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Post by eJm on Dec 22, 2021 22:44:48 GMT -5
I mean, it’s less that they need 20 something bookers as 20 something writers to get a show together with someone to rubber stamp it which is basically, like, 95% of writing teams on TV shows in Hollywood. Sorry, I figured bookers and writers were largely interchangeable, verbiage-wise. From what I’ve heard it being said, the Booker is the one that comes up with the direction for the show and the writer is the one that makes it make sense for the overall format of the show.
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Post by mistery on Dec 22, 2021 23:22:24 GMT -5
There's almost certainly a ton of pressure by NBCUniversal. I mentioned it a little while back, but Andrew Zarian hinted on his podcast that NBCU was not pleased with the rebrand at the time, and were concerned about the ratings of 2.0. And the fact that this is Vince, Johnny, and Bruce's vision of what is "hip and cool" is kinda...not good. The show is bombing hard. They lost all of their actual credible men because none of them want to be associated with 2.0. And now they have to build up a bunch of new talent, who will likely bomb on the main roster.
And as for the women, it's pretty obvious the mandate backstage is "dress in skimpier outfits" and booking wise, the titles are all on a faction that relies 100% on sex appeal. Problem is that Vince, Bruce, Johnny, Nick, or whoever doesn't seem to realize that if young adults want to look at hot women, the internet exists. And Toxic Attraction as a faction has absolutely nothing going for them outside of sex appeal. Meanwhile women like Io, Sarray, Dakota, etc are all being shoved to the side because they don't fit the mold of what WWE wants in the women now. Which is looks over actual ability.
If ratings continue to fall, it'll be interesting to see who the axe falls on this time. Because the only people it could feasibly fall on are Johnny Ace, Bruce Pritchard, or Nick Khan. And of those three, Johnny Ace and Bruce Pritchard are in the most danger. Especially Bruce considering he oversees all three shows right now creatively, and in terms of ratings, all three are not doing too well.
Say what you will about Black and Gold, but it felt a hell of a lot cooler to watch than NXT 2.0. Which only really appeals to older (and hornier) men for the most part.
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,802
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Post by asuka007 on Dec 23, 2021 0:45:57 GMT -5
I like Bryan Alvarez’s theory that because it’s a bunch of 60+ men writing a show they thing appeals to a younger crowd that it’s actually drawing an older crowd because the show makes them feel young I get the idea of old shouldn’t be writing for young. Thing is, though, where the f*** do you find 20-year-old wrestling bookers? You don’t necessarily need to be that young. What you need is writers and bookers who are more in touch with the current trends and what worlds today. Then you need to get out of their way and let them do their thing. Vince and co creatively are still stuck back in the 80’s and 90’s. And Vince is such a control freak that he still believes that HE is the one who can come in and “fix things.” Hint, he isn’t.
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Post by David-Arquette was in WCW 2000 on Dec 23, 2021 1:26:45 GMT -5
Old people love AJ Styles! "The Elder Community?!" Those living an 'elderly' lifestyle.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Dec 23, 2021 2:50:20 GMT -5
If nothing else something I think NXT has a major problem with right now is that it just feels so inconsequential in the grand scheme of things, like no one should want to be there. A ton of the top guys for years just left in droves, you have a constant parade of new people who weren't very well introduced and many of whom people don't really care about at all, your top champion spent pretty much the entire year before he won the belt mostly as a tag team jobber, the matches are mostly extremely short, no one seems to have a clearly defined alignment, the super heel on top of the women's division was a career loser right up until the moment she won the belt, a lot of feuds in 2.0 have been completely one-sided, there's no expectation that you're seeing the future stars of tomorrow today because we all know how shit the main roster's track record for call-ups is, and the whole set just looks incredibly cheap and low-rent.
Which I guess is fine if it's just developmental, but it isn't. It's on TV trying to get ratings, it has PPVs, they do stunts like bringing in AJ Styles to try to incentivize more people to watch it. You're clearly supposed to care but there is very little reason to.
