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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on May 19, 2020 13:57:10 GMT -5
This reminds me of Kendrick Perkins saying that Lebron was better than Jordan. Scrubs shouldn’t be allowed to question the goat. It is going to be a clash of generations People 20 and under have known the greatness of LeBron but only know the legend of MJ. Now they got to see it with their own eyes and that is only part of his greatness but since they never witnessed Jordan live and in the moment I can still see them saying LeBron There is no discussion, Lebron came to the well several times and left empty handed. Jordan also played on an era where pretty much assaulting people was encouraged. |
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on May 19, 2020 14:05:15 GMT -5
It is going to be a clash of generations People 20 and under have known the greatness of LeBron but only know the legend of MJ. Now they got to see it with their own eyes and that is only part of his greatness but since they never witnessed Jordan live and in the moment I can still see them saying LeBron There is no discussion, Lebron came to the well several times and left empty handed. Jordan also played on an era where pretty much assaulting people was encouraged. https://www.instagram.com/p/CAYWH8XAvPC Won't stop the cheerleaders. Now that the documentary is over, they trying put focus back on LeBron |
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on May 19, 2020 14:07:56 GMT -5
There is no discussion, Lebron came to the well several times and left empty handed. Jordan also played on an era where pretty much assaulting people was encouraged. https://www.instagram.com/p/CAYWH8XAvPC Won't stop the cheerleaders. Now that the documentary is over, they trying put focus back on LeBron Windhorst is a dick rider for Lebron as has written books about him, of course he’s not gonna say anything bad about his boss. |
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BRV
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by BRV on May 19, 2020 15:04:08 GMT -5
The only thing Channing Frye is right about is saying that "guys wouldn't want to play with him" in today's era. In that regard, he's probably 100 percent correct, because today's era of superstars would probably run to their Instagram and Twitter accounts to immediately complain about how Michael Jordan's bullying them at practice, it would turn into an enormous scandal, the hot take jackals on "First Take" and "Undisputed" would debate what this means to Michael Jordan's legacy, MJ would have to do a sit-down interview with Tom Rinaldi having to defend himself, and he'd probably end up getting suspended for a few games because of it instead of the players understanding that Jordan is trying to squeeze every bit of talent out of them and that, yeah, he's being a tyrant about it, but it's for the greater good. Windhorst is a dick rider for Lebron as has written books about him, of course he’s not gonna say anything bad about his boss. Brian Windhorst is a straight-up sock puppet and has been from the moment LeBron departed Cleveland for Miami back in 2010. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if his paychecks were signed by LeBron James rather than ESPN. |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2020 16:10:36 GMT -5
There are A LOT of LBJ dickriders in the media. That’s why ESPN has to shoehorn a MJ/LBJ topic everyday on their channels. They want to create that narrative when there should be no doubt in anyone’s mind that Jordan was better. It’s amazing to me how much LeBron controls the media. This dude flat out supported China for his own financial gain, threw Morey under the bus, and came out of it without a scratch. Leaves to create super teams, goes back home to Cleveland only when it benefitted him (Wade on the downside of his career, Cleveland had Kyrie and a #1 pick he knew was going to land Love), etc. Yet this man still loses 5 out of 8 Finals even with all that, and he’s still in the damn GOAT conversation.
I feel like a lot of this is just created so ESPN can have topics to discuss everyday on First Take, because there clearly isn’t enough “how does (insert anything in life) impact LeBron’s legacy” topics for SAS and Max to faux rage over.
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Post by RadcapRadsley on May 19, 2020 18:54:15 GMT -5
There is no discussion, Lebron came to the well several times and left empty handed. Jordan also played on an era where pretty much assaulting people was encouraged. https://www.instagram.com/p/CAYWH8XAvPC Won't stop the cheerleaders. Now that the documentary is over, they trying put focus back on LeBron I don't think Windhorst is wrong,MJ isn't just the goat I think he cares more than say Gretzky,Pele,Bonds etc at still being thought of as the goat. While I don't think Lebron was threatening his status,he is/was threatening the perception for a younger generation. Jordan is all about protecting his brand |
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Post by RadcapRadsley on May 19, 2020 18:59:48 GMT -5
The only thing Channing Frye is right about is saying that "guys wouldn't want to play with him" in today's era. Guy's didn't want to play with Jordan in Jordan's era. Seriously look at the insane amount of roster turnover btwn the 2 different Bulls 3peat's. If Pippen had left after 93 the perception that Jordan's method is the way to lead would have been shattered. |
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on May 19, 2020 19:04:22 GMT -5
The only thing Channing Frye is right about is saying that "guys wouldn't want to play with him" in today's era. Guy's didn't want to play with Jordan in Jordan's era. Seriously look at the insane amount of roster turnover btwn the 2 different Bulls 3peat's. If Pippen had left after 93 the perception that Jordan's method is the way to lead would have been shattered. There is always roster turnover with championship teams |
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on May 19, 2020 19:07:35 GMT -5
I don't think Windhorst is wrong,MJ isn't just the goat I think he cares more than say Gretzky,Pele,Bonds etc at still being thought of as the goat. While I don't think Lebron was threatening his status,he is/was threatening the perception for a younger generation. Jordan is all about protecting his brand I wouldn't agree there. Jordan cares about winning and has said himself he can't call himsellf the GOAT I believe Michael Wilbon spoke this week how off the record, Jordan called him one day and said the media should lay off LeBron when he was younger in his career because they were too hard on him. He took on a young Kobe because he saw greatness in him and not someone that backed down from him Mike was no doubt an asshole but he's not holding anyone down to surpass his legacy |
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Post by MrElijah on May 21, 2020 10:13:38 GMT -5
One this documentary has done has rekindled a lot of talk of the GOAT in the NBA and has made me personally look at old games, numbers, teams and players. Now MJ is #1, who's number 2? My money's on Kareem.
