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Post by KAMALARAMBO: BOOMSHAKALAKA!!! on Dec 31, 2022 18:28:52 GMT -5
But how much is Dave paying them? If I was a wrestler, why would I give info to this guy, even if I liked him? Favorable publicity. There's two sides of every story but if the other person doesn't talk to the dirtsheets and you do then you can basically paint the narrative that most people will hear about. How often has Meltzer ever been negative about Jericho? How many of those "private" AEW talent meetings after Brawl Out got out and just happened to mention that Jericho gave a rousing speech and is seen as a true locker room leader? And when like 99% of people agreed that Charlotte constantly immediately winning the title back from Sasha in 2016 made Sasha look like a horrible babyface champion but Meltzer, who happens to list her dad as one of his top sources for decades, was like the one guy who would defend her booking. Yes, Rock was definitely a source for him. When there was speculation about Rock running for president, Meltzer joked that it would be cool he used to tape trade with the president, so they go back pretty far. Rock was also a Wade Keller guy back in the day and someone he'd go to if he wanted a story out there. Actually, screw "Paul Heyman guy", I say we start referring to wrestlers based on who they leak info to. You'll have a clique of Dave Meltzer guys, your Sean Ross Sapp guys, your Wade Keller guys. The true intellectuals though were probably always Larry Csonka guys. Wade Keller’s guys would be the NWO-esque cool heel stable. Wade had cool guys like The Rock and…uh…Jerry Jarrett. I wanted to find a picture of Jerry Jarrett looking cool to illustrate this point, but the closest thing I could find was this picture of his mom spanking Jerry Lawler with a broom:
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 31, 2022 18:30:52 GMT -5
The Meltzer is always wrong thing really took off with Prichard and Bischoff taking it up as a gimmick on their podcasts. Correct, which is funny because Bischoff himself was sometimes a source. Imagine believing anything those two have to say. If they said the stove was hot, I’d be tempted to check.
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Post by Jaws the Shark on Dec 31, 2022 18:35:12 GMT -5
The Meltzer is always wrong thing really took off with Prichard and Bischoff taking it up as a gimmick on their podcasts. It's weird, as much as the net sort of revolutionised insider wrestling news, it also completely f***ed it. As well as twonks like Prichard and Bischoff shitting on Meltzer on their podcasts, you now also have a lot of instances of quotes being isolated then spread around the net without the context that they need; case in point the whole controversy over him reporting that Regal had health issues back in March when if you include the rest of the quote you can see he'd said nothing of the sort, but was still trashed for misreporting or lying when he...didn't.
I think there's a degree of contrarianism too, people who want to be seen to not be "smarks" and draw attention to themselves as independent free thinkers on the internet by pointedly allying themselves with figures like Bischoff they believe to be "smark" pariahs and buying into their bullshit.
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,952
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 31, 2022 18:38:34 GMT -5
The Meltzer is always wrong thing really took off with Prichard and Bischoff taking it up as a gimmick on their podcasts. It's weird, as much as the net sort of revolutionised insider wrestling news, it also completely f***ed it. As well as twonks like Prichard and Bischoff shitting on Meltzer on their podcasts, you now also have a lot of instances of quotes being isolated then spread around the net without the context that they need; case in point the whole controversy over him reporting that Regal had health issues back in March when if you include the rest of the quote you can see he'd said nothing of the sort, but was still trashed for misreporting or lying when he...didn't. I think there's a degree of contrarianism too, people who want to be seen to not be "smarks" and draw attention to themselves as independent free thinkers on the internet by pointedly allying themselves with figures like Bischoff they believe to be "smark" pariahs and buying into their bullshit. Meltzer still gets “Mabel was the 3rd man” tweets several times a week.
