Punk Scrum Thread II: Punk terminated from AEW

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Aug 15, 2023 23:51:51 GMT -5 ChitownKnight said:

Aug 15, 2023 23:20:02 GMT -5 Fade said:

Listening to Alvarez and Meltzer talk about it on the YouTube short is brutal. They’re trying to walk that line between being objective but you can tell they’re pissed/frustrated with Punk. “I don’t want to analyze this guy anymore”. Dave basically all but says what everyone’s been theorizing:

Phil has gained control. Phil is the catalyst of all the drama. Tony needs to get control of the situation “nobody’s changed, that’s the problem.

They seem to cast doubt on the hangman not being Phil’s fault thing. You can tell a lot of people are talking to Dave.

Here’s the kicker:

This can only get worse. Think about the negative public image this has gotten online. It’s all over the internet. Even his most devout followers are either quiet or frustrated dramas come up again. The general consensus being “will you shut the f*** and focus on the product”. Think about that. If Phil’s even half aware of what everyone’s saying, think how the sentiment “will you just shut up?” Would make C.M Punk react? This can only get worse.

You can’t act like the journalist don’t love CM Punk for all the press he brings lmao

I would not love that said press having to be edited, changed, and warped every single time a piece of new info is put out there, multiple times

At that point it becomes less about reporting and pretty obvious that Punk or Punk's team is just f***ing hounding these guys to grind away at the story and keep changing any instance that Punk was not being out of turn, ever, or he was remoseful, or actually, y'know, he's just a neat swell guy, and then the fallout from that, especially with his diehard fans.

I do not blame them for being exhausted.

[Final Countdown Jones]

Really great meta heeling work from Punk to have his side of the Jack Perry story be some condescending righteous tripe about 'people taking weeks off' instead of Perry writing himself off for his booked and approved vacation. Another brick in the masterful vision that makes him a heel in the eyes of Bucks fans by having his sloppy take to SRS be wrong. He's really working it like it's Memphis over there, guy's got us by the balls.

[markymark]

Aug 16, 2023 0:00:54 GMT -5 jm said:

Aug 15, 2023 23:46:43 GMT -5 The Captain said:

I don't think he's really going to care about being booed because he relishes being heel. Like when Toronto hated the shit out of him he loved it and even egged it on.

What really does psychic damage to someone like him is no heat whatsoever. That's why that "CM PUNK IS BORING" sign probably set him off more than any boos or "f*** YOU PUNK" chants would.

He's seeing that most people who hate him, such as myself, aren't gonna tune in to see him turn heel and get his comeuppance by a babyface. They are just gonna avoid watching anything and everything he's in. Punk has so much go away heat with people, and he's realizing it.

The easiest way for him to solve it is if he apologizes to the live crowd(doesnt have to be on tv) or at least show some remorse...., the lack of reaction is going to affect him...

[Chiral]

I am also uncertain if I buy the report of him wanting to be heel, if he has so much control over Collision you'd think he'd be on that turn by now. There's still a great deal of "CM Punk is just a swell fella" story beats and it feels like they add a new shot of him warmly hugging FTR to the intro every week.

[A Platypus Rave is Correct]

Aug 16, 2023 0:14:16 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

Really great meta heeling work from Punk to have his side of the Jack Perry story be some condescending righteous tripe about 'people taking weeks off' instead of Perry writing himself off for his booked and approved vacation. Another brick in the masterful vision that makes him a heel in the eyes of Bucks fans by having his sloppy take to SRS be wrong. He's really working it like it's Memphis over there, guy's got us by the balls.

He's heeled me so hard I've pretty much stopped watching the product all together...

[UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm]

Aug 16, 2023 0:19:39 GMT -5 Chiral said:

I am also uncertain if I buy the report of him wanting to be heel, if he has so much control over Collision you'd think he'd be on that turn by now. There's still a great deal of "CM Punk is just a swell fella" story beats and it feels like they add a new shot of him warmly hugging FTR to the intro every week.

