Warrior '96 return botched

[tafkaga]

I've always heard people say that the Warrior had already run his course by the time he returned in '96, and maybe that's true, but the way they used him didn't help at all. 

1. They hyped his return as if he was coming back after a few months off instead of 4 years off with some generic "Warrior is coming back! oooo exciting!" instead of anything that might generate fresh interest in him.

2. They debuted him against a boring midcard act with little heat on him or buildup to the match, when they could have matched him up with Goldust from the beginning and have Goldust cut weeks of promos to get heat on himself, then Warrior's debut could have been far more interesting.  Match Piper with Helmsley instead because who cares since it was just a one off starring vehicle for Piper.  

3. There was no direction for Warrior.  They put him with midcard guys in short feuds that didn't lead anywhere, and matched him with Lawler which gave him more of a special attraction vibe than a contender for a top spot on the roster. 

4. There was no evident spot for Warrior.  The WWF Championship was going to be tied up with babyface HBK for a good while.  Ahmed was being prepped for IC Champion and dominating babyface role.  Warrior seemed to step immediately into the Luger '95 role of being the main eventer with nothing to do.  It seemed like Vince's only interest of him was to say that they had him.

[Tiger Millionaire]

Here is the problem with Warrior: Warrior.

[chazraps]

Yeah, really Warrior got in the way of Warrior. I rewatched the first half of 96 in order this year and the crowd *was* into Warrior and he was featured super prominently and respectfully as a big deal. Even if he wasn't in an outright title hunt, he was featured prominently in a way that accentuated his positives and obscured his limitations.

While I do think it's unfair that people take shots at how he grieved after losing his father (not everyone grieves in the same way, especially with the complexities of losing someone one is estranged from) everything that went wrong in Warrior's 1996 run can wholly be attributed to Warrior being Warrior.

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Believe he was gonna have at least a house show run with Vader for the title. They took the trouble to Photoshop in that it was WWE Title matches he no showed after his father died in the Self Destruction DVD.

[chazraps]

Nov 28, 2021 16:56:45 GMT -5 Cranjis McBasketball said:

Believe he was gonna have at least a house show run with Vader for the title. They took the trouble to Photoshop in that it was WWE Title matches he no showed after his father died in the Self Destruction DVD.

That's not the case. The photoshop was just for dramatic effect in the documentary. The full flyer for that show is findabale and it's Shawn Michaels' face that Warrior's is covering.

[Jumpin' Jesse Walsh]

Yeah, I think the "fans had moved on" thing was a bit of a falsehood spread by the Self-Destruction documentary. He was still over, got the biggest pop at Mania, and it was clear there was some workable plan for him going forward.

It's just that Warrior was, um, too deep into destrucity to put it mildly.

[jason1980s]

Who else could Warrior have wrestled at Wrestlemania that could have helped? Yes, Hunter Heart Helmsley was a "boring midcard act with little heat" but besides Goldust who else was there? Goldust was still over, so you can't have Warrior squash him and you can't have Warrior go 10 minutes and pin him nor can you do a countout or DQ. There was 123 Kid and Isaac Yankem who were even lower in position than HHH at the time.

I do think it was more of a Vince got him and doesn't know what to do with him scenario more than anything. Vince probably tried for years to get him and finally did and when it came time to re-debut him, there was no credible opponents who weren't already being used.

[tafkaga]

Nov 28, 2021 18:58:48 GMT -5 jason1980s said:

Who else could Warrior have wrestled at Wrestlemania that could have helped? Yes, Hunter Heart Helmsley was a "boring midcard act with little heat" but besides Goldust who else was there? Goldust was still over, so you can't have Warrior squash him and you can't have Warrior go 10 minutes and pin him nor can you do a countout or DQ. There was 123 Kid and Isaac Yankem who were even lower in position than HHH at the time.

I do think it was more of a Vince got him and doesn't know what to do with him scenario more than anything. Vince probably tried for years to get him and finally did and when it came time to re-debut him, there was no credible opponents who weren't already being used.

I don't think they needed Warrior to squash Goldust.  Besides, Piper beat his ass and stripped him down to ladies lingerie, and Goldust got over even more from that.  Warrior couldn't wrestle, but the one thing he was great at was the theatrics of wrestling, so I think they COULD have been a great pairing.  I say COULD because I know they were paired up for IYH and guessing Dustin was injured, which is why that weird ass confrontation happened instead of a regular match.  

And I do get that Warrior's biggest problem was Warrior, and it was never going to work no matter how brilliantly they used him, but I'm commenting on his trajectory prior to no-showing a bunch of events.

[Squirrel Master]

They could have had heel Warrior vs. face Roddy Piper, kept them in “street brawls” to a +/- five-minute finish; I think that could have worked for a bit. Piper knew how to make his opponents look strong.

[Aceorton]

Agree with all but No. 2. Warrior needed someone to squash in his return. HHH was credible enough to appear like a legit challenge, talented enough to make Warrior look good in what might be a rusty first match back, and wouldn't suffer too much in the long run from losing to this huge star.

[ThankGodForSidJustice]

Even as someone who was a big Warrior fan I can't really fault them. I think they used him the best they could've. Squashing Helmsley was a good way to reintroduce him and reestablish him as a force. Even the Lawler stuff I can understand as he was an old school heel who worked a basic style where Warrior wouldn't be too overwhelmed and in over his head.

