very weird situation, Enzo and Cass etc

[Wieners=$$$]

*Shrug* I like it when a promotion takes a gamble, especially when they've been considered stale. The American wrestling landscape is greatly shook, and will be a lot of fun to watch over the next years. I have agreed that ROH has played things too safe with their partnership with NJPW, for too long, and they should be nothing more but talent exchanging going forward. Talent relations will make, or break, ROH going forward considering how cut their roster has become in such a short time.

I find it funny when their roster is criticized for lacking talent. It isn't. Shane Taylor, who may be considered no more than an ass, had a great match against Cobb. ROH has a good track record of hiding the lesser-talent. After-all, for every Low-Ki, Bryan Danielson, Samoa Joe, Briscoes, there have been a Xavier, Adam Pierce, Necro Butcher and Carnage Crew.

The product has survived for nearly 20 years. I will admit that with the current appearance of AEW, ROH has got to stop playing things safe. I like the current roster, I don't hate the current champions, except for GoD, and I am invested in their current angles. As a fan since 2004, I am very interested in seeing what they produce next.

[corndog]

Apr 12, 2019 21:35:44 GMT -5 Mozenrath said:

Apr 12, 2019 18:43:24 GMT -5 Rudy Gobert Fingers said:

I think the funniest thing about the worked shoot is that they did it in a match that f***ing Jado was at ringside for.

For me, it's that they wanted it to happen then so A. Bully Ray gets two segments, gotta get that, and B. during their tag title match with NJPW, which just makes me think they had no confidence anyone would care if it happened in the who-gives-a-shit Bully and Flip Gordon match, where it would have been way more appropriate.

Also, not telling NJPW, did they (rightfully) assume the Tongans would kick the shit out of Enzo if he touched them?

Now I wish Enzo would have done that.

[Deleted]

Apr 12, 2019 17:31:25 GMT -5 honsou said:

Apr 12, 2019 12:24:10 GMT -5 @returnofthestryker said:

Always amazes me how someone so bad at articulating themselves verbally is such a good writer. I mean, the story aside, that's just excellent prose.

I've been cool on ROH for a while, especially since the signing of PCO, but the apparent state of booking, the attempts to 'work the (New Japan) boys' and bringing in Enzo...complete jumping off point.

Its actually really common for a great writer to not be able to articulate themselves verbally well. Other way around too, just two completely separate skills.

I think the biggest issue with bringing in Enzo is that it's just going to upset a lot of people and brings nothing fun to the show. At least with PCO you're going to see some crazy stuff and a guy clearly having fun.

I keep hearing that with PCO. All I see in a chunky older dude doing sloppy, poorly executed high spots to get booked. I can see that on most small indy cards and they don't get praised for it. I've come to accept I just don't get this one.

[Final Countdown Jones]

ROH feels like a shell of its former self, and that's not even in a sense of what it's trying to be. Growing out from your roots is fine, it just doesn't really feel like they've grown, it feels like they've regressed. Like where they used to be exciting and different and must-see, now it's just kind of there and I'm largely unimpressed with what they're putting out. Whatever it is they're trying to be, they aren't really succeeding at it right now. TNA's got a similar issue where it's not really striking home on what it's trying to accomplish, but I think TNA has a leg up on ROH right now and they're more focused on something. It's companies that used to be the exciting cutting edge of something new and different becoming something that's just completely fallen behind the rest of the flock and is held aloft by name only.

They were able to ride The Elite's hype for a while but I wouldn't be surprised to see the growth they've been flaunting begin to ebb if their best offer for a replacement top act is f***ing Matt Taven.

[corndog]

Apr 13, 2019 4:58:17 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

ROH feels like a shell of its former self, and that's not even in a sense of what it's trying to be. Growing out from your roots is fine, it just doesn't really feel like they've grown, it feels like they've regressed. Like where they used to be exciting and different and must-see, now it's just kind of there and I'm largely unimpressed with what they're putting out. Whatever it is they're trying to be, they aren't really succeeding at it right now. TNA's got a similar issue where it's not really striking home on what it's trying to accomplish, but I think TNA has a leg up on ROH right now and they're more focused on something. It's companies that used to be the exciting cutting edge of something new and different becoming something that's just completely fallen behind the rest of the flock and is held aloft by name only.

They were able to ride The Elite's hype for a while but I wouldn't be surprised to see the growth they've been flaunting begin to ebb if their best offer for a replacement top act is f***ing Matt Taven.

Not sure if TNA quite has a leg up on ROH, but ROH moved themselves down significantly with this show. Impact has been much better as of late, but it's still washing the stink from the 2010 and onwards era that made the promotion synonymous with bad booking and bringing in WWE/WCW washouts. Many people even said what ROH did here reminded them of TNA, because they used many of the same elements.