Probably a case of him wanting the crowd to be disappointed that he’s heel when it is more like people expect him to be because they’re under the impression he already is one out of storyline.

Can’t really be someone you love to hate if well… there’s really just hate.

[UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm]

Aug 16, 2023 0:21:00 GMT -5 A Platypus Rave is Correct said:

Aug 16, 2023 0:14:16 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

Really great meta heeling work from Punk to have his side of the Jack Perry story be some condescending righteous tripe about 'people taking weeks off' instead of Perry writing himself off for his booked and approved vacation. Another brick in the masterful vision that makes him a heel in the eyes of Bucks fans by having his sloppy take to SRS be wrong. He's really working it like it's Memphis over there, guy's got us by the balls.

He's heeled me so hard I've pretty much stopped watching the product all together...

That’s what sucks about this as fans eh?

I won’t pretend like AEW doesn’t have banger shows, the last few months since collision included. I try to make it to a lot of love threads but eventually, all of this going on and the veil behind the curtain being so mismanaged that it isn’t really appointment viewing anymore. I’ll still have an excellent time watching the show when I have time for it but it isn’t like what it previously was, must watch tv like raw and smackdown used to be for me way back in the day.

I know what I get when I watch will likely be good but it becomes easier and easier to dvr it and forget to watch, not even out of spite but of the immersion being broken. I’m sure I’m not the only one.

[jm]

Aug 16, 2023 0:12:05 GMT -5 dynamitekidd said:

Aug 16, 2023 0:00:54 GMT -5 jm said:

He's seeing that most people who hate him, such as myself, aren't gonna tune in to see him turn heel and get his comeuppance by a babyface. They are just gonna avoid watching anything and everything he's in. Punk has so much go away heat with people, and he's realizing it.

He’s getting the heat already, now watch in a couple of weeks, Collision views are about to fall out once football starts and that will drive away more people. Not sure if his ego is gonna be able to take it. Can you imagine if something crazy happens like Rampage starts getting more views? Dude will go nuclear on somebody.

I've said a couple of times before that I could totally see Punk wanting to be on Dynamite during football season and The Elite to be on Collision. Punk's ego will not take Collision's ratings being so down vs college football. So I could totally see him wanting him and The Elite to switch brands during football.

[Fade]

Aug 16, 2023 0:14:16 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

Really great meta heeling work from Punk to have his side of the Jack Perry story be some condescending righteous tripe about 'people taking weeks off' instead of Perry writing himself off for his booked and approved vacation. Another brick in the masterful vision that makes him a heel in the eyes of Bucks fans by having his sloppy take to SRS be wrong. He's really working it like it's Memphis over there, guy's got us by the balls.

They’re playing PR warfare. Phil’s leading it to course correct his own shit, but now more people are talking to Dave and co. about the other sides (it’s clearly not just the elite now ).

Dave’s said two people in the company, that he claims aren’t who you’d imagine, have told him that this is going to be a giant explosion and really hurt the company.

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Aug 16, 2023 0:19:39 GMT -5 Chiral said:

I am also uncertain if I buy the report of him wanting to be heel, if he has so much control over Collision you'd think he'd be on that turn by now. There's still a great deal of "CM Punk is just a swell fella" story beats and it feels like they add a new shot of him warmly hugging FTR to the intro every week.

It's weird, every report we get is "He wants to be heel, he loves getting booed, the plan is for him to be heel", and onscreen it looks like he's had like four beats where he should have been just starting that process of going heel along with potentially FTR with him but... they keep making everyone else more evil to seemingly try and justify not doing that yet.

So why does the show seem to be twisting itself into a pretzel to keep him face leaning? He declares himself the real champion, stays face, Starks turns heel instead of him, he disses fans sports teams in certain places, still has to stay ambiguous or someone like Darby has to say he wants to help AEW in a promo or something

This is why I don't like the Cena comparison and never did. Cena to me, never had to justify who he was, or why he was never gonna turn or why there were never plans for it... every single indicator seems to be Punk going heel, including reports screaming it... so why does he keep backing up and going "Woah but I'm a nice respectable chum nothing more to read into than that!" except everything he keeps putting out there.

