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Post by ogreknee on Dec 25, 2019 21:40:01 GMT -5
Really twitter is no win. Just post pics on ig and let the hate flow
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2019 0:56:51 GMT -5
Because wrestling has fostered a culture for like, a hundred years that they're genius super athletes getting one over on the dumb rubes who will never understand it the way they do.
The roots of wrestling were fooling people to get their money and even now, the people who fostered that attitude are the people everybody else today learns from.
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Honeybear Lyder
ALF
It's called a title match, dammit! I'll fire your ass, dammit! Get me a snowcone, dammit!
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Post by Honeybear Lyder on Dec 26, 2019 6:52:40 GMT -5
I actually ranted about the issue some years ago, 2014 or something like that. We had a show which included a couple of guest stars and there was a first blood match for a main event. The fans crapped all over it mostly because the matches were just good and not 5-Star-Meltzer great, and because "there was not enough blood" in the main event (the finish saw one of the guys getting slammed into tacks, most of them got stuck in his shirt, but some drew blood from the exposed skin in his back). Both of the guys collapsed in pain after they came back to the locker room, but nobody cared. Also, some whined about wrestlers not staying to interact after the show.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2019 7:00:10 GMT -5
Because social media opens wrestlers up to get smashed by fans MUCH more directly than in the past. I get why gaskets get blown in that regard.
I mean, you could - if you were a pathetic monster - @ a wrestler's kid and insult their wrestler parent to them. Or hell, insult them.
What I find very curious and concerning is the wrestling company giving their wrestlers the opportunity to go after internet trolls on official TV programming. Wrestler badmouths fan in arena for being lippy with verbal insults, fine. Smacking a fan who jumps the barricade and tackles someone in the ring, that's what they get. But I saw reference to a bit on Backstage where "Ember Moon goes after Twitter bastard" was an endorsed segment on the show; whether that fan deserved it or not, that's kind of a terrifying concept which could easily be used to stifle dissent amongst the fans. "Don't like this wrestler for some reason and post a public comment about it? WE'LL SHOW YOU AND COMMENT ABOUT HOW YOU'RE A VIRGIN MASTURBATING IN MOMMY'S BASEMENT"
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2019 7:05:02 GMT -5
Because social media opens wrestlers up to get smashed by fans MUCH more directly than in the past. I get why gaskets get blown in that regard. I mean, you could - if you were a pathetic monster - @ a wrestler's kid and insult their wrestler parent to them. Or hell, insult them. What I find very curious and concerning is the wrestling company giving their wrestlers the opportunity to go after internet trolls on official TV programming. Wrestler badmouths fan in arena for being lippy with verbal insults, fine. Smacking a fan who jumps the barricade and tackles someone in the ring, that's what they get. But I saw reference to a bit on Backstage where "Ember Moon goes after Twitter bastard" was an endorsed segment on the show; whether that fan deserved it or not, that's kind of a terrifying concept which could easily be used to stifle dissent amongst the fans. "Don't like this wrestler for some reason and post a public comment about it? WE'LL SHOW YOU AND COMMENT ABOUT HOW YOU'RE A VIRGIN MASTURBATING IN MOMMY'S BASEMENT" I understand what you mean. My own personal concern about that Social Media Smackdown on Backstage is that it's only going to encourage more trolls to @ wrestlers and say stupid shit just so they can get on TV.