To me this reminded me of the January 4th, 2010 episode of Impact. Now it wasn't quite that bad, but the episode had more eyes on it than ever and it was complete clusterf***. ROH had an opportunity to show the world there was life after the Elite and they completely crapped the bed. Also, much like TNA going into the January 4th show, ROH hasn't been bad lately and I actually thought they could turn things around with some of the strong talent they recently brought in. But I have a feeling Bully Ray has gotten into Joe Koff and Sinclair's ear, which would explain Enzo and Cass(that has his fingerprints all over it) and the Beautiful People garbage that is ten years too late.

[Deleted]

Apr 12, 2019 23:06:46 GMT -5 Wieners=$$$ said:

Xavier, Adam Pierce, Necro Butcher and Carnage Crew.

I find all of them much more interesting characters/wrestlers than 2019 ROH. Give me Carnage Crew or Necro in a brawl every day of the week over useless Matt Taven.

[darbus alan]

I have agreed that ROH has played things too safe with their partnership with NJPW, for too long, and they should be nothing more but talent exchanging going forward. Talent relations will make, or break, ROH going forward considering how cut their roster has become in such a short time.

I don't think ROH is going to have to worry about its relationship with NJPW for much longer.

[Wieners=$$$]

Apr 13, 2019 12:13:36 GMT -5 @mack619 said:

Apr 12, 2019 23:06:46 GMT -5 Wieners=$$$ said:

Xavier, Adam Pierce, Necro Butcher and Carnage Crew.

I find all of them much more interesting characters/wrestlers than 2019 ROH. Give me Carnage Crew or Necro in a brawl every day of the week over useless Matt Taven.

Now that's funny haha!

[dct]

Apr 13, 2019 9:21:37 GMT -5 corndog said:

Apr 13, 2019 4:58:17 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

ROH feels like a shell of its former self, and that's not even in a sense of what it's trying to be. Growing out from your roots is fine, it just doesn't really feel like they've grown, it feels like they've regressed. Like where they used to be exciting and different and must-see, now it's just kind of there and I'm largely unimpressed with what they're putting out. Whatever it is they're trying to be, they aren't really succeeding at it right now. TNA's got a similar issue where it's not really striking home on what it's trying to accomplish, but I think TNA has a leg up on ROH right now and they're more focused on something. It's companies that used to be the exciting cutting edge of something new and different becoming something that's just completely fallen behind the rest of the flock and is held aloft by name only.

They were able to ride The Elite's hype for a while but I wouldn't be surprised to see the growth they've been flaunting begin to ebb if their best offer for a replacement top act is f***ing Matt Taven.

Not sure if TNA quite has a leg up on ROH, but ROH moved themselves down significantly with this show. Impact has been much better as of late, but it's still washing the stink from the 2010 and onwards era that made the promotion synonymous with bad booking and bringing in WWE/WCW washouts. Many people even said what ROH did here reminded them of TNA, because they used many of the same elements.

To me this reminded me of the January 4th, 2010 episode of Impact. Now it wasn't quite that bad, but the episode had more eyes on it than ever and it was complete clusterf***. ROH had an opportunity to show the world there was life after the Elite and they completely crapped the bed. Also, much like TNA going into the January 4th show, ROH hasn't been bad lately and I actually thought they could turn things around with some of the strong talent they recently brought in. But I have a feeling Bully Ray has gotten into Joe Koff and Sinclair's ear, which would explain Enzo and Cass(that has his fingerprints all over it) and the Beautiful People garbage that is ten years too late.

That was what I was thinking when that happened, especially after hearing him on JR's podcast a couple of days before the event where he was saying how ROH needs to get out of it's comfort zone and other such stuff now that they have AEW to deal with. So after hearing him say stuff like that it wouldn't shock me if he talked ROH into doing the Enzo and Cass thing and the beautiful people. Though I do think that the beautiful people could be Delirious running with Madison Rayne's pitch.

[honsou]

Apr 13, 2019 12:13:36 GMT -5 @mack619 said:

Apr 12, 2019 23:06:46 GMT -5 Wieners=$$$ said:

Xavier, Adam Pierce, Necro Butcher and Carnage Crew.

I find all of them much more interesting characters/wrestlers than 2019 ROH. Give me Carnage Crew or Necro in a brawl every day of the week over useless Matt Taven.

Necro in ROH was the best, that's an example of a guy who walked in in the building you knew instantly he was going to kick people's asses. He had a presence. ROH's issue is they have a difficult time building that in their roster and have now gone to the point where they are signing people who people just actively hate for their behind the scenes stuff to get that "buzz"