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Post by mistery on Dec 23, 2021 7:43:10 GMT -5
If nothing else something I think NXT has a major problem with right now is that it just feels so inconsequential in the grand scheme of things, like no one should want to be there. A ton of the top guys for years just left in droves, you have a constant parade of new people who weren't very well introduced and many of whom people don't really care about at all, your top champion spent pretty much the entire year before he won the belt mostly as a tag team jobber, the matches are mostly extremely short, no one seems to have a clearly defined alignment, the super heel on top of the women's division was a career loser right up until the moment she won the belt, a lot of feuds in 2.0 have been completely one-sided, there's no expectation that you're seeing the future stars of tomorrow today because we all know how shit the main roster's track record for call-ups is, and the whole set just looks incredibly cheap and low-rent. Which I guess is fine if it's just developmental, but it isn't. It's on TV trying to get ratings, it has PPVs, they do stunts like bringing in AJ Styles to try to incentivize more people to watch it. You're clearly supposed to care but there is very little reason to. It's funny you mention the career loser thing. Because I was talking to a friend about it who fell off the wrestling wagon long ago. He basically came to the conclusion that Mandy's title reign is basically the women's version of giving Jinder Mahal the WWE title, and we all saw how that panned out. And all the signs are the same here. Except instead of trying to pander to India, they are trying to pander to horny young men.
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gl83
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,990
Member is Online
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Post by gl83 on Dec 24, 2021 11:16:49 GMT -5
Date Viewers P18-49 Rank This Week 591,000 .11 #46 2019 831,000 .22 #29
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Post by kingoftheindies on Dec 24, 2021 13:15:40 GMT -5
If nothing else something I think NXT has a major problem with right now is that it just feels so inconsequential in the grand scheme of things, like no one should want to be there. A ton of the top guys for years just left in droves, you have a constant parade of new people who weren't very well introduced and many of whom people don't really care about at all, your top champion spent pretty much the entire year before he won the belt mostly as a tag team jobber, the matches are mostly extremely short, no one seems to have a clearly defined alignment, the super heel on top of the women's division was a career loser right up until the moment she won the belt, a lot of feuds in 2.0 have been completely one-sided, there's no expectation that you're seeing the future stars of tomorrow today because we all know how shit the main roster's track record for call-ups is, and the whole set just looks incredibly cheap and low-rent. Which I guess is fine if it's just developmental, but it isn't. It's on TV trying to get ratings, it has PPVs, they do stunts like bringing in AJ Styles to try to incentivize more people to watch it. You're clearly supposed to care but there is very little reason to. It's funny you mention the career loser thing. Because I was talking to a friend about it who fell off the wrestling wagon long ago. He basically came to the conclusion that Mandy's title reign is basically the women's version of giving Jinder Mahal the WWE title, and we all saw how that panned out. And all the signs are the same here. Except instead of trying to pander to India, they are trying to pander to horny young men. Mandy and Toxic Attraction as a whole seem to have been booked with the idea that viewers want to watch hot women and its failing... especially since that stereotype has become such a caricature in pop culture that you have to go so over the top with it to work. I do like what Bryan Alvarez said on the Bryan and Vinny show about other things on the show as well. You have Cora Jade whose gimmick is that she's supposed to be a skater but she has shown no ability to skate. Bryan said you cannot try and give someone a skater gimmick when Darby Allin (a legit skateboarder) is on the show you are competing against so who is Cora appealing to? He uses the same argument for Briggs and Jensen where they are nothing like actual country boys/rednecks/blue collar people that they aren't clicking.
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Post by eJm on Dec 24, 2021 13:36:28 GMT -5
I do like what Bryan Alvarez said on the Bryan and Vinny show about other things on the show as well. You have Cora Jade whose gimmick is that she's supposed to be a skater but she has shown no ability to skate. Bryan said you cannot try and give someone a skater gimmick when Darby Allin (a legit skateboarder) is on the show you are competing against so who is Cora appealing to? He uses the same argument for Briggs and Jensen where they are nothing like actual country boys/rednecks/blue collar people that they aren't clicking. This feels like a good thread to say this but for as much as it came off as gatekeeping with the whole Cora/Darby thing and people going “Well, the Undertaker isn’t really dead”…they still went out of their way to have promos or vignettes of ‘Taker and Bearer crafting caskets and coming off like a scary force. Mark Calloway acted and dressed like The Undertaker. If he came out dressed and like WCW’s Mean Mark Callous but called The Undertaker…it wouldn’t have worked. This company has billions, it wouldn’t take much to hire Cora a coach to teach her to skate and have videos of her doing tricks and hanging out with actual skaters. Fly to LA and have her in some of the more famous skate parks. Tony Hawk’s hung out with Darby, he’d probably hang out with Cora too to make her seem cooler. Just go full hog. But no, she just has a skateboard. She can’t really do much with it but she has one. The effort isn’t the same.
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kidkamikaze10
Dennis Stamp
Trying to think of a new avatar
Posts: 4,279
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Dec 24, 2021 13:39:40 GMT -5
I like Bryan Alvarez’s theory that because it’s a bunch of 60+ men writing a show they thing appeals to a younger crowd that it’s actually drawing an older crowd because the show makes them feel young I get the idea of old shouldn’t be writing for young. Thing is, though, where the f*** do you find 20-year-old wrestling bookers? They’ve had them, and then bully them out, making them hate the industry.
