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Post by britishbulldog on Jun 20, 2020 22:03:42 GMT -5
I've got to add, aside from the actual meaning of "innocent until proven guilty", which does not mean any of what it's commonly perceived to mean and is a large part of why the court system renders "not guilty" verdicts instead of explicitly "innocent" verdicts, there's a very real factor to all this of how ineffective and broken the system is. "Sufficient evidence" for a rape case to even get to trial can be massive and a lot of the time, there's little to no actual investigation being done. Plenty of people have stories about rape or other crimes where the police basically said "We can't do anything" and didn't ever bother. In this Riddle situation here, it looks like a really complicated situation with a lot more going on than it seemed at the start, it's reasonable to reserve judgment here and want to see where it goes, if the evidence of lasting issues and testimony from the people there holds true. But to put the onus of belief solely onto the outcome of a trial is really shortsighted and I think being naive about the way the system actually works. True and plenty of men have been accused of rape when none occurred. |
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MolotovMocktail
Grimlock
Home of the 5-time, 5-time, 5-time, 5-time 5-time Super Bowl Champion 49ers-and Wrestlemania 31
Posts: 14,070
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Post by MolotovMocktail on Jun 20, 2020 23:12:46 GMT -5
I've got to add, aside from the actual meaning of "innocent until proven guilty", which does not mean any of what it's commonly perceived to mean and is a large part of why the court system renders "not guilty" verdicts instead of explicitly "innocent" verdicts, there's a very real factor to all this of how ineffective and broken the system is. "Sufficient evidence" for a rape case to even get to trial can be massive and a lot of the time, there's little to no actual investigation being done. Plenty of people have stories about rape or other crimes where the police basically said "We can't do anything" and didn't ever bother. In this Riddle situation here, it looks like a really complicated situation with a lot more going on than it seemed at the start, it's reasonable to reserve judgment here and want to see where it goes, if the evidence of lasting issues and testimony from the people there holds true. But to put the onus of belief solely onto the outcome of a trial is really shortsighted and I think being naive about the way the system actually works. True and plenty of men have been accused of rape when none occurred. I again echo this. It's an extreme case, but the Duke lacrosse case is a perfect example of rushing to judgment before the facts come out. |
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Post by Ryback on a Pole! on Jun 21, 2020 0:15:12 GMT -5
I haven't been on for a few days. What has happened? Why is there a tonne of sexual assault style threads all on the main page? Like, has there been a sudden police investigation or has someone come forward which encouraged other people to do so too?
It's just WWE or other wrestling feds?
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Post by Rolent Tex on Jun 21, 2020 0:27:58 GMT -5
I haven't been on for a few days. What has happened? Why is there a tonne of sexual assault style threads all on the main page? Like, has there been a sudden police investigation or has someone come forward which encouraged other people to do so too? It's just WWE or other wrestling feds? Go check the AEW and Wrest of Wrestling for your answer |
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Jun 21, 2020 0:48:04 GMT -5
I haven't been on for a few days. What has happened? Why is there a tonne of sexual assault style threads all on the main page? Like, has there been a sudden police investigation or has someone come forward which encouraged other people to do so too? It's just WWE or other wrestling feds? Long story short, one of David Starr's exes came out accusing him of abuse, which caused other ex-gfs of Starr to back her and provide her own stories. This causes David Starr to delete his Twitter account and presumably unofficially retire from the business. This opens the floodgates to several other stories, particularly centered around BritWres, in a #MeToo-esque movement which has come to be known as #SpeakingOut. |
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Jun 21, 2020 3:23:46 GMT -5
