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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2020 14:05:19 GMT -5
Miz can be a good face but there's only 2 types of faces he can be.
- The goofy face. He was sorta this when he was interacting with New Day around November 2018 and around the time where he tried to be Shane's tag team partner.
- The "dad who's always serious and is semi-angry" guy who we saw in pieces of this Bryan thing.
Basically, the guy has to be goofy or he has to be semi-angry. What he's not good at is being the "badass face" like they tried to make him against Wyatt nor is he good at being in that "Dean Ambrose spot" that they had him in for a lot of last year. You know what I mean, the upper midcard guy who was getting wins but losing to main eventers.
As a heel though...Miz can be any and everything you need him to be. Heel Miz is what Corbin and McIntyre still aspire to be to this day.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2020 15:31:52 GMT -5
I just watched the Morrison coming out of the locker segment as I missed it when watching live. That's incredible. That guy's gonna lead this guy into the Palace of Might Actually Care.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2020 16:55:39 GMT -5
Miz can be a good face, but they've poisoned the well hard with what a useless idiot he's been the past year. He won the tag titles a year ago and ever since has done nothing but get his ass kicked and host a talk show. Exactly. Not getting a win over Shane killed him as a face. Hell, it'd have done him a world of good if he'd just interfered in that Taker & Reigns / Shane & McIntyre match to fight off Elias, but noooo, couldn't even give him that level of revenge. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2020 19:32:00 GMT -5
Heel Miz is what Corbin and McIntyre still aspire to be to this day. Well besides being almost seven feet tall. Those guys even at their worse are big ass dudes with decent movesets and their menacing. Can’t teach that. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2020 19:45:23 GMT -5
Heel Miz is what Corbin and McIntyre still aspire to be to this day. Well besides being almost seven feet tall. Those guys even at their worse are big ass dudes with decent movesets and their menacing. Can’t teach that.  |
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Post by Pushed to the Moon on Jan 4, 2020 20:03:13 GMT -5
Miz simply cannot be a face. I don’t know what more proof people need. He is not likeable in the least . He is a fantastic heel because he looks smug and punchable and that is a unique trait to have because you have to be born with it. It cannot be taught. Miz has a natural “heel” charisma about him and the only way he can possibly be cheered is if people applaud how good he is at that specific role. When they turn him face, his role changes. He becomes a cringey “family man” with daddy issues and it’s not him at all. Miz has to see this, Creative has to see this. Surely I’m not the only one that can see this? You aren't the only one with that opinion, but I don't think you are correct. With the right booking, you can make virtually anyone a hot face, especially in the post modern world of wrestling now. Failing with Miz AGAIN, against Shane as an opponent, and after the promo Miz cut, is entirely on the way he was booked. Listen to the face pops that MJF got in AEW for helping Cody, even when he was a career heel and did not remotely change the way his character behaved and every single person knew the betrayal was coming. Look at the kind of gimmicks that are baby faces these days that could never manage it a while ago. Brock Lesnar was for a while. PCO. Sonny Kiss. The Miz is a douchebag with a mouth and a cocky attitude, and last I checked many of the most over modern babyfaces have been that. Enzo for one. The Young Bucks. Even the f***ing Rock.
Even in WWE, how many of their top babyfaces started out as heels who were just too entertaining and over? Velveteen Dream, Pete Dunne.The fans even still did Miz's catchphrase along with him at his peak heat as a heel. There's still a different between types of cocky prick though. The Rock was a dick but you thought man this guy is cool. He had "it" radiating off him. The Miz is NOT cool in the slightest. I was actually a fan back when he was the WWE champion (maybe just cos I hated Cena) but face Miz is just not likeable. Maybe it's the booking yeah and the played out DON'T MESS WITH MY FAMILY shit but he just doesn't come across well. He walks out in his stupid headband with his stupid jacket and his stupid mannerisms and he just seems like a dork. Dream has that wild kinda "out there" flamboyance and does crazy things and Dunne has the workratez and aggression that wins over an NXT audience. I think Miz is the opposite of too entertaining to hate and he's actually too hateable to like because he just always seems like a smug asshole no matter what. |
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Post by schma on Jan 4, 2020 23:21:06 GMT -5
Miz is great when he shows fire. There's the Daniel Bryan moment on Talking Smack everyone goes back to but there were examples before that. Hell he worked the bit about being kicked out of the locker room into a promo that was quite good. The thing is, he is no longer some douchey reality star d-lister. He's a bonafied vet who has paid his dues and done his time. When he acknowledges that experience I think it helps a lot. Yeah he's great at being a cocky dick but he can also do fiery. A lot of this falls on booking but it says something about the Miz that I had actually forgotten that they had Shane bury him so hard earlier in the year.
The bit about him being third wheel in his 'mania match? It didn't matter who the belt was on, that was always going to be about Cena and the Rock. Miz had some absolutely phenomenal moments in that build that reminded people he was there and not to be taken lightly. Unfortunately, the WWE machine was fully focused on Rock/Cena so they got lost in the shuffle. Any champ in that situation would have floundered. It was similar to CM Punk when for part of his year long run he was still second banana.
