Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Apr 3, 2023 0:56:42 GMT -5
The main character or "ace" of your promotion shouldn't be the f***ing main villain of it. Ric Flair?
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06vwgti
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,132
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Post by 06vwgti on Apr 3, 2023 0:57:05 GMT -5
I am just over long title reigns and heel has his posse do his bidding to keep title and commentary presents it as Roman is strong in his winnings, nevermind he's more chickenshit for using his family to win and he can't do it alone.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Apr 3, 2023 1:01:11 GMT -5
I'm starting to think the only way this ends is if the crowds turn on Roman again. Well no then they go "wow look at all this heat Roman is getting! He's such an awesome heel! Let's book his title reign to last another three years!".
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Post by Cyno on Apr 3, 2023 1:03:32 GMT -5
The only way for crowds to really turn on Roman is to just be completely apathetic to him. If he's getting cheered, he's popular. If he's getting booed, then that's the desired reaction as a heel.
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Post by LiamMcDuggle on Apr 3, 2023 1:03:55 GMT -5
Yeah this is an issue I've had with Mania for awhile. It's supposed to be the show where shit ends, and new beginnings happen... and for years now? It's not that, it feels like a giant stop gap where they're trying to force people to keep watching because " IT'S NOT OVER YET!"Issue is, all it's resulted in is complete and total apathy to end your biggest show with the most eyes, and stats have shown, a lot of people do not tune in to see what's next, they tune into Mania because they want to see stuff END, and then it doesn't, and you give them a reason not to tune in. People were legitimately watching tonight to see if Roman lost, and when he didn't, many people went "Well maybe see you next year, or maybe never again", you can't keep acting like WrestleMania is f***ing Elimination Chamber with more bells and whistles in terms of how you book the show. Night 1 was really well done, Night 2 felt like nothing got accomplished and more of the same is to be expected, especially in the main event scene One step forward, ten steps back. I have never seen a story in any medium have a perpetual rising action like this. I honestly don't know if Triple H gets linear storytelling. Even if you are telling a larger story, you need climaxes to end individual story arcs. this is why Comic book heros have more than one villain. There is a reason Spider-Man did not continuously fight Doc-Ock in the original Spider-Man trilogy. This is like the first thing you learn in creative writing in university. There is a reason other mediums of storytelling don't do this.
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Post by Red Mage Riot on Apr 3, 2023 1:05:11 GMT -5
At least the Bloodline is cool. The OG HHH reign of terror had a lot of the same match shenanigans AND HHH would start every show with a boring 20 minute monologue about nothing before neverending heat. The thing about the Bloodline, is that Roman is the LEAST interesting part of it. The Usos, Sami, and hell, even Solo were all way more interesting and compelling as characters than Roman has been .
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
Posts: 73,747
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Post by Chiral on Apr 3, 2023 1:06:48 GMT -5
It’s kind of caught up in Roman being the worst case of it but Gunther and Bianca’s reigns continuing were also total bullshit and for the same reason. All the company cares about is how record-breaking everything is. The whole booking model now is just [champion of division] is the champion and that's their deal they're the champion. Every entrance starts with "FOR [record breaking number] OF DAYS..." Their storylines are stakeless; the champions face nothing that remotely gets them upset, they don't develop at all, nothing ever changes. They win at every title match via schmozz, f***ery, or cleanly with pointless ease. Their opponents are always just losers at the end of the day. When will they lose? They haven't planned for it but probably some random occasion if it has to happen (KO and Sami winning at the right narrative point feels like an anomaly compared to the rest), otherwise, a never ending march to the next record number of days. I need storylines that go places in my wrestling and this style of booking up and down the card has made this shit unwatchable to my wrestling taste.
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Post by LiamMcDuggle on Apr 3, 2023 1:07:06 GMT -5
The main character or "ace" of your promotion shouldn't be the f***ing main villain of it. Ric Flair? There is a reason he's a 16 time champ though. He would be the villain to help draw a massive crowd, lose the title, and repeat the process. His individual stories with each competitor had a climax where he would usually lose. No one would remember that 'Hard Times' promo Dusty did if Flair just beat him right away.
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XIII
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,561
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Post by XIII on Apr 3, 2023 1:08:10 GMT -5
At least the Bloodline is cool. The OG HHH reign of terror had a lot of the same match shenanigans AND HHH would start every show with a boring 20 minute monologue about nothing before neverending heat. For me whatever coolness is killed by hitting the same 2.5 story beats for a guy who can barely be assed to show up once every three weeks despite holding both world titles. And OG Reign of Terror was like. 2/3rds the timeframe of this by the time it ended, and . And HHH actually lost matches. and had actual good matches(I cannot believe I'm defending the f***ing Reign of Terror what have I become *judas plays*) It may not have been as chronologically long, but that shit felt like a millennia listening to HHHs boring assed promos kick off every show and then periodically showing up throughout the show. lol
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,949
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Apr 3, 2023 1:10:08 GMT -5
There is a reason he's a 16 time champ though. He would be the villain to help draw a massive crowd, lose the title, and repeat the process. His individual stories with each competitor had a climax where he would usually lose. No one would remember that 'Hard Times' promo Dusty did if Flair just beat him right away. So, if Cody won tonight and lost it 18 days later, like Kerry Von Erich did, you'd be cool with that and would say that's a Flair like reign for Roman?
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,751
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Post by asuka007 on Apr 3, 2023 1:10:45 GMT -5
At least the Bloodline is cool. The OG HHH reign of terror had a lot of the same match shenanigans AND HHH would start every show with a boring 20 minute monologue about nothing before neverending heat. The thing about the Bloodline, is that Roman is the LEAST interesting part of it. The Usos, Sami, and hell, even Solo were all way more interesting and compelling as characters than Roman has been . Also The Bloodline story was getting dull and stale from like Bryan leaving the company, up until the Sami stuff started. It has NOT been a perpetually great story, it’s been extremely up and down. And the best part of it (Sami) has been removed.