A lot of the problem was Warrior just super dated both character wise and in ring wise. Especially the latter. I mean he was never a great worker but I think even if he was performing to the level of 89-90 Warrior he could've got by. However he was super lazy and just doing a bunch of clotheslines, a flying shoulder tackle, and a splash every match weren't going to cut it in 96. Then you factor him being major head case and pain in the ass IRL it just had disaster written all over it. I thought Sid was a definite upgrade at that point as he was a similar character but was a much better fit for 96-97 WWF in that his character had more of an edge and was more real and in ring while not a technical wizard unlike Warrior at least had some cool high impact moves that looked impressive that made him more apt at adapting to more athleticism based in ring product at the time.

As far as Helmsley goes I Had no problem at all with him being the sacrificial lamb at Mania XII. They were lacking depth at the time as they had a ton of departures on the heel side in late 95-early 96. In a four month span from October to February they lost Sid, Dean Douglas, Jarrett, Mabel, Kama, Jean Pierre Lafitte, and Waylon Mercy. All those guys were involved in upper midcard or in a few cases even main event stuff in 95. If you look at their heel roster really who else could you have gone with? Helmsley was the only heel who had enough steam on him but could also be sacrificed. Everyone else was either guys who they had plans for that needed to be protected like Vader, Bulldog, Owen, Goldust, and Stone Cold or were too far down the ladder at that point like Yankem or Tatanka to be in a spot like that. I guess you maybe could've had him destroy the 1-2-3 Kid but he just go embarrassed at the last PPV with the Crybaby thing where Razor beat him and put him in the diaper. It had to be Helmsely.

[Deleted]

I liked warrior and was happy to see him back, but his two feuds when he came back was goldust, i.c. champion, but he was hurt and couldn't have a match, so the whole match was stalling to kill time, and the heel commentator for the last three years who was not seen as a threat on wwf television. His last appearance (teaming with ahmed and shawn vs cornette) was the only time he approached the main event/a serious match. They brought him back big at wrestlemania, and then put him in two feuds where no one believed he was in trouble or would lose and that cooled him off right away. It was picking back up (vs owen) right when he left. His character had changed too. He became human in 1996 compared to what he was before. Had tattoos, a university and comic book, he wasn't talking about the gods and making a sacrifice, he was more just a mad guy yelling, and went from other-worldly being to a guy that lived in the real world.

[The Ichi]

Even if he was on good enough behaviour to warrant a main event push, HBK would have moaned about him to Vince.

[bob]

as a youngster when Warrior returned in 1996 I was excited.... they did the best they could to mask his weaknesses

but in the end what cut his return short was himself

[The Thread Barbi]

Nov 29, 2021 14:08:17 GMT -5 The Ichi said:

Even if he was on good enough behaviour to warrant a main event push, HBK would have moaned about him to Vince.

One of the few times HBK would have found out Vince siding with his wet dream instead of Shawn and acting all Summerslam 05.

[The Ichi]

Nov 29, 2021 15:09:58 GMT -5 The Thread Barbi said:

Nov 29, 2021 14:08:17 GMT -5 The Ichi said:

Even if he was on good enough behaviour to warrant a main event push, HBK would have moaned about him to Vince.

One of the few times HBK would have found out Vince siding with his wet dream instead of Shawn and acting all Summerslam 05.

I dunno, this was peak HBK being in Vince's ear and Warrior was probably still on thin ice for the Summerslam '91 stunt.

[EvenBaldobombHasAJob]

Nov 29, 2021 18:01:24 GMT -5 The Ichi said:

Nov 29, 2021 15:09:58 GMT -5 The Thread Barbi said:

One of the few times HBK would have found out Vince siding with his wet dream instead of Shawn and acting all Summerslam 05.

I dunno, this was peak HBK being in Vince's ear and Warrior was probably still on thin ice for the Summerslam '91 stunt.

Yeah no matter what Vince says about him now, any working arrangement they had was strictly through clenched teeth. Vince was happy as a pig in shit to fire him after SummerSlam the last time and was probably just wondering when he'd have to fire Jim again.

[BorneAgain]

Part of the issue was the that Ultimate Warrior was something that worked in the era of weekly squash matches and occasional major matches via PPV or SNME. UW as a weekly character doing angles (let alone any frequency in actual matches) was going to be an uphill climb, especially given that unlike an Undertaker (or even a Hogan), he never had the experience of transitioning from one style of wrestling show to another.

He was someone built on mystique to a degree and that simply didn't work for the time period.

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Nov 29, 2021 18:58:27 GMT -5 BorneAgain said:

Part of the issue was the that Ultimate Warrior was something that worked in the era of weekly squash matches and occasional major matches via PPV or SNME. UW as a weekly character doing angles (let alone any frequency in actual matches) was going to be an uphill climb, especially given that unlike an Undertaker (or even a Hogan), he never had the experience of transitioning from one style of wrestling show to another.

He was someone built on mystique to a degree and that simply didn't work for the time period.

And there was no reason to not use him like that. They still had hour Raw then, don’t need Warrior every week. In fact, the less of him, the better.

It’s why I’m still a Lesnar fan. He can stay away. I know his deal. Once he shows up, he does his shit and goes.

Sometimes you just need a reliable thing as a fan.

[evilone]

If Hogan could have worked in 96 so could have Warrior. I just don't think WWE had put any effort to do anything with him nor they cared to do anything with him, it was more of a short term boost instead. They did tried the best they could with Jake in his worst iteration and that alone tells you they didn't' want anything to do with Warrior.