It's like his mouth is saying one thing like we look very pretty today while his fingers flip us off at the same time, it's really f***ing weird.

[Final Countdown Jones]

Aug 16, 2023 0:19:39 GMT -5 Chiral said:

I am also uncertain if I buy the report of him wanting to be heel, if he has so much control over Collision you'd think he'd be on that turn by now. There's still a great deal of "CM Punk is just a swell fella" story beats and it feels like they add a new shot of him warmly hugging FTR to the intro every week.

Punk is a great heel but this f***ing "You boo me because in real life I'm f***ing awful" stuff is atrocious. Even as a work with "I sell more toys than Adam Page" it's so weak and underdelivers on what Punk is capable of. If he wants to be a heel and put in actual good character work, it can be great. I'm not above admitting that the Kojima match was kind of great entirely for how Punk leaned in to the audience's hate. But it can't just be over and over that he decked his boss so you boo him because he's an insecure baby man as a shoot. It's not real, people know it's not real, and the best heels are the ones where you're actually watching a show and they're doing stuff in the show. MJF got over for a reason and it's not because of the backstage situation around Double or Nothing last year, it's in spite of it. Christian puts in god-tier heel work every week with so much attention to detail and so many little mannerisms and comments that are perfectly honed. Jay White using Tony Schaivone as a human shield buffer between him and FTR was immaculate. Swerve. Swerve. Sweeeerve. Everything about Swerve. Even Daniel Garcia's character work has people popping when he gets his ass kicked. Everything.

"I'm face in a story but I keep taking minor heel digs that go nowhere and specifically court in opposition to wrestlers who literally won't return my calls" is pathetic and frankly it should be put on the level of Voodoo Kin Mafia for how much it's accomplishing its goals. But Punk also has so much control over Collision at this point that it makes me wonder if he's just greenlit or even asked for the commentary to treat him like John Cena, which again just. Why? It's not accomplishing anything in-story and he's not really doing anything to even say something interesting on the John Cena character. He's not John Cena. He's not built to be John Cena. "Oh hey I move merch but some people boo me" is a shit connection and none of it is there. It feels like all the "he's ready to go heel" stuff is almost a cop out to keep poking the bear and keep explaining away the contradictions.

I believe the "Punk wants to go heel" reporting as much as I believe Cody a year removed from AEW going "yeah I was a heel".

[Jedi-El of Tomorrow]

Aug 16, 2023 0:12:05 GMT -5 dynamitekidd said:

Aug 16, 2023 0:00:54 GMT -5 jm said:

He's seeing that most people who hate him, such as myself, aren't gonna tune in to see him turn heel and get his comeuppance by a babyface. They are just gonna avoid watching anything and everything he's in. Punk has so much go away heat with people, and he's realizing it.

He’s getting the heat already, now watch in a couple of weeks, Collision views are about to fall out once football starts and that will drive away more people. Not sure if his ego is gonna be able to take it. Can you imagine if something crazy happens like Rampage starts getting more views? Dude will go nuclear on somebody.

Yeah, college football season isn't gonna be good for Punk's ego.

[Final Countdown Jones]

Also I just wanna add that if this is somehow commentary on the John Cena character it's pointless because the best commentary on the John Cena character already happened it's called Peacemaker and the role of John Cena was played by John Cena

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Aug 16, 2023 1:21:45 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

Also I just wanna add that if this is somehow commentary on the John Cena character it's pointless because the best commentary on the John Cena character already happened it's called Peacemaker and the role of John Cena was played by John Cena

And Eagly is a better sidekick than Dax

[Mid-Carder]

I remember when the story came out about WWE saying "let him be their headache now" or something and the longtime CM Punk fangirl in me was like "lol jealous". Turns out it's the one time WWE were right.

