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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Oct 8, 2024 12:44:37 GMT -5
The Marvels was kind of a perfect storm of factors - came out during a cold period in the MCU, required entirely too much homework to even know who the main characters were (and one of the three of them was the most boring part of Wandavision), the strike limited the ability to promote it, the advertising they did do really communicated very little about it... There was just too much going against the movie actually hooking people.
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Ben Wyatt
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Oct 8, 2024 12:46:14 GMT -5
I’ll say this much: Whenever they do Joker again, they’ve gotta flip the script again. I would honestly say something more along the lines of Romero, Hamill or Nicholson. They need like, a 10 year grace period before doing the Joker again. Between this nonsense and Leto's craptastic version, the character needs to a break
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chrom
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Post by chrom on Oct 8, 2024 12:53:18 GMT -5
Disney was getting a lot of flak for the strike during that period, especially Iger's comments about how he only makes 65 million a year
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Oct 8, 2024 14:13:39 GMT -5
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Oct 8, 2024 14:25:45 GMT -5
Sounds like Phillips went way too prima donna and thought he was making high art with no consideration for if anyone but him would enjoy it.
Also since the first movie was co-financed with a different studio there's a very real chance this movie wipes out the entirety of the money Warner made from the first one.
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lionheart21
Patti Mayonnaise
Once did a thing...
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Post by lionheart21 on Oct 8, 2024 15:37:48 GMT -5
Todd Phillips in 2019: "Joker is not a comic book movie." Todd Phillips in 2024: "Joker is not Joker." “He was never actually The Joker, despite taking the name Joker and being in a movie that was literally titled Joker.”
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Post by Rumble McSkirmish on Oct 8, 2024 15:56:10 GMT -5
The "Arthur Fleck is not really Joker" explanation does tie into my own personal head cannon in which pretty much the whole of the first movie was a story The Joker was telling to his therapist at Arkham, he used the parable of the everyman to illustrate that a society built on law and order is flawed because it allows the elites to use the system to keep the downtrodden strictly underneath their thumbs and that the only way "to level the playing field" (so to speak) is to introduce elements of chaos and anarchy into the mix which are dispassionate and equal.
Well that and using the story as a way to bind his time while he planned his escape.
As for the second film... I don't know, they were personal hallucinations brought about from the shock treatment Joker received after his escape attempt went south or he got recaptured.
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Post by Feyrhausen on Oct 8, 2024 17:13:30 GMT -5
Both Marvels movies were affected by the state of Marvel Studios at the time. Captain Marvel got a boost from Infinity War (though not to the degree the incels claim) and Marvels got dragged down by actual crap like Secret Invasion. I'm not sure on that because so did Antman and the Wasp and that didn't make nearly as much money as Captain Marvel, and that was clearly going to be closer connected to End Game due to Antman actually talking to the rest of the team. and the Marvels also came out in the middle of the Strike and so there was like no promotion because of it. I am not claiming Captain Marvel would not have been successful without Infinity War/Endgame. All the little girls in Captain Marvel shirts and costumes is proof of that. It was a fine film and it was popular. I do think it got a boost though. But that is just it would have been high hundreds of millions instead of a billion. Maybe not though, I may be wrong. But yeah Marvels was just bad luck, bad timing, and people just being Marveled out in general.
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Post by darbus alan on Oct 8, 2024 17:27:45 GMT -5
I'm glad Joker 2 is a commercial and critical failure on that note. Phillips comes off like such a self-important asshole.
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Oct 8, 2024 17:52:42 GMT -5
Sounds like Phillips went way too prima donna and thought he was making high art with no consideration for if anyone but him would enjoy it. Also since the first movie was co-financed with a different studio there's a very real chance this movie wipes out the entirety of the money Warner made from the first one. The thing is that kind of approach *can* work. Denis Villeneuve has famously said he is only making his Dune films for an audience of one; himself. The key factor here is actually being a talented filmmaker. Denis is an expert of the craft, while Todd Phillips is…he’s just not. He tricked people into thinking he is by ripping off another expert of the craft. He’s like a comic book artist who can’t really draw and whose defining work is one where he traced the art of a genuine legend.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Oct 8, 2024 18:11:34 GMT -5
I'm glad Joker 2 is a commercial and critical failure on that note. Phillips comes off like such a self-important asshole. This is the same guy who called the WGA the "Whiners' Guild of America" during the strikes. Self-important asshole is an understatement.