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Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]
FANatic
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Post by Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] on Apr 3, 2023 1:14:10 GMT -5
At least the Bloodline is cool. The OG HHH reign of terror had a lot of the same match shenanigans AND HHH would start every show with a boring 20 minute monologue about nothing before neverending heat. The thing about the Bloodline, is that Roman is the LEAST interesting part of it. The Usos, Sami, and hell, even Solo were all way more interesting and compelling as characters than Roman has been . Yeah, don't get it twisted, Sami made The Bloodline entertaining when he was in it, and elevated everyone around it to entertaining degrees like with the "Ucey" stuff, it showed a whole other dynamic we hadn't seen before When he got kicked out, that ended, Bloodline's back to the same bullshit since, the shit that people loathed, that buffers gone, and without the crux of "It's ok, Cody will win" to hold people down? This has officially hit a new low in interest in seeing these dudes do anything tbh, because it's the same shit over and over.
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Post by LiamMcDuggle on Apr 3, 2023 1:19:47 GMT -5
There is a reason he's a 16 time champ though. He would be the villain to help draw a massive crowd, lose the title, and repeat the process. His individual stories with each competitor had a climax where he would usually lose. No one would remember that 'Hard Times' promo Dusty did if Flair just beat him right away. So, if Cody won tonight and lost it 18 days later, like Kerry Von Erich did, you'd be cool with that and would say that's a Flair like reign for Roman? My primary point is, every medium of storytelling ever does not have this infinite 'rising action' that WWE is doing right now. You need to climax the story when the rising action hits an emotional high. This is the foundation for every creative writing curriculum, that has more or less been followed by every medium of linear storytelling. There is nothing they could possibly book that will hit the high they had for this story over the last three months. It would be like Empire Strike Back adding a full extra two hours of movie after Han was frozen. Or like adding the full Hobbit Trilogy after the fight scene in the Twin Towers.
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Post by Red Mage Riot on Apr 3, 2023 1:31:52 GMT -5
I also wanna put a really fine point on this: WWE had not one, but TWO, mega-over babyfaces that could have dethroned Roman at Mania and had people f***ing partying in the streets. TWO. And they chose neither.
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Post by gnr123 on Apr 3, 2023 1:41:22 GMT -5
This was it, this was the night, the match they sacrificed Drew and Sami for, the match that people paid to see the most, and they outright failed. The story is going to go on and on until when, Jey ends it? Yeah, sorry, not having it. What Roman going to do now? What's Cody going to do now? Since he returned last year everybody said Cody was the endgame for the Bloodline storyline, now it's going to keep..going...forever...and ever. Until Dwayne answers their calls, I guess. It's so disappointing, it's going to be hard to capture the moment like that again, where all the star's aligned for the perfect moment...and it didn't happen. For what, a statistic? Even if Cody win's MITB and win's the belts at Summerslam, doesn't matter, it'll never have the special feeling that it would have had tonight. Like these moments in wrestling happen only every so often. It's why WWE calls them "WrestleMania Moments," Austin at WM 14, Rock and Hogan face to face at WM 18, Cena in the crowd at WM 21, Daniel Bryan at WM 30, all FANTASTIC moments. And WWE ruined what could have been a talked about moment for years, just for a bullshit statistic.
Like what they say, you only get one good first impression, and Cody's didn't look so good. And it's a damn shame to, because you pretty much just made a protentional top face into another tally for the heel champion.
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Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]
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Post by Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] on Apr 3, 2023 1:54:08 GMT -5
I also wanna put a really fine point on this: WWE had not one, but TWO, mega-over babyfaces that could have dethroned Roman at Mania and had people f***ing partying in the streets. TWO. And they chose neither. Was like they did a double Daniel Bryan speedrun but chose the bad ending for each attempt. Maybe more crowds need to outright riot for weeks straight like they did with Daniel for them to actually have a babyface win in meaningful fashion anymore... much like it took them to have Daniel Bryan win kicking and screaming till it actually happened. This regime would have kept Bryan in the Wyatt storyline for two years lol
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Apr 3, 2023 2:07:50 GMT -5
People talking about Drew, about Sami, about Cody...
f***ing remember when Big E was the guy who everyone thought was going to beat him? This shit has dragged no so long that the guy who seemed poised to finally get a big star-making moment off of the run is lost to memory. And when you look at how dirty Big E got done with his title, it really stands out.
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
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Post by Chiral on Apr 3, 2023 2:09:19 GMT -5
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by asuka007 on Apr 3, 2023 2:11:55 GMT -5
Heck go all the way back to Edge winning the Rumble and trying to win back a world title that he had never actually lost.
And it was all just to put over Roman in the end.
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
Posts: 73,747
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Post by Chiral on Apr 3, 2023 2:11:56 GMT -5
People talking about Drew, about Sami, about Cody... f***ing remember when Big E was the guy who everyone thought was going to beat him? This shit has dragged no so long that the guy who seemed poised to finally get a big star-making moment off of the run is lost to memory. And when you look at how dirty Big E got done with his title, it really stands out. Big E won the title and they immediately rushed Roman over to Raw to beat him twice in one night a week later, and then again at Survivor Series just in case anyone had any inkling Big E mattered to them. Just like how after Xavier won KOTR, Roman had to immediately squash him, steal his crown, and then destroy it. He's on comically absurd levels of OP Villain Gary Stu BS.
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