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BRV
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants him some Taco Flavored Kisses.
Posts: 17,459
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Post by BRV on May 21, 2020 12:56:16 GMT -5
One this documentary has done has rekindled a lot of talk of the GOAT in the NBA and has made me personally look at old games, numbers, teams and players. Now MJ is #1, who's number 2? My money's on Kareem. Here's my personal rankings: 1. Michael Jordan - There's really no questioning his resume. Six-time champion, six-time Finals MVP, five-time NBA MVP, 10-time first-team All-NBA, 10-time scoring champion, nine-time first-team All-Defense (lost in all of his amazing offensive accolades is that he was a weapon defensively), finished his career averaging 30-6-5 while averaging 33.4 per game in the playoffs. 2. Magic Johnson - Revolutionized the point guard position, saved the NBA alongside Larry Bird, won three MVPs, five rings, appeared in nine Finals, nine-time first-team All-NBA, could legitimately play all five positions 30 years before "positionless basketball" existed, was arguably the most pure passer of all-time, and he did all this when the NBA was at its absolute competitive apex in the 1980s. 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar - Just a ridiculous resume. Six championships, two Finals MVPs, six NBA MVPs, 10-time first-team All-NBA, 11-time All-Defense (first- or second-team), led the league in blocks four times, averaged a 24-10 in the playoffs to perfectly pair with his 24-11 over a 20-year career. 4. Bill Russell - The consummate winner, no one did it better. More rings (11) than fingers (10). Five-time MVP, 11-time first- or second-team All-NBA, four-time rebounding champion, and he always beat his rival Wilt Chamberlain when it mattered. He also played in 11 win-or-go-home games and was 11-0. Retired with 15 points and 22 rebounds per game in the regular season and 16 points and 25 rebounds in the playoffs. 5. LeBron James - The book isn't closed on him yet, but it's hard to argue with his career, and believe me, I've tried. Three championships, three Finals MVPs, four MVPs, 12-time first-team All-NBA, five-time first-team All-Defense. There are flaws and nits to pick, but I can't not put him in the top five. |
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on May 21, 2020 13:31:32 GMT -5
I’m putting Chris Paul at Zero. As in zero mvps, zero finals, and always getting bitchslapped at the playoffs. He’s CP0.
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Post by MrElijah on May 21, 2020 14:16:51 GMT -5
One this documentary has done has rekindled a lot of talk of the GOAT in the NBA and has made me personally look at old games, numbers, teams and players. Now MJ is #1, who's number 2? My money's on Kareem. Here's my personal rankings: 1. Michael Jordan - There's really no questioning his resume. Six-time champion, six-time Finals MVP, five-time NBA MVP, 10-time first-team All-NBA, 10-time scoring champion, nine-time first-team All-Defense (lost in all of his amazing offensive accolades is that he was a weapon defensively), finished his career averaging 30-6-5 while averaging 33.4 per game in the playoffs. 2. Magic Johnson - Revolutionized the point guard position, saved the NBA alongside Larry Bird, won three MVPs, five rings, appeared in nine Finals, nine-time first-team All-NBA, could legitimately play all five positions 30 years before "positionless basketball" existed, was arguably the most pure passer of all-time, and he did all this when the NBA was at its absolute competitive apex in the 1980s. 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar - Just a ridiculous resume. Six championships, two Finals MVPs, six NBA MVPs, 10-time first-team All-NBA, 11-time All-Defense (first- or second-team), led the league in blocks four times, averaged a 24-10 in the playoffs to perfectly pair with his 24-11 over a 20-year career. 4. Bill Russell - The consummate winner, no one did it better. More rings (11) than fingers (10). Five-time MVP, 11-time first- or second-team All-NBA, four-time rebounding champion, and he always beat his rival Wilt Chamberlain when it mattered. He also played in 11 win-or-go-home games and was 11-0. Retired with 15 points and 22 rebounds per game in the regular season and 16 points and 25 rebounds in the playoffs. 5. LeBron James - The book isn't closed on him yet, but it's hard to argue with his career, and believe me, I've tried. Three championships, three Finals MVPs, four MVPs, 12-time first-team All-NBA, five-time first-team All-Defense. There are flaws and nits to pick, but I can't not put him in the top five. My personal Top 10 is 1)MJ 2)Kareem 3)Magic 4)Russell 5)Bird 6)Lebron(But he'll over take Bird due to Larry's Peak being shorter) 7)Shaq 8)Wilt 9)Duncan 10)Hakeem(Though Moses Malone comes damn close) |
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2020 14:37:42 GMT -5
All this discussion about who is the G.O.A.T always boggles me because isn't it all subjective anyways since no one can agree on a set definitive criteria.