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Zone Was Wrong
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Post by Zone Was Wrong on Oct 8, 2024 18:37:08 GMT -5
Dude pretty much ripped off a better director for the first and then got it in his head he was so much better than he actually is at writing/directing. The whole "ignoring DC heads" may seem like some rebellious bullcrap, all it really is is a symptom of a larger issue with DC/WBD, the lack of a strong central focus. Kind of why James Gunn taking over and essentially becoming DC's Fiege is a big deal since stuff needs to run by someone first before some abomination like this happens. So shocked WBD is billions in debt with decisions like this biting them in the ass /s
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Post by darbus alan on Oct 8, 2024 18:40:55 GMT -5
Sounds like Phillips went way too prima donna and thought he was making high art with no consideration for if anyone but him would enjoy it. Also since the first movie was co-financed with a different studio there's a very real chance this movie wipes out the entirety of the money Warner made from the first one. The thing is that kind of approach *can* work. Denis Villeneuve has famously said he is only making his Dune films for an audience of one; himself. The key factor here is actually being a talented filmmaker. Denis is an expert of the craft, while Todd Phillips is…he’s just not. He tricked people into thinking he is by ripping off another expert of the craft. He’s like a comic book artist who can’t really draw and whose defining work is one where he traced the art of a genuine legend.Todd Phillips is totally Banky Edwards.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on Oct 8, 2024 19:21:28 GMT -5
Sad that this wasn't good.
Happy that I didn't go see it.
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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Oct 8, 2024 20:30:38 GMT -5
I’ll start by saying I think Joaquin Phoenix STINKS as an actor. I think his portrayal on the first Joker was trash. It was a well written and fun movie but god does he suck on hot ice.
Also why does Hollywood keep making movies nobody wants or asked for ?
It’s the Joker, give people the Joker. It’s a passionate fan base that’s going to shit on any deviation from the source material but you run it through dog crap and set it on fire why?
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Oct 8, 2024 20:37:12 GMT -5
Sounds like Phillips went way too prima donna and thought he was making high art with no consideration for if anyone but him would enjoy it. Also since the first movie was co-financed with a different studio there's a very real chance this movie wipes out the entirety of the money Warner made from the first one. The thing is that kind of approach *can* work. Denis Villeneuve has famously said he is only making his Dune films for an audience of one; himself. The key factor here is actually being a talented filmmaker. Denis is an expert of the craft, while Todd Phillips is…he’s just not. He tricked people into thinking he is by ripping off another expert of the craft. He’s like a comic book artist who can’t really draw and whose defining work is one where he traced the art of a genuine legend. I'd call him the Greg Land of directors, but maybe Todd deserves a BIT more credit than that.
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Post by Confused Mark Wahlberg on Oct 8, 2024 20:45:41 GMT -5
It's like Todd Phillips got the book and turned into Vince Russo.
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Post by Wiz Backman on Oct 8, 2024 20:57:54 GMT -5
It's like Todd Phillips got the book and turned into Vince Russo. "Bro, I'm telling ya, Jokah ain't the real Jokah. He's Arthuh. And then the real Jokah does a run-in and stabs him. They'll nevah see it coming, bro."
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Johnny B. Decent
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Post by Johnny B. Decent on Oct 8, 2024 21:14:16 GMT -5
I feel that if someone thinks that they are above the content they are to create, it generally will turn out to be pretentious dogshit.
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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on Oct 8, 2024 23:12:46 GMT -5
Todd Phillips in 2025: "Joaquin Phoenix is not Joaquin Phoenix. He actually died in 2014. We replaced him like they did The Ultimate Warrior." Movie? I never made a movie! Joker 3 has been reconceptualized as a bi-monthly curated box of snacks
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