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Post by Hypnosis on Dec 24, 2021 13:51:14 GMT -5
I do like what Bryan Alvarez said on the Bryan and Vinny show about other things on the show as well. You have Cora Jade whose gimmick is that she's supposed to be a skater but she has shown no ability to skate. Bryan said you cannot try and give someone a skater gimmick when Darby Allin (a legit skateboarder) is on the show you are competing against so who is Cora appealing to? He uses the same argument for Briggs and Jensen where they are nothing like actual country boys/rednecks/blue collar people that they aren't clicking. This feels like a good thread to say this but for as much as it came off as gatekeeping with the whole Cora/Darby thing and people going “Well, the Undertaker isn’t really dead”…they still went out of their way to have promos or vignettes of ‘Taker and Bearer crafting caskets and coming off like a scary force. Mark Calloway acted and dressed like The Undertaker. If he came out dressed and like WCW’s Mean Mark Callous but called The Undertaker…it wouldn’t have worked. This company has billions, it wouldn’t take much to hire Cora a coach to teach her to skate and have videos of her doing tricks and hanging out with actual skaters. Fly to LA and have her in some of the more famous skate parks. Tony Hawk’s hung out with Darby, he’d probably hang out with Cora too to make her seem cooler. Just go full hog. But no, she just has a skateboard. She can’t really do much with it but she has one. The effort isn’t the same. I still don't know why Cora's not carrying the mini coffin anymore. Going from "Sorceress of Sin" to skateboard girl is quite a drastic change.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Dec 24, 2021 13:57:03 GMT -5
I get the idea of old shouldn’t be writing for young. Thing is, though, where the f*** do you find 20-year-old wrestling bookers? You don’t necessarily need to be that young. What you need is writers and bookers who are more in touch with the current trends and what worlds today. Then you need to get out of their way and let them do their thing. Vince and co creatively are still stuck back in the 80’s and 90’s. And Vince is such a control freak that he still believes that HE is the one who can come in and “fix things.” Hint, he isn’t. Hell, look at who Vince's inner circle was during the Attitude Era. The youngest of the bunch would have been, what, Russo? In his late thirties, with everyone else in their forties and up. Vince was in his forties during the height of Hulkamania. The people making these decisions are stuck in past eras and are just generally cut off from culture in general.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2021 15:03:53 GMT -5
Carmelo Hayes should become The Old Chick Thriller.
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Kalmia
King Koopa
Happy to be here
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Post by Kalmia on Dec 24, 2021 15:38:08 GMT -5
It is amusing that the more NXT chases something young, fresh, and exciting, the further away from it they tend to get. I don't think NXT needs to chase trends or try and appeal to a younger audience because that's always going to come off as false and desperate.
They shouldn't be trying to force square pegs into round holes either. Just do what wrestling has always done when it's been successful. Take a wrestler, find something in their real personality, and turn it up to 11. Why not focus on what the young talent have themselves instead of giving them a gimmick they can't authentically pull off? Instead of making Cora a skater girl when she can't skate, find out what she can do/likes and run with that. She's 20 years old. She's more in touch with The Youth than any of the NXT booking team.
But, this is a larger WWE problem than just NXT, I think. It's just more concentrated in NXT.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Dec 24, 2021 15:39:52 GMT -5
Toxic Attraction doing the Ice Bucket Challenge. They're teasing a new debut when the lights go out...and this hits: From now on when someone goes for their finisher, the shot freezes and Roundabout starts playing.
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gl83
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,990
Member is Online
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Post by gl83 on Dec 24, 2021 19:46:19 GMT -5
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Dec 24, 2021 20:03:58 GMT -5
I kind of want to see them attempt to court AEW viewers by just blatantly ripping off the previous week's Dynamite every show. Like next week Ciampa comes out talking about Cowboy Crap and Breakker says he wants judges for their rematch to keep the time limit from saving Ciampa again.
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Post by Hypnosis on Dec 24, 2021 20:14:25 GMT -5
I kind of want to see them attempt to court AEW viewers by just blatantly ripping off the previous week's Dynamite every show. Like next week Ciampa comes out talking about Cowboy Crap and Breakker says he wants judges for their rematch to keep the time limit from saving Ciampa again. Hell, they could rip off BTE. Ivy Nile chokes Brutus Creed out in a motel room every time he loses a match.
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