salz4life
Grimlock
Prichard is a guy who gets that his job is to service his boss.
Posts: 14,352
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Post by salz4life on Apr 7, 2022 16:06:36 GMT -5
So Alvarez just mentioned on WOL he was told that the reason WWE put the belts on MSK despite the deleted tweets was that the powers that be did not believe Kimber Lee was a credible narrator. I'd have held off for the exact reason we are seeing right now.... but that's just me. |
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Post by Starshine on Apr 7, 2022 16:08:55 GMT -5
Please no one tell WWE that I once played Secret Hitler, and was Hitler.
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salz4life
Grimlock
Prichard is a guy who gets that his job is to service his boss.
Posts: 14,352
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Post by salz4life on Apr 7, 2022 16:08:58 GMT -5
It can all be true that WWE is wildly inconsistent with how they handle these situations, Kim's not a credible narrator and Nash is kind of a shmuck. At the least, a shmuck. I've got mixed feelings in general about this situation and it's hard to take a definitive stance. That said, what I do know is that it doesn't sit right with me that they fired him for what looks to be a 5-year-old photograph. I don't think he's a nazi, I think he was stupid and took a dumb photo that was sent to somebody on Snapchat. I don't know that it should cost someone their livelihood. If it came out that he was in fact committing domestic abuse, that's another story. My issue with firing him over the photo isn’t the photo, the photo was dumb and theoretically a fireable offense. My issue is that’s a screen shotted Snapchat, meaning this was a private joke made between friends. As far as I’ve seen, he never posted that picture publicly himself, he never went out to the mall like that, it was a poor taste joke made in private and I’m not super comfortable with firing someone over that. That is the problem with doing something like that on Social Media. Once something like that is digital.... you might as well expect EVERYONE will see it at some point. |
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Post by oxbaker on Apr 7, 2022 16:13:21 GMT -5
It can all be true that WWE is wildly inconsistent with how they handle these situations, Kim's not a credible narrator and Nash is kind of a shmuck. At the least, a shmuck. I've got mixed feelings in general about this situation and it's hard to take a definitive stance. That said, what I do know is that it doesn't sit right with me that they fired him for what looks to be a 5-year-old photograph. I don't think he's a nazi, I think he was stupid and took a dumb photo that was sent to somebody on Snapchat. I don't know that it should cost someone their livelihood. If it came out that he was in fact committing domestic abuse, that's another story. My issue with firing him over the photo isn’t the photo, the photo was dumb and theoretically a fireable offense. My issue is that’s a screen shotted Snapchat, meaning this was a private joke made between friends. As far as I’ve seen, he never posted that picture publicly himself, he never went out to the mall like that, it was a poor taste joke made in private and I’m not super comfortable with firing someone over that. I understand your point but it’s a business that he’s associated with. If you own a hamburger stand and photos get out of your wait staff doing Nazi stuff, do you say ‘well their racism was meant to be a stupid joke that was kept private, I don’t think they’re all that bad, I’m going to stand behind them even if I lose customers and people figure I’m condoning this’? How it got out isn’t the issue. It’s a fact that it is out there and it’s reasonable that there’s going to be backlash, outrage and it could cost them money. I suspect, but do not know (nor do any of us), that they have a process in place to investigate allegations like domestic violence, they were probably initiating that but weren’t going to fire until they had more facts (and had issues with the accuser’s credibility) … and then this came out and they said ‘well might as well cut our losses.’ And I have an issue with the thought process that ‘well as long as you meant to keep your racist/fascist stuff private, it shouldn’t count against you if it comes out.’ How about don’t do racist and fascist stuff to begin with? |
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Post by oxbaker on Apr 7, 2022 16:17:31 GMT -5
My issue with firing him over the photo isn’t the photo, the photo was dumb and theoretically a fireable offense. My issue is that’s a screen shotted Snapchat, meaning this was a private joke made between friends. As far as I’ve seen, he never posted that picture publicly himself, he never went out to the mall like that, it was a poor taste joke made in private and I’m not super comfortable with firing someone over that. That is the problem with doing something like that on Social Media. Once something like that is digital.... you might as well expect EVERYONE will see it at some point. Seriously, anyone over like 14 years old knows this. They see it happen all the time. So there’s also a stupidity factor to this — obviously even his ‘friends’ knew when they saw it that they thought ‘boy that was seriously messed up, this guy is a tool, I think I’ll hang onto this … might come in handy later.’ (Which says a lot about who he chooses as friends too, given that the person who allegedly leaked this has issues as a sex pest/abuser.) |
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Post by darbus alan on Apr 7, 2022 16:24:26 GMT -5
It can all be true that WWE is wildly inconsistent with how they handle these situations, Kim's not a credible narrator and Nash is kind of a shmuck. At the least, a shmuck. I've got mixed feelings in general about this situation and it's hard to take a definitive stance. That said, what I do know is that it doesn't sit right with me that they fired him for what looks to be a 5-year-old photograph. I don't think he's a nazi, I think he was stupid and took a dumb photo that was sent to somebody on Snapchat. I don't know that it should cost someone their livelihood. If it came out that he was in fact committing domestic abuse, that's another story. My issue with firing him over the photo isn’t the photo, the photo was dumb and theoretically a fireable offense. My issue is that’s a screen shotted Snapchat, meaning this was a private joke made between friends. As far as I’ve seen, he never posted that picture publicly himself, he never went out to the mall like that, it was a poor taste joke made in private and I’m not super comfortable with firing someone over that. Donald Sterling's and Hulk Hogan's racist tirades were also done in private, too. Doesn't make what they did any less wrong, though.