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Post by corndog on Dec 26, 2019 13:21:59 GMT -5
...for the same reason restaurant owners respond to bad Yelp reviews. As a professional wrestler you need to dedicate your entire life to it, which means you’re sacrificing your entire life for it. If a movie fails an actor/actress can move on and work on different projects. If fans tag somebody on social media and insults them they shouldn’t be surprised if workers snap back. They eat, sleep, and breathe the wrestling business. In a dog eat dog profession it shouldn’t come as a surprised that some of the dogs will bark back. If you don’t have any fight in you you’re probably not destined for success in such a difficult business. I cringe when restaurant owners reply in a poor manner to bad Yelp reviews, as I have worked in the restaurant industry for almost 20 years. Yeah it's frustrating to deal with angry customers sometimes(especially when they are just being unreasonable), but just complain about in private if it bothers you that much. I tend to go more by star ratings for restaurants on online, as it gives a good barometer as even the very best restaurants get complains for one reason or another, especially if they are busy. But much like wrestling, if the complainers are a majority, they most likely aren't the problem. You don't see this as much in Japan, Europe or the independents, it's mostly WWE wrestlers and it seems that mentality comes from the top. They view the fans as wrong and won't accept that maybe they aren't giving them the product they want. But, I do agree when wrestler's say, "if you don't like it, don't watch", why watch something that you don't enjoy? However, it's a very bad business model and it seems that fans are starting to do that in record numbers with a certain company.
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
Posts: 5,724
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Post by nisidhe on Dec 27, 2019 1:04:34 GMT -5
Pro wrestling is, at its foundation, problematic in that it has historically created an adversarial relationship with its audience from the need to maintain kayfabe. It relies on emotional manipulation - either in how the match is booked or in how characters are presented - in order to get a desired reaction from fans. If the fans know that a match's outcome is already predetermined, that ability to manipulate the fans during the match is gone, leaving that power solely in the hands of the characters.
The problem that has arisen now is that most wrestlers, having started out as fans themselves, have little to no desire to antagonize the people they see as most responsible for their income and success - other fans. So, such wrestlers either keep relatively silent on social media when they turn heel, or otherwise will engage fans in a kind of over-the-top way that can be comedic but lacks the cringier aspects or the more specific and directed attacks on individuals. Assholes in real life tend to act like assholes on social media, regardless of their on-screen alignment.
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Post by johnnyk9 on Dec 27, 2019 10:51:18 GMT -5
Because they feel it’s their chance of being heard and that people will listen
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Dec 27, 2019 11:26:16 GMT -5
I think context is everything. like, CM Punk was really vocal about not liking fans harassing him at air ports or at the gym when he's just trying to live his life. some people decided they needed to crucify him for it and act like he was an asshole for it. in that context, Punk was in the right.
OTOH though you have Seth Rollins, who basically killed his own face turn by continually picking childish fights with people on twitter over the stupidest of things. he often made sweeping generalizations about the entire fanbase because he was mad abut one person (dear wrestlers, PLEASE stop insulting your entire fanbase by acting like they're loser nerd virgins. who are you, Richard Le Ruina?), it was absolutely something someone should have pulled him aside about long before they actually did.
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Post by Heinz Doofenschmirtz on Dec 27, 2019 11:55:53 GMT -5
I completely get it. There’s a lot of elements in wrestling that no matter how smartened up we are, we’ll never understand fully unless we do it. I get frustrated all the time by people thinking that it’s easy to make a movie knowing full well that most of these people couldn’t make a comedy sketch let alone a feature or even a TV pilot. And yet the moment I say I work in movies, I get people telling me what’s wrong with some movie or that they have this idea that will be bigger than Harry Potter or that in high school they made a movie and think they’d make a really great director. And I’m not famous so they don’t seek me out to tell me those things. I can’t imagine having people chase me down on social media to bitch at me.
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anglarite
Don Corleone
...enchantment!
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Post by anglarite on Dec 27, 2019 13:02:21 GMT -5
Because Hollywood made blaming fans for everything mainstream.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Dec 28, 2019 9:36:23 GMT -5
Pro wrestling is, at its foundation, problematic in that it has historically created an adversarial relationship with its audience from the need to maintain kayfabe. It relies on emotional manipulation - either in how the match is booked or in how characters are presented - in order to get a desired reaction from fans. If the fans know that a match's outcome is already predetermined, that ability to manipulate the fans during the match is gone, leaving that power solely in the hands of the characters. The problem that has arisen now is that most wrestlers, having started out as fans themselves, have little to no desire to antagonize the people they see as most responsible for their income and success - other fans. So, such wrestlers either keep relatively silent on social media when they turn heel, or otherwise will engage fans in a kind of over-the-top way that can be comedic but lacks the cringier aspects or the more specific and directed attacks on individuals. Assholes in real life tend to act like assholes on social media, regardless of their on-screen alignment. This is what I came in to post. The foundation of wrestling is treating the audience with contempt. It's something that reduces as more of the current crop of wrestlers are people who grew up as fans rather than retired footballers and tough guys.