[Dr. Bolty, Disaster Enby]

Aug 16, 2023 1:33:22 GMT -5 Mid-Carder said:

I remember when the story came out about WWE saying "let him be their headache now" or something and the longtime CM Punk fangirl in me was like "lol jealous". Turns out it's the one time WWE were right.

I've definitely readjusted my priors in the last few years to accept that sometimes, when WWE or any other promotion isn't pushing someone who seems like an obvious star, there might be something I don't know that matters more than the wrestler's talent.

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Aug 16, 2023 1:49:03 GMT -5 Dr. Bolty, Disaster Enby said:

Aug 16, 2023 1:33:22 GMT -5 Mid-Carder said:

I remember when the story came out about WWE saying "let him be their headache now" or something and the longtime CM Punk fangirl in me was like "lol jealous". Turns out it's the one time WWE were right.

I've definitely readjusted my priors in the last few years to accept that sometimes, when WWE or any other promotion isn't pushing someone who seems like an obvious star, there might be something I don't know that matters more than the wrestler's talent.

Unless it's Top Dolla over Swerve

... I can't think of a single reason for that yet lmfao

[Final Countdown Jones]

Aug 16, 2023 1:51:03 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

Aug 16, 2023 1:49:03 GMT -5 Dr. Bolty, Disaster Enby said:

I've definitely readjusted my priors in the last few years to accept that sometimes, when WWE or any other promotion isn't pushing someone who seems like an obvious star, there might be something I don't know that matters more than the wrestler's talent.

Unless it's Top Dolla over Swerve

... I can't think of a single reason for that yet lmfao

I agree wth Dr. Bolty about the really broad big picture shit, but with the Swerve situation, it was sorta clear he just fell through the cracks. He was another grab-them-off-the-indies signing and one who Triple H didn't think would be a big deal because he just wasn't paying any damn attention. When Michaels finally sat down with Swerve to watch some of his indie tape it changed the whole conversation on him in a way that made it clear nobody ever really paid mind to him. Somehow. Like whoever scouted around and said "This guy is a huge deal we need him" was written off in the midst of everything else. When finally people noticed, you get Hit Row, and of course once we're up to the main roster it was always going to be Vince overlooking the lean guy who can move for the tall ex-football dude who sucks. In time, Swerve would've stood out more, but obviously the group got released so fast it didn't matter.

It's in all the big strokes where you see the "Oh maybe that's why" situations. Like how Matt Riddle's paparently become finally too much trouble to be worth.

[Ryushinku]

Trying to catch up with this thread, and finding out that Hangman Page is more of a concept than a genuine person that exists.

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Aug 16, 2023 2:09:18 GMT -5 Final Countdown Jones said:

Aug 16, 2023 1:51:03 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

Unless it's Top Dolla over Swerve

... I can't think of a single reason for that yet lmfao

I agree wth Dr. Bolty about the really broad big picture shit, but with the Swerve situation, it was sorta clear he just fell through the cracks. He was another grab-them-off-the-indies signing and one who Triple H didn't think would be a big deal because he just wasn't paying any damn attention. When Michaels finally sat down with Swerve to watch some of his indie tape it changed the whole conversation on him in a way that made it clear nobody ever really paid mind to him. Somehow. Like whoever scouted around and said "This guy is a huge deal we need him" was written off in the midst of everything else. When finally people noticed, you get Hit Row, and of course once we're up to the main roster it was always going to be Vince overlooking the lean guy who can move for the tall ex-football dude who sucks. In time, Swerve would've stood out more, but obviously the group got released so fast it didn't matter.

It's in all the big strokes where you see the "Oh maybe that's why" situations. Like how Matt Riddle's paparently become finally too much trouble to be worth.

Oh no in some cases I can totally get it, I was just saying for some, as you said, can also just not be booked by WWE because they don't see it

In other cases... yes, they can be Matt Riddle... but even in CM Punk's case, can't say he didn't have damn near a Hall of Fame career, but as time has gone on, yes, it becomes very apparent, he was never the hero in the story, in fact, everyone just kinda seems like different forms of villains.