As a Jewish person, I'm starting to get uncomfortable with the amount of people making excuses for the Heil Hitler in the "boys will be boys" vein.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Apr 7, 2022 16:25:41 GMT -5
My issue with firing him over the photo isn’t the photo, the photo was dumb and theoretically a fireable offense. My issue is that’s a screen shotted Snapchat, meaning this was a private joke made between friends. As far as I’ve seen, he never posted that picture publicly himself, he never went out to the mall like that, it was a poor taste joke made in private and I’m not super comfortable with firing someone over that. I understand your point but it’s a business that he’s associated with. If you own a hamburger stand and photos get out of your wait staff doing Nazi stuff, do you say ‘well their racism was meant to be a stupid joke that was kept private, I don’t think they’re all that bad, I’m going to stand behind them even if I lose customers and people figure I’m condoning this’? How it got out isn’t the issue. It’s a fact that it is out there and it’s reasonable that there’s going to be backlash, outrage and it could cost them money. I suspect, but do not know (nor do any of us), that they have a process in place to investigate allegations like domestic violence, they were probably initiating that but weren’t going to fire until they had more facts (and had issues with the accuser’s credibility) … and then this came out and they said ‘well might as well cut our losses.’ And I have an issue with the thought process that ‘well as long as you meant to keep your racist/fascist stuff private, it shouldn’t count against you if it comes out.’ How about don’t do racist and fascist stuff to begin with? I’d like to establish there is a MASSIVE difference between the picture at hand and hosting Klan parties in your dining room. This isn’t at all like the Hogan leak, which is indefensible regardless of how it was obtained. |
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Post by oxbaker on Apr 7, 2022 16:43:30 GMT -5
I understand your point but it’s a business that he’s associated with. If you own a hamburger stand and photos get out of your wait staff doing Nazi stuff, do you say ‘well their racism was meant to be a stupid joke that was kept private, I don’t think they’re all that bad, I’m going to stand behind them even if I lose customers and people figure I’m condoning this’? How it got out isn’t the issue. It’s a fact that it is out there and it’s reasonable that there’s going to be backlash, outrage and it could cost them money. I suspect, but do not know (nor do any of us), that they have a process in place to investigate allegations like domestic violence, they were probably initiating that but weren’t going to fire until they had more facts (and had issues with the accuser’s credibility) … and then this came out and they said ‘well might as well cut our losses.’ And I have an issue with the thought process that ‘well as long as you meant to keep your racist/fascist stuff private, it shouldn’t count against you if it comes out.’ How about don’t do racist and fascist stuff to begin with? I’d like to establish there is a MASSIVE difference between the picture at hand and hosting Klan parties in your dining room. This isn’t at all like the Hogan leak, which is indefensible regardless of how it was obtained. So you think this is defensible? OK, defend it. Tell me how it’s OK. |
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Apr 7, 2022 16:56:26 GMT -5
I’d like to establish there is a MASSIVE difference between the picture at hand and hosting Klan parties in your dining room. This isn’t at all like the Hogan leak, which is indefensible regardless of how it was obtained. So you think this is defensible? OK, defend it. Tell me how it’s OK. What? The picture? It’s not. It was in piss poor taste. But it seems like much more of a 30 days off and sensitivity training then burn him to the ground to me. I worded it very poorly, but what I was attempting to say was regardless of how the Hogan tape was obtained there had to be fallout because of how vile he was. This, while completely inappropriate, doesn’t appear to be intended with true malice. I don’t believe he’s actually a Nazi, I don’t believe he’s sitting around hating on the Jewish people. Because of the sketchy means it was obtained, I believe he should’ve been given a second chance whereas I don’t believe Hogan or the old Clippers owner should’ve been regardless of how the tapes were obtained. If you believe he should’ve been fired, that’s fine with me. Given the nature of the picture, I’m not gonna tell anyone they’re wrong for wanting that and I’m certainly not gonna tell anyone they can’t be seriously offended by that picture. I wasn’t trying to tell anyone that, or downplay their personal feelings or opinions. I was just trying to state due to it being a joke made in private, compared to something he intentionally put out into the ethos he should’ve been granted some slack. A short as f*** leash, but cut some slack. |