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Post by The Legendary Ring Troll {BLM} on Jan 5, 2020 15:37:56 GMT -5
The problem with Miz is people start liking him because he’s a REALLY good heel (to the point where many people thought he should have had a World title reign in the last couple years). People appreciate how good he is and enjoy his heel work. Then he turns face and he is just NOT like able, and doesn’t work as a face. So he cools off. Then you gotta turn him heel to bring up his stock again. Rinse and repeat.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2020 16:08:15 GMT -5
Miz is great when he shows fire. There's the Daniel Bryan moment on Talking Smack everyone goes back to but there were examples before that. Hell he worked the bit about being kicked out of the locker room into a promo that was quite good. Am I the only one that hated it? It came more across as a man going through a bad marriage or a bad perforce review and finally losing it. It was cringe worthy and uncomfortable to watch. |
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Post by nisidhe on Jan 5, 2020 16:09:21 GMT -5
The problem with Miz is people start liking him because he’s a REALLY good heel (to the point where many people thought he should have had a World title reign in the last couple years). People appreciate how good he is and enjoy his heel work. Then he turns face and he is just NOT like able, and doesn’t work as a face. So he cools off. Then you gotta turn him heel to bring up his stock again. Rinse and repeat. This is a pattern with WWE. Not only can Vince not create and maintain entertaining and effective babyface characters, but also he will go out of his way to equate virtue with weakness, so that the only traits that matter in babyfaces is this alpha persona he sees in himself and wants to project onto the action figures he collects. |
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Post by romanstylesiii on Jan 5, 2020 16:35:35 GMT -5
Smart wrestling fans appreciate how good the Miz is at what he does. Marks just think he's bad.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2020 16:46:28 GMT -5
I don't think Miz should change his very workable way of wrestling, just put a good agent there to come up with creative spots for his matches, so 90% of 'em aren't so dull. (10% is Daniel Bryan) ... |
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Post by ogreknee on Jan 5, 2020 17:17:41 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2020 17:33:27 GMT -5
It's Johnny Mizanin! And he's about to eat your lunch! e: I love that catchphrase, I wish it would have sticked. Just thinking about a hot crowd chanting "EAT HIS/HER LUNCH! EAT HIS/HER LUNCH!" during some love saga. Maybe there's still hope for that happening. |
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jan 5, 2020 17:54:47 GMT -5
Miz can be a good face but there's only 2 types of faces he can be. - The goofy face. He was sorta this when he was interacting with New Day around November 2018 and around the time where he tried to be Shane's tag team partner. - The "dad who's always serious and is semi-angry" guy who we saw in pieces of this Bryan thing. Basically, the guy has to be goofy or he has to be semi-angry. What he's not good at is being the "badass face" like they tried to make him against Wyatt nor is he good at being in that "Dean Ambrose spot" that they had him in for a lot of last year. You know what I mean, the upper midcard guy who was getting wins but losing to main eventers. As a heel though...Miz can be any and everything you need him to be. Heel Miz is what Corbin and McIntyre still aspire to be to this day. I dunno who keeps trying to make Miz a badass... but they need to be slapped... it fails pretty spectacularly every single time. Heel or face. He's good as the cocky heel asshole who thinks he's way better than he is or the comedic goofball face like you said. It's a problem they've had for years thinking anyone could fit in any role perfectly. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2020 18:08:32 GMT -5
Miz can be a good face but there's only 2 types of faces he can be. - The goofy face. He was sorta this when he was interacting with New Day around November 2018 and around the time where he tried to be Shane's tag team partner. - The "dad who's always serious and is semi-angry" guy who we saw in pieces of this Bryan thing. Basically, the guy has to be goofy or he has to be semi-angry. What he's not good at is being the "badass face" like they tried to make him against Wyatt nor is he good at being in that "Dean Ambrose spot" that they had him in for a lot of last year. You know what I mean, the upper midcard guy who was getting wins but losing to main eventers. As a heel though...Miz can be any and everything you need him to be. Heel Miz is what Corbin and McIntyre still aspire to be to this day. I dunno who keeps trying to make Miz a badass... but they need to be slapped... it fails pretty spectacularly every single time. Heel or face. He's good as the cocky heel asshole who thinks he's way better than he is or the comedic goofball face like you said. It's a problem they've had for years thinking anyone could fit in any role perfectly. Vince for some reason thinks that Miz can play that character and I just don't get it. Maybe it's the fact that he took all of that backstage abuse and ended up with Maryse, maybe Vince thinks he's a badass. Either way it just doesn't make any sense. Nobody wants to see that. |
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Post by Dub H on Jan 5, 2020 23:51:21 GMT -5
Heel Miz is what Corbin and McIntyre still aspire to be to this day. Well besides being almost seven feet tall. Those guys even at their worse are big ass dudes with decent movesets and their menacing. Can’t teach that. I know Corbin has the golden glove background but I woild hardly call him menacing. He actually gets less menacing the more he changes his looks |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2020 1:16:23 GMT -5
Well besides being almost seven feet tall. Those guys even at their worse are big ass dudes with decent movesets and their menacing. Can’t teach that. I know Corbin has the golden glove background but I woild hardly call him menacing. He actually gets less menacing the more he changes his looks Yeah, I mean I'm not a huge "look" guy and I KNOW Corbin would kick my ass in real life, but he and Big Cass are two of the least intimidating big guys I've ever seen. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2020 1:40:20 GMT -5
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Post by Defrebel - White Pony on Jan 6, 2020 3:39:31 GMT -5
Honestly, I don't really see the problem. Miz wasn't working out as a face and there wasn't really any reason to keep him as a struggling face when he's one of the best heels of the modern era. Also, if they wanna reestablish Morrison as a heel with people who might not know him, pairing him with Miz immediately is totally the right call.
Also, I think you gotta wonder how many years he even has left as a fulltime guy at this point. He's done everything there is to do.
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