Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2021 1:26:49 GMT -5
What if the only genuine narrative setback Roman gets comes from Cena busting out those trash tier fourth wall shattering promos again lmao Will Roman bust his zipper again because Big Dog Head of the Table?
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 28,273
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Post by chazraps on Jun 19, 2021 1:31:50 GMT -5
Given the rumor that this run is somehow supposed to end in Roman being the top face, I'm kind of half expecting that he'll hold it all the way to Money in the Bank of next year, get cashed in on, and we'll be supposed to feel bad about it for some reason. I mean, the widely rumored Wyatt Family run was supposed to ultimately end with them being faces, so given that never happened I don't know how much longterm face/heel alignment shift thought I'd put into a character trajectory prediction.
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
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Post by Chiral on Jun 19, 2021 1:41:07 GMT -5
What if the only genuine narrative setback Roman gets comes from Cena busting out those trash tier fourth wall shattering promos again lmao Will Roman bust his zipper again because Big Dog Head of the Table? Cena: "ROMAN I LEAVE FOR HOLLYWOOD AND YOUR FLY'S STILL DOWN MAN. It's all the same except now the scripts favor you instead of burying you!!!" *the two then do a shoot duel leading to a mediocre match but they at least clear the low bar of their No Mercy 2017 match*
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Perd
Patti Mayonnaise
Leslie needs to butt out for fear of receiving The Bunghole Buster
Posts: 32,425
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Post by Perd on Jun 19, 2021 4:15:19 GMT -5
At this point, the only thing that’s going to derail this type of dominance is if Seth Rollins gets him pregnant.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Jun 19, 2021 4:32:28 GMT -5
Roman’s last 12 months MIGHT be tolerable if it hadn’t been preceded by the 6 years before it. I can see he’s doing good work. I can see him FINALLY losing being a big deal. I think I’m just tired of him forever and I don’t see it changing. Also, their endgame is Roman. I’m not convinced anyone is getting a good rub from this, but we’ll see. At this point I couldn't care if he were even the best wrestler on the planet producing amazing promos and five star matches every week. Roman, much like Charlotte, has reached the saturation point where I just never want to see him on my TV again.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 19, 2021 4:35:05 GMT -5
You push your top guy as THE TOP GUY!!!! When he takes his L it will be earned No one is saying he has to lose every week. We're saying him coming out on top with out any kind of setback for over a year is boring and uninteresting. He's a heel, heels are supposed to show their ass. Like, as a story, one guy beating everyone else, especially a heel, isn’t really narratively compelling. And it’s not like we’re asking for anything massive, just something like Cesaro swinging him or Mysterio pinning him in a tag match, just something that allows him to strategize and replan and everything. He has Heyman as a manager, have him have a use besides saying his name and such. Like, it’d be like if Infinity War was followed up with more Infinity War. And then more Infinity War.
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4real
Wade Wilson
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Post by 4real on Jun 19, 2021 7:02:57 GMT -5
Im still loving it personally. Whatever is going on with Roman is the highlight of WWE weekly for me (WALTER & In Dex are probably next in line there). The pressure is on WWE though to have Roman drop the title to the right guy whenever that is.
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Post by Some Baritone guy IS REDEEMED! on Jun 19, 2021 8:15:15 GMT -5
Apparently their plan is to have John Cena return to face Roman Reigns at Summerslam, in a match that will likely piss a lot of people off no matter how it ends.
I will say that the move here would be to have Cena standing tall on the night of his return, and have it happen multiple times in the lead up to the event.
Then the problem is if he beats Cena, who do they send next? He's already run through literally all the credible main eventers they have right now.
I could see a Lesnar return where Reigns finally gets his clean win, maybe a match with Rollins. But that's all the ready made Main event talents on Smackdown.
There's three guys I can see them building as the guy who could dethrone Roman and as a full on main eventer
Cesaro: He came close last time and you KNOW the crowd would pop huge.
Big E: He's been booked strong since his split from the New Day, and everything about him screams potential main event wrestler.
Shinsuke Nakamura: They teased this one around Rumble/Wrestlemania. He's still over like rover. It makes total sense.
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khali
Dennis Stamp
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Post by khali on Jun 19, 2021 9:25:39 GMT -5
WWE has forgotten two huge things that make this worse. One is that you desperately need to be building up an opponent who is on the rise and peaks with toppling the unbeatable guy. It is not the same misery when you’re excited for the opponent you see coming that can win. They have built no one like that.
The other is that they build up heat so relentlessly with no roadblocks where the heel looks bad. When it goes on forever, the reaction when the heel loses is more like “oh thank god it’s finally over” and less just great excitement.
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Post by polarbearpete on Jun 19, 2021 10:00:33 GMT -5
I enjoy title runs like this where someone is being established as an alpha. This is how you create legendary stars like Hogan, Cena, Lesnar, etc. Has Roman really been booked that strong as some in this thread are saying? He’s needed to cheat to win multiple times. He’s had setbacks on weekly TV from his cousins, from Cesaro, from Owens and from Bryan (maybe Edge stood tall one episode to, I can’t remember).