Is it about how they actually performed on the court?
Is about the chips?
MVP?
And also why is it always Lerbon and Jordan being compared yet...the man that is universally agreed upon to be the closest to Jordan in Kobe bean Bryant is never in the discussion?
The real comparison is Lebron and Magic , Kobe and Jordan.
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BRV
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants him some Taco Flavored Kisses.
Posts: 17,459
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Post by BRV on May 21, 2020 15:08:31 GMT -5
My personal Top 10 is 1)MJ 2)Kareem 3)Magic 4)Russell 5)Bird 6)Lebron(But he'll over take Bird due to Larry's Peak being shorter) 7)Shaq 8)Wilt 9)Duncan 10)Hakeem(Though Moses Malone comes damn close) Shaq is such an interesting case for me. I never consider him ahead of Kareem or Russell on a list of all-time greats, yet any time I see one of those "Assemble a team with $15" posts on social media or a fantasy draft on 2K, I'm always taking Shaq ahead of any other center, because I feel like, with maybe the exception of mid-90s Hakeem Olajuwon, there was never a center alive who could stop Shaq. He would have just straight-up bulldozed over Russell, Kareem, Wilt, Walton, Parish, Willis, Unseld, or any other legendary center from another era. But he's always removed from the discussion of being in the top-five because his prime wasn't that long, he didn't work hard enough for it, he was too goofy and focused on rapping and acting rather than perfecting his craft, he got fat and let injuries linger, he bickered too much with fellow stars, whatever the issue was. Bill Simmons made a case in "The Book of Basketball" that Shaq's career was like the life of a college student. If he really hunkered down and dedicated himself, he could've been the greatest, but he had fun and was one of the greatest, like how a college student could've graduated with a 4.0 but decided that college should be spent partying and creating memories and settled for a 3.6. It's not the right or wrong way to go about it, but it's the way he chose to go. |
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on May 21, 2020 15:49:16 GMT -5
I’m putting Lebron ahead of Russell and Wilt because let’s face it, the competition was much more inferior in those days.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on May 21, 2020 15:56:45 GMT -5
I’m putting Lebron ahead of Russell and Wilt because let’s face it, the competition was much more inferior in those days. I don't disagree about LeBrob ahead of them but that's not really a precise argument 1. You can only play who is in front of you 2. Their game translates in basically any era |
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Post by MrElijah on May 21, 2020 16:10:18 GMT -5
My personal Top 10 is 1)MJ 2)Kareem 3)Magic 4)Russell 5)Bird 6)Lebron(But he'll over take Bird due to Larry's Peak being shorter) 7)Shaq 8)Wilt 9)Duncan 10)Hakeem(Though Moses Malone comes damn close) Shaq is such an interesting case for me. I never consider him ahead of Kareem or Russell on a list of all-time greats, yet any time I see one of those "Assemble a team with $15" posts on social media or a fantasy draft on 2K, I'm always taking Shaq ahead of any other center, because I feel like, with maybe the exception of mid-90s Hakeem Olajuwon, there was never a center alive who could stop Shaq. He would have just straight-up bulldozed over Russell, Kareem, Wilt, Walton, Parish, Willis, Unseld, or any other legendary center from another era. But he's always removed from the discussion of being in the top-five because his prime wasn't that long, he didn't work hard enough for it, he was too goofy and focused on rapping and acting rather than perfecting his craft, he got fat and let injuries linger, he bickered too much with fellow stars, whatever the issue was. Bill Simmons made a case in "The Book of Basketball" that Shaq's career was like the life of a college student. If he really hunkered down and dedicated himself, he could've been the greatest, but he had fun and was one of the greatest, like how a college student could've graduated with a 4.0 but decided that college should be spent partying and creating memories and settled for a 3.6. It's not the right or wrong way to go about it, but it's the way he chose to go. It's honestly terrifying how Shaq's peak could have been even better/longer if he was 100% all into the game and a testament to the skills of Hakeem in that The Dream is a hard counter to every Center ever. And for some reason, I would love a matchup between the Splash Brothers Warriors against the Lakers with "Mr. Inside" Elgin Baylor and "Mr. Outside" Jerry West. |
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on May 21, 2020 17:25:40 GMT -5
I’m putting Lebron ahead of Russell and Wilt because let’s face it, the competition was much more inferior in those days. I don't disagree about LeBrob ahead of them but that's not really a precise argument 1. You can only play who is in front of you 2. Their game translates in basically any era There weren’t any good centers at their level other than maybe Bob Pettit during that era. You put them against tougher competition and they don’t average twenty rebounds a night. |
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Post by RI Richmark on May 21, 2020 18:12:20 GMT -5
The final episode of Game of Zones has settled the GOAT debate once and for all:
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