I haven't been on for a few days. What has happened? Why is there a tonne of sexual assault style threads all on the main page? Like, has there been a sudden police investigation or has someone come forward which encouraged other people to do so too? It's just WWE or other wrestling feds? Long story short, one of David Starr's exes came out accusing him of abuse, which caused other ex-gfs of Starr to back her and provide her own stories. This causes David Starr to delete his Twitter account and presumably unofficially retire from the business. This opens the floodgates to several other stories, particularly centered around BritWres, in a #MeToo-esque movement which has come to be known as #SpeakingOut. Yep, all it takes is one person coming forward, then another comes forward, then another, then more join in, then more come forward. Those victims see that they're not alone, and that they do have support, you'll get some dipshits calling them all kinds of names, but the majority are supporting them. |
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Post by romanstylesiii on Jun 21, 2020 3:48:00 GMT -5
Most of the people in this thread are a microcosm of why the internet is so bad. You should really look at the full scope of everything before you react. Matt has proof she stalked his family for years. She has nothing. Not even one witness from the car ride for which it may have happened. Nearly everyone who spoke up had a text trail, pictures of their bruises or witnesses. In the only incident to happen within 2 feet of 6 people, the woman stocking Matt has nothing. When you have a long history of doing crazy things, like harassing someone's family, you need to show proof. Would stalking him neccesarily mean she wasn't raped? Anyone who thinks they know one way or the other can't be basing it on evidence, because there isn't any. it takes a lot of evidence just for a lawyer to consider starting the process of getting a restraining order. The lawyer confirmed this. The lawyer could lose his ability to practice law if he was caught lying about this. Matt absolutely has evidence and a lawyer confirming this. You want to ignore this because you like taking sides on internet debates. People's lives are on the line here and one side can show historical evidence and one can't. That is a big deal. If she can corroborate her story in ANY way corroborate her story, I will gladly apologize. Matt has a lawyer risking his FREAKING LAW DEGREE saying she was historically harassing his family. Evidence matters, especially if you have a history of harassing the person's family when it freaking pre-dates her story! |
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Post by 3cheers4ramirez on Jun 21, 2020 5:25:30 GMT -5
Is there any real evidence she was stalking him? Would stalking him neccesarily mean she wasn't raped? Anyone who thinks they know one way or the other can't be basing it on evidence, because there isn't any. it takes a lot of evidence just for a lawyer to consider starting the process of getting a restraining order. The lawyer confirmed this. The lawyer could lose his ability to practice law if he was caught lying about this. Matt absolutely has evidence and a lawyer confirming this. You want to ignore this because you like taking sides on internet debates. People's lives are on the line here and one side can show historical evidence and one can't. That is a big deal. If she can corroborate her story in ANY way corroborate her story, I will gladly apologize. Matt has a lawyer risking his FREAKING LAW DEGREE saying she was historically harassing his family. Evidence matters, especially if you have a history of harassing the person's family when it freaking pre-dates her story! You're clearly ignoring the second paragraph of the post you quoted. I couldn't be any clearer in saying I'm not taking any sides - other than against people who think they know enough one way or the other. You don't. Matt's lawyer says they drafted a pleading for an injunction on cyberstalking. Nobody is suggesting he's lying about that, I'm sure they did draft a pleading. But it's clearly not up to a persons personal lawyers to decide the facts as to whether their client actually is being cyberstalked. If it was, and if no such pleadings were ever rejected, they'd have an injunction. She's already posted screenshots of messages to her from last year, which don't suggest she was stalking him at a point he said she was. And again, none of this proves one way or another what happened in the van. |
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Post by jp49er80 on Jun 21, 2020 7:20:33 GMT -5
I can't help but feel those defending Riddle are fans of his.
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
Posts: 5,777 
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Post by nisidhe on Jun 21, 2020 7:32:54 GMT -5
It would be a very simple matter of releasing a scan of the restraining order for Matt to prove his case. Hell, Corny sells copies of the one he was served by Vince Russo (though Corny's in a mess of his own right now.)