I wouldn’t mind that short Luger run before they get to the ultimate dethroning, but not sure they’ll go that route unless it’s with a MITB cash in and then Roman regaining the title at the following PPV.
I think there’s still plenty of feuds for Roman as well, with Cena, Rock, Lesnar, Drew if he gets traded over, face Rollins, Jimmy, Bálor when he comes back up, and Big E and Keith Lee when they’re ready to rocket ship them to the top.
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Post by Finish Uncle Muffin’s Story on Jun 19, 2021 10:17:30 GMT -5
I enjoy title runs like this where someone is being established as an alpha. This is how you create legendary stars like Hogan, Cena, Lesnar, etc. Has Roman really been booked that strong as some in this thread are saying? He’s needed to cheat to win multiple times. He’s had setbacks on weekly TV from his cousins, from Cesaro, from Owens and from Bryan (maybe Edge stood tall one episode to, I can’t remember). I wouldn’t mind that short Luger run before they get to the ultimate dethroning, but not sure they’ll go that route unless it’s with a MITB cash in and then Roman regaining the title at the following PPV. I think there’s still plenty of feuds for Roman as well, with Cena, Rock, Lesnar, Drew if he gets traded over, face Rollins, Jimmy, Bálor when he comes back up, and Big E and Keith Lee when they’re ready to rocket ship them to the top. I wasn’t crazy about the Mania finish but overall this is how I feel. They’ve had such weakly booked folks that I don’t mind top guy booking. I think Drew is in the tier below him and they could very easily heat him up to make it believable. I don’t think Roman’s done any damage to anyone overall and if anything, it makes him stronger.
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Post by Loser troll. Please ban me on Jun 19, 2021 10:42:05 GMT -5
I enjoy title runs like this where someone is being established as an alpha. This is how you create legendary stars like Hogan, Cena, Lesnar, etc. Has Roman really been booked that strong as some in this thread are saying? He’s needed to cheat to win multiple times. He’s had setbacks on weekly TV from his cousins, from Cesaro, from Owens and from Bryan (maybe Edge stood tall one episode to, I can’t remember). I wouldn’t mind that short Luger run before they get to the ultimate dethroning, but not sure they’ll go that route unless it’s with a MITB cash in and then Roman regaining the title at the following PPV. I think there’s still plenty of feuds for Roman as well, with Cena, Rock, Lesnar, Drew if he gets traded over, face Rollins, Jimmy, Bálor when he comes back up, and Big E and Keith Lee when they’re ready to rocket ship them to the top. But he already is a star. You can't make a Cena, Hogan, Rock, Austin, et al. It has to happen naturally. Here is my question, why does there have to just be one megastar and a bunch of bit players? It seems like their m.o is to pick one of the lower guys, give them a sudden push to justify a title opportunity, and then they get pummeled and forgotten about again.
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Jun 19, 2021 10:57:33 GMT -5
While I do feel Roman’s been built up pretty well, and there are times the champion has to be able to take people out just to show they’re legit and wear the belt for good reason, they can still stand to let him get embarrassed a little bit. As many bodies Hunter left in his wake, he did have a fair amount of moments as a heel where he looked like a fool, like getting thrown into a cake one week or Scott Steiner stripping his suit a la Ric in the 80s. And I never saw Ric as unlegitamite,even with his flopping and begging off-eye poke, he felt more like a capable but cocky champion who’s underestimated his opponent.
Roman doesn’t need to start begging, but a few more moments where he looks on the edge of losing, desperate to hold onto his title, or having a babyface clown on him somehow and leave him fuming and angry would help him get more heat. He needs a Cena to his Edge, a Rock to his Kurt Angle.
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Post by polarbearpete on Jun 19, 2021 11:01:17 GMT -5
I enjoy title runs like this where someone is being established as an alpha. This is how you create legendary stars like Hogan, Cena, Lesnar, etc. Has Roman really been booked that strong as some in this thread are saying? He’s needed to cheat to win multiple times. He’s had setbacks on weekly TV from his cousins, from Cesaro, from Owens and from Bryan (maybe Edge stood tall one episode to, I can’t remember). I wouldn’t mind that short Luger run before they get to the ultimate dethroning, but not sure they’ll go that route unless it’s with a MITB cash in and then Roman regaining the title at the following PPV. I think there’s still plenty of feuds for Roman as well, with Cena, Rock, Lesnar, Drew if he gets traded over, face Rollins, Jimmy, Bálor when he comes back up, and Big E and Keith Lee when they’re ready to rocket ship them to the top. But he already is a star. You can't make a Cena, Hogan, Rock, Austin, et al. It has to happen naturally. Here is my question, why does there have to just be one megastar and a bunch of bit players? It seems like their m.o is to pick one of the lower guys, give them a sudden push to justify a title opportunity, and then they get pummeled and forgotten about again. If you don’t create a tier where there are megastars that are kayfabe above the others, you get that 50/50 booking where everyone is similar and no one is a huge star, unless they have such magnetic charisma that they are undeniable, like a Rock, Austin, Taker who didn’t necessarily always have the belt (although Austin and Taker very rarely would job clean). Why do you think Roman, Brock, Cena feel more like big stars than say other main eventers that didn’t get as strong of booking like Owens and Rollins? I’d say a large part of that is the booking of them so strongly. Now some may believe in a different mindset in booking where it’s more like we have 8 equal main eventers and they trade wins and the belt back and forth. That can work for a while but then I feel like you miss out on creating that legendary/megastar type figure.