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Post by oxbaker on Apr 7, 2022 17:06:17 GMT -5
So you think this is defensible? OK, defend it. Tell me how it’s OK. What? The picture? It’s not. It was in piss poor taste. But it seems like much more of a 30 days off and sensitivity training then burn him to the ground to me. I worded it very poorly, but what I was attempting to say was regardless of how the Hogan tape was obtained there had to be fallout because of how vile he was. This, while completely inappropriate, doesn’t appear to be intended with true malice. I don’t believe he’s actually a Nazi, I don’t believe he’s sitting around hating on the Jewish people. Because of the sketchy means it was obtained, I believe he should’ve been given a second chance whereas I don’t believe Hogan or the old Clippers owner should’ve been regardless of how the tapes were obtained. If you believe he should’ve been fired, that’s fine with me. Given the nature of the picture, I’m not gonna tell anyone they’re wrong for wanting that and I’m certainly not gonna tell anyone they can’t be seriously offended by that picture. I wasn’t trying to tell anyone that, or downplay their personal feelings or opinions. I was just trying to state due to it being a joke made in private, compared to something he intentionally put out into the ethos he should’ve been granted some slack. A short as f*** leash, but cut some slack. Thanks for that — I understand your position better now. I thought you were more saying ‘well he didn’t intend for people to see this so it should be like it never happened.’ I obviously misunderstood. I would probably feel more sympathetic if he had come out with something that seems like a sincere apology and made clear how he does feel and why he did it and what he’s learned since — if he has, I haven’t seen it — but I do lean more to the toothpaste being out of the tube (however it got out) and I understand a company not wanting itself associated with that image that’s never going away now. But again, I appreciate you clarifying what you meant. No harm intended on my part and sorry if I snapped a bit. |
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Apr 7, 2022 17:11:22 GMT -5
What? The picture? It’s not. It was in piss poor taste. But it seems like much more of a 30 days off and sensitivity training then burn him to the ground to me. I worded it very poorly, but what I was attempting to say was regardless of how the Hogan tape was obtained there had to be fallout because of how vile he was. This, while completely inappropriate, doesn’t appear to be intended with true malice. I don’t believe he’s actually a Nazi, I don’t believe he’s sitting around hating on the Jewish people. Because of the sketchy means it was obtained, I believe he should’ve been given a second chance whereas I don’t believe Hogan or the old Clippers owner should’ve been regardless of how the tapes were obtained. If you believe he should’ve been fired, that’s fine with me. Given the nature of the picture, I’m not gonna tell anyone they’re wrong for wanting that and I’m certainly not gonna tell anyone they can’t be seriously offended by that picture. I wasn’t trying to tell anyone that, or downplay their personal feelings or opinions. I was just trying to state due to it being a joke made in private, compared to something he intentionally put out into the ethos he should’ve been granted some slack. A short as f*** leash, but cut some slack. Thanks for that — I understand your position better now. I thought you were more saying ‘well he didn’t intend for people to see this so it should be like it never happened.’ I obviously misunderstood. I would probably feel more sympathetic if he had come out with something that seems like a sincere apology and made clear how he does feel and why he did it and what he’s learned since — if he has, I haven’t seen it — but I do lean more to the toothpaste being out of the tube (however it got out) and I understand a company not wanting itself associated with that image that’s never going away now. But again, I appreciate you clarifying what you meant. No harm intended on my part and sorry if I snapped a bit. No worries. Once I re-read through my posts I realized I wasn’t articulating my point very well. And on such a delicate subject, it’s easy for a poorly worded post to go completely sideways. That being said, he probably should’ve put out a statement addressing the picture but I understand his logic. He publicly comments on that and he gets attacked for not addressing the Kimber Lee stuff which his lawyer has probably advised him not to do. |
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Post by kingoftheindies on Apr 7, 2022 17:17:43 GMT -5