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Post by autisticgeordie on Dec 28, 2019 10:02:41 GMT -5
Pro wrestling is, at its foundation, problematic in that it has historically created an adversarial relationship with its audience from the need to maintain kayfabe. It relies on emotional manipulation - either in how the match is booked or in how characters are presented - in order to get a desired reaction from fans. If the fans know that a match's outcome is already predetermined, that ability to manipulate the fans during the match is gone, leaving that power solely in the hands of the characters. The problem that has arisen now is that most wrestlers, having started out as fans themselves, have little to no desire to antagonize the people they see as most responsible for their income and success - other fans. So, such wrestlers either keep relatively silent on social media when they turn heel, or otherwise will engage fans in a kind of over-the-top way that can be comedic but lacks the cringier aspects or the more specific and directed attacks on individuals. Assholes in real life tend to act like assholes on social media, regardless of their on-screen alignment. That doesn't seem like a problem, I have to be honest.
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
Posts: 5,724
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Post by nisidhe on Dec 28, 2019 11:09:58 GMT -5
Pro wrestling is, at its foundation, problematic in that it has historically created an adversarial relationship with its audience from the need to maintain kayfabe. It relies on emotional manipulation - either in how the match is booked or in how characters are presented - in order to get a desired reaction from fans. If the fans know that a match's outcome is already predetermined, that ability to manipulate the fans during the match is gone, leaving that power solely in the hands of the characters. The problem that has arisen now is that most wrestlers, having started out as fans themselves, have little to no desire to antagonize the people they see as most responsible for their income and success - other fans. So, such wrestlers either keep relatively silent on social media when they turn heel, or otherwise will engage fans in a kind of over-the-top way that can be comedic but lacks the cringier aspects or the more specific and directed attacks on individuals. Assholes in real life tend to act like assholes on social media, regardless of their on-screen alignment. That doesn't seem like a problem, I have to be honest. From a PR perspective, it's absolutely a feature as opposed to a bug and it can aid in the expansion of the business. However, it can have the effect of setting an expectation that _everyone_ is going to be a decent human being on social media when this is clearly not the case. So, when someone gets stupid on Twitter, we're more shocked than perhaps we should be.
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Post by autisticgeordie on Dec 28, 2019 11:12:58 GMT -5
That doesn't seem like a problem, I have to be honest. From a PR perspective, it's absolutely a feature as opposed to a bug and it can aid in the expansion of the business. However, it can have the effect of setting an expectation that _everyone_ is going to be a decent human being on social media when this is clearly not the case. So, when someone gets stupid on Twitter, we're more shocked than perhaps we should be. Ah, now I got you, I wasn't sure what you meant at first, but now I can see how it can be an issue, like with Seth Rollins' Twitter ramblings, I always thought that Seth had come off as a cool guy in shoot settings and I heard that he was very cool with fans who had met him, so that's why I was both caught off guard and disappointed in Seth to see him lose it online like he did. Is that what you were getting at?