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Jun 19, 2021 11:11:46 GMT -5
Honestly enjoying the discussion in here as I still love Roman but this run really is epitomizing everything I hated about the Reign of Terror.
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Post by Hypnosis on Jun 19, 2021 11:12:04 GMT -5
But he already is a star. You can't make a Cena, Hogan, Rock, Austin, et al. It has to happen naturally. Here is my question, why does there have to just be one megastar and a bunch of bit players? It seems like their m.o is to pick one of the lower guys, give them a sudden push to justify a title opportunity, and then they get pummeled and forgotten about again. If you don’t create a tier where there are megastars that are kayfabe above the others, you get that 50/50 booking where everyone is similar and no one is a huge star, unless they have such magnetic charisma that they are undeniable, like a Rock, Austin, Taker who didn’t necessarily always have the belt (although Austin and Taker very rarely would job clean). Why do you think Roman, Brock, Cena feel more like big stars than say other main eventers that didn’t get as strong of booking like Owens and Rollins? I’d say a large part of that is the booking of them so strongly. Now some may believe in a different mindset in booking where it’s more like we have 8 equal main eventers and they trade wins and the belt back and forth. That can work for a while but then I feel like you miss out on creating that legendary/megastar type figure. Because if a company makes only one guy look more important than all the others and he gets injured, then they have to scramble to suddenly re-build the wrestlers who had already lost to the injured megastar. Booking where a promotion puts its eggs in one basket is not sustainable long-term.
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khali
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,891
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Post by khali on Jun 19, 2021 11:28:45 GMT -5
The other thing that’s weird is that WWE used to know that heels could always get their heat but have forgotten. Steve Austin foiled Vince and his plans so many times, and the crowd ate it up because it was fun. Let the fans have some fun. You’d get somebody a lot more over as face if every couple weeks they got one over on Reigns leading to a match.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 19, 2021 11:33:40 GMT -5
Yeah, this started great because the Jey feud basically showed Roman's entire I'm the head of the family stuff was a lie and his facade was cracking. Since then he's literally did nothing or had anything approaching that level of depth to his character... Him losing at Mania even for like a month, him losing one of the several hundred matches against Owens... hell setup something with Roman mocking Seth for how Cesaro made him look stupid and that he'd never be in that position and then let Cesaro do it to him... But we're kinda getting way beyond that and he needs to lose BIG at this point for this to be satisfying at all and I don't see the WWE doing what needs to be done to salvage this any time soon. It's really to the point where the guy who defeats Reigns has to be someone who just continually gets the better of Roman, to the point where Roman's usual psychological warfare just doesn't work and this wrestler just beats him at every turn. Like when Becky became The Man and immediately gained so much immunity to Charlotte's standard bullshit that she couldn't even jump her on the ramp without getting her ass handed to her?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2021 11:36:35 GMT -5
When I think of a recent heel who had a lengthy Reign but it did not feel like a f***ing chore....ADAM COLE BAY BAY had IMO the perfect title reign.
He held it for a decent ammount of time...but in that time he got laid out multiple times , got humiliated he as someone already said showed his ass multiple times.
And this is where dominant heel Roman fails time and time again and his title reign has quickly become something I and it seems a growing contingent want to end because there are no stakes with him...he just beats everyone and that is that , there is no obstacle for him to overcome there has been no set backs in his run at all.
Hell I am not his biggest fan but Bobby Lashleys reign is IMO better than Romans for the simple fact he gets put down more often than not and the babyface gets to look strong so it atleast feels like Bobby could lose because the babyfaces have gotten one over on him and thus giving them some credibility.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 19, 2021 11:40:00 GMT -5
Honestly I've never understood the viewpoint that ages of weekly shitty repetitive television are worth it if you get one halfway decent show in the end. Same reason I wish they'd just get the Kenny / Hangman shit over with. Well, on the other side they never booked him like a top guy and it didn't make for anything interesting either I do wish more promoters would take the Gedo/Okada approach of this is my guy and i'm riding this momentum until the wheels fall off. I don't want Roman on a 3 year title reign tho and I have stated that I believe he will drop the title at Summerslam If he still holds the title after Summerslam I will be a little salty I was bored of that reign too. Albeit mostly because they killed Naito twice for it, and I swear he had about 5 matches in a row that had the exact same finish
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