So Alvarez just mentioned on WOL he was told that the reason WWE put the belts on MSK despite the deleted tweets was that the powers that be did not believe Kimber Lee was a credible narrator. I mentioned that a few pages ago. Knowing some the stuff Kimber did in the past and some of the rumors (fair or unfair) paint her in a very unfavorable light |
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Post by Display Name on Apr 7, 2022 18:16:18 GMT -5
If I never saw that woman’s fugly face again, I’d be very happy. Praying that she finally gets out of the business after this latest episode.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2022 18:21:54 GMT -5
I just realized that even Nash's chest tattoo makes me kind of cringe now due to everything
"The legacy lives on"
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Tiiulicious
Bubba Ho-Tep
Not much upstairs, but what a staircase! :)
Posts: 591 
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Post by Tiiulicious on Apr 7, 2022 18:49:03 GMT -5
As much of a trainwreck Kimber appears to be, i'm not comfy writing off the allegations just because she 'seems crazy'. i've been in an abusive relationship, there's no blueprint on how to deal with it. you learn to suppress a lot of things to survive, so not knowing the exact dates and not having all the details in perfect order isn't common. there's no such a thing as a perfect victim and we need to leave that narrative in the past. when i was young, my ex knocked me out cold and i lied for years that i hit my head when i fell to protect him. i still don't remember the month or date it happened and a lot of the details are muddled in my head. that doesn't make my account of the abuse any less real.
I would however like WWE to be more consistent with these. You either get rid of all the abusers or you don't get any kind of pat on the head for the one time you reacted quickly.
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Post by Starshine on Apr 7, 2022 18:51:53 GMT -5
I just realized that even Nash's chest tattoo makes me kind of cringe now due to everything "The legacy lives on" I mean Cody has returned, and Orton's still there, so 2 out of 3 isn't too bad. |
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
Posts: 5,767
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Post by nisidhe on Apr 7, 2022 19:01:30 GMT -5
Hoo boy. There's a fair bit to unpack here.
First, Carter's and Lee's marriage is/was absolutely toxic if this stuff is being put out into the public sphere. Stuff like this can be very destructive in any divorce settlement (and someone please tell me they don't have kids.)
Second, while it may seem minor to some, the release boils down to WWE making a call between how much value they see in Carter vs the hassle of dealing with this sort of controversy. Were MSK on the main roster and moving merch, etc., I could see WWE making Carter apologize for the photo and possibly going through sensitivity training (Heyman's mother was a Holocaust survivor so some of that can very easily be done in-house), while doing their best to sweep the abuse allegations under the rug, at least until Kimber went to the police with them.
Some minor indie darling in NXT? Easier to bring him back in a couple years once the mess has blown over. Let him improve on the indies and hopefully get through a quick and quietish divorce out of the WWE spotlight, while being able to claim that Kimber's antics cost him his WWE career and greatly reduced his ability to pay alimony. This isn't necessarily a bad thing for Carter long-term.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Apr 8, 2022 2:48:31 GMT -5
With the JBL thing (besides being whataboutism here.) What he did is Illegal. Literally you are not allowed to do that in Germany. He also suffered some consequences from it I think he was suspended/fined and had to issue a public apology. (I think he might have lost his show too? unrelated to the WWE) it also happened like... almost 20 years ago? That’s the thing, JBL’s offense may as well have happened in an actual different company for how different things operated in 2004. There wasn’t this heavy emphasis on protecting the PR image of the company above all else, nor was there the kind of social media landscape to spread the footage and mobilise the kind of rabid outrage this kind of thing would create if it happened now. JBL probably WOULD be fired if he was goosestepping and saluting in a WWE ring in Germany in 2022. |
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Talent Name
Ozymandius
Got fined anyway.
Possibly a Moose
James Franco is the white Donald Glover
Posts: 63,742 
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Post by Talent Name on Apr 8, 2022 12:38:03 GMT -5
Kimbers Twitter has disappeared
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Post by hashtagdaley/JudasDay on Apr 8, 2022 12:57:37 GMT -5
Kimbers Twitter has disappeared Probably for the best, for everyone involved. |
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