That one hasn't come out yet suggests to me that either a) one was never issued or that b) if one was issued, she has timeline evidence that Riddle violated it on his own.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 21, 2020 8:27:37 GMT -5
Dunno if this was talked about, but Meltzer stated that Riddle disclosed the situation to WWE before he signed with them so WWE was at least aware of his side of the story. Does that mean Riddle is innocent? No. But it adds a small bit to it
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Post by realist on Jun 21, 2020 8:50:34 GMT -5
No they don't. Was it just Bulldog, or also Kid, who would drug and sodomise their wives? The 80s guys weren't crazier. They just got away with it, in almost all cases. It's going to get really weird when Matt Riddle calls Bret Hart at 3 AM saying, "Mistah Hitman... I've been smokin' crack in my HOOMTOWN!" "Bro, I'm [screwed]!!" |
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Post by polarbearpete on Jun 21, 2020 8:54:45 GMT -5
It would be a very simple matter of releasing a scan of the restraining order for Matt to prove his case. Hell, Corny sells copies of the one he was served by Vince Russo (though Corny's in a mess of his own right now.) That one hasn't come out yet suggests to me that either a) one was never issued or that b) if one was issued, she has timeline evidence that Riddle violated it on his own. The lawyer said it was drafted, they never actually filed and served it. |
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camphor #BLM
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Post by camphor #BLM on Jun 21, 2020 9:54:01 GMT -5
It would be a very simple matter of releasing a scan of the restraining order for Matt to prove his case. Hell, Corny sells copies of the one he was served by Vince Russo (though Corny's in a mess of his own right now.) That one hasn't come out yet suggests to me that either a) one was never issued or that b) if one was issued, she has timeline evidence that Riddle violated it on his own. The lawyer said it was drafted, they never actually filed and served it. If I understand correctly, we're now supposed to say "well, why didn't he go to the police?" |
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Post by One of the Cooler, Candid TOKs on Jun 21, 2020 10:41:42 GMT -5
Also, Riddle's lawyer is an incompetent idiot who released a press statement on a bunch of sticky notes. Probably shouldn't take anything he says at face value.
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
Posts: 5,777
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Post by nisidhe on Jun 21, 2020 10:59:17 GMT -5
The lawyer said it was drafted, they never actually filed and served it. If I understand correctly, we're now supposed to say "well, why didn't he go to the police?" Well, given that stalking is taken more seriously by the legal system, particularly as it relates to public figures or celebrities, I would have expected Riddle to have nipped this all in the bud and gotten the thing filed. Where was he residing at the time? I don't want to favour one side over the other. However, the Riddle situation is rapidly devolving into a "he said, she said" where the ball is apparently in Riddle's court. A drafted request for a restraining order is not a document his accuser would have seen, much less been served legally. It also would not be in the public record, the way a fully filed-and-served restraining order would be. |
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JoDaNa1281
Crow T. Robot
Jackie Daytona, Regular Human Bartender. #BLM
Posts: 42,475
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Post by JoDaNa1281 on Jun 21, 2020 11:18:55 GMT -5
I haven't been on for a few days. What has happened? Why is there a tonne of sexual assault style threads all on the main page? Like, has there been a sudden police investigation or has someone come forward which encouraged other people to do so too? It's just WWE or other wrestling feds? Same here...it's insane. |
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 21, 2020 11:49:42 GMT -5
I haven't been on for a few days. What has happened? Why is there a tonne of sexual assault style threads all on the main page? Like, has there been a sudden police investigation or has someone come forward which encouraged other people to do so too? It's just WWE or other wrestling feds? Same here...it's insane. Mostly been UK guys getting ousted but stories are coming out about US indy guys too. Most of the women in the US are not releasing names but are at least telling their story |
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Post by One of the Cooler, Candid TOKs on Jun 21, 2020 12:24:47 GMT -5
If I understand correctly, we're now supposed to say "well, why didn't he go to the police?" Well, given that stalking is taken more seriously by the legal system, particularly as it relates to public figures or celebrities, I would have expected Riddle to have nipped this all in the bud and gotten the thing filed. Where was he residing at the time? I don't want to favour one side over the other. However, the Riddle situation is rapidly devolving into a "he said, she said" where the ball is apparently in Riddle's court. A drafted request for a restraining order is not a document his accuser would have seen, much less been served legally. It also would not be in the public record, the way a fully filed-and-served restraining order would be. And unless there's some sort of timestamped proof of when it was first drafted, there's not proof of anything. And with how this lawyer has presented himself so far, I'm half expecting this thing to be written in the margins of an old issue of Maxim |
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the2ndevil
Grimlock
Super Seducer Survivor
Where Is Your Santa, Now?
Posts: 13,637
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Post by the2ndevil on Jun 21, 2020 12:54:42 GMT -5
Also, Riddle's lawyer is an incompetent idiot who released a press statement on a bunch of sticky notes. Probably shouldn't take anything he says at face value. He hired Lionel Hutz? |
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