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
Posts: 5,724
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Post by nisidhe on Dec 28, 2019 17:16:59 GMT -5
From a PR perspective, it's absolutely a feature as opposed to a bug and it can aid in the expansion of the business. However, it can have the effect of setting an expectation that _everyone_ is going to be a decent human being on social media when this is clearly not the case. So, when someone gets stupid on Twitter, we're more shocked than perhaps we should be. Ah, now I got you, I wasn't sure what you meant at first, but now I can see how it can be an issue, like with Seth Rollins' Twitter ramblings, I always thought that Seth had come off as a cool guy in shoot settings and I heard that he was very cool with fans who had met him, so that's why I was both caught off guard and disappointed in Seth to see him lose it online like he did. Is that what you were getting at? Precisely. For contrast, Finn's usage of Twitter and Instagram is far more fan-positive. While he does not directly respond to comments, he will like and retweet or share other posts, particularly of fan artwork, causes he supports or those of friends, etc. I have never known him even to toe into an Internet fray - he may post something trollish, but it's never mean - even as a heel. _That_ is how a public figure _should_ be using social media. I can understand that he may have other accounts that he will use for family and close friends only, as well as the PE&K account; but he is very much the Gallant to Bray's or Seth's Goofus (I'm old; I'm hoping _someone_ gets the reference.) Seth, to be fair, can be endearing as the hotheaded type with the heart of gold; certainly, Becky sees something in him that occasionally escapes our notice. With Bray, though, it's a different story: his social media conduct is not out of line with what we've seen him do in real life. It raises some questions about his value on the PR side with the company.
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Post by ogreknee on Dec 28, 2019 18:12:25 GMT -5
Also it feels good to takedown pricks online.
I mean be shitty to aj lee on twitter and see her army of perverts cancel you
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Post by johnnyk9 on Dec 29, 2019 17:00:30 GMT -5
It’s called embracing heat
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Post by arrogantmodel on Dec 29, 2019 21:06:49 GMT -5
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm sure that it's frustrating to be a wrestler and you see everyone giving you shit, but that is not an excuse for pro wrestlers, at any level, indy or mainstream, to take shots at fans on social media and it just makes them come off as super insecure. I know, it's rich of a guy like me to criticise a wrestler for being insecure on social media, but they're meant to be better than that, look at Seth Rollins who has been absolutely battered over social media for his tirades. Yet, whenever a movie bombs, you rarely see an actor going on Twitter to shit-talk the fans, so why do wrestlers do it an insane amount? What makes them different to any other practictioner of any other form of entertainment? Like, if someone said that the new Cats movie sucked, I doubt you'd get Idris Elba taking to Twitter to tell the people who didn't like it that they should "Shut up and enjoy it." (also, I've never seen the new Cats movie, but I'm a big fan of Idris, so I'm sure he was one of the best things about it.) So why are wrestlers different in how they respond to criticism in this social media age? That said, if I was a wrestler, I'd probably lash out an arm-chair critic who's never stepped into a ring in their life trying to tell me how to do my job. Well, tons of people have said that CATS sucks. Jason DeRulo pulled the, "What the hell do critics know?" bullshit. While James Corden said he hasn't seen it yet, but he heard it's terrible. One comes off like a whiny bitch, where the other comes off as calm and even self-deprecating and funny.
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Post by autisticgeordie on Dec 30, 2019 4:33:02 GMT -5
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm sure that it's frustrating to be a wrestler and you see everyone giving you shit, but that is not an excuse for pro wrestlers, at any level, indy or mainstream, to take shots at fans on social media and it just makes them come off as super insecure. I know, it's rich of a guy like me to criticise a wrestler for being insecure on social media, but they're meant to be better than that, look at Seth Rollins who has been absolutely battered over social media for his tirades. Yet, whenever a movie bombs, you rarely see an actor going on Twitter to shit-talk the fans, so why do wrestlers do it an insane amount? What makes them different to any other practictioner of any other form of entertainment? Like, if someone said that the new Cats movie sucked, I doubt you'd get Idris Elba taking to Twitter to tell the people who didn't like it that they should "Shut up and enjoy it." (also, I've never seen the new Cats movie, but I'm a big fan of Idris, so I'm sure he was one of the best things about it.) So why are wrestlers different in how they respond to criticism in this social media age? That said, if I was a wrestler, I'd probably lash out an arm-chair critic who's never stepped into a ring in their life trying to tell me how to do my job. Well, tons of people have said that CATS sucks. Jason DeRulo pulled the, "What the hell do critics know?" bullshit. While James Corden said he hasn't seen it yet, but he heard it's terrible. One comes off like a whiny bitch, where the other comes off as calm and even self-deprecating and funny. Corden does seem like a master of not letting things bother him.
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