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Post by KAMALARAMBO: BOOMSHAKALAKA!!! on Dec 31, 2022 18:42:53 GMT -5
The Meltzer is always wrong thing really took off with Prichard and Bischoff taking it up as a gimmick on their podcasts. It's weird, as much as the net sort of revolutionised insider wrestling news, it also completely f***ed it. As well as twonks like Prichard and Bischoff shitting on Meltzer on their podcasts, you now also have a lot of instances of quotes being isolated then spread around the net without the context that they need; case in point the whole controversy over him reporting that Regal had health issues back in March when if you include the rest of the quote you can see he'd said nothing of the sort, but was still trashed for misreporting or lying when he...didn't. I think there's a degree of contrarianism too, people who want to be seen to not be "smarks" and draw attention to themselves as independent free thinkers on the internet by pointedly allying themselves with figures like Bischoff they believe to be "smark" pariahs and buying into their bullshit. Years ago someone put it perfectly here. The segment of the IWC hating Meltzer is like Homer Simpson hating Ned Flanders. With some exceptions most of what Meltzer says/reports couldn’t really be more inoffensive.
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Post by Jaws the Shark on Dec 31, 2022 18:46:34 GMT -5
It's weird, as much as the net sort of revolutionised insider wrestling news, it also completely f***ed it. As well as twonks like Prichard and Bischoff shitting on Meltzer on their podcasts, you now also have a lot of instances of quotes being isolated then spread around the net without the context that they need; case in point the whole controversy over him reporting that Regal had health issues back in March when if you include the rest of the quote you can see he'd said nothing of the sort, but was still trashed for misreporting or lying when he...didn't. I think there's a degree of contrarianism too, people who want to be seen to not be "smarks" and draw attention to themselves as independent free thinkers on the internet by pointedly allying themselves with figures like Bischoff they believe to be "smark" pariahs and buying into their bullshit. Meltzer still gets “Mabel was the 3rd man” tweets several times a week. Don't get me started on Twitter. That's the other thing about the net, all this past reporting is now available far more widely and it means that tedious, terminally online nerds are now able to pore over everything he's ever reported and poke around on the internet for "wrong" things he's said or not said, and then present them as gotchas on Twitter and Reddit for other nerds to work themselves into a frenzy.
The absolute worst instance of this I can remember was that he once referred to Konnan as Cuban and ackshually he was Cuban American.
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Post by Jaws the Shark on Dec 31, 2022 18:49:36 GMT -5
It's weird, as much as the net sort of revolutionised insider wrestling news, it also completely f***ed it. As well as twonks like Prichard and Bischoff shitting on Meltzer on their podcasts, you now also have a lot of instances of quotes being isolated then spread around the net without the context that they need; case in point the whole controversy over him reporting that Regal had health issues back in March when if you include the rest of the quote you can see he'd said nothing of the sort, but was still trashed for misreporting or lying when he...didn't. I think there's a degree of contrarianism too, people who want to be seen to not be "smarks" and draw attention to themselves as independent free thinkers on the internet by pointedly allying themselves with figures like Bischoff they believe to be "smark" pariahs and buying into their bullshit. Years ago someone put it perfectly here. The segment of the IWC hating Meltzer is like Homer Simpson hating Ned Flanders. With some exceptions most of what Meltzer says/reports couldn’t really be more inoffensive. It's a mix of that and Doug the nerd watching Itchy & Scratchy so he can pick holes in piffling continuity errors, then boast about picking up on them.
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,952
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 31, 2022 18:58:31 GMT -5
Meltzer still gets “Mabel was the 3rd man” tweets several times a week. Don't get me started on Twitter. That's the other thing about the net, all this past reporting is now available far more widely and it means that tedious, terminally online nerds are now able to pore over everything he's ever reported and poke around on the internet for "wrong" things he's said or not said, and then present them as gotchas on Twitter and Reddit for other nerds to work themselves into a frenzy.
The absolute worst instance of this I can remember was that he once referred to Konnan as Cuban and ackshually he was Cuban American.
I’m not a subscriber nor would I call myself a fan, but I follow him on Twitter, the nonsense he puts up with. The only other person I see on Twitter who has it worse is Kelly Carlin, George’s daughter, who actually has to argue with people about what her dad believed IRL.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Dec 31, 2022 19:04:17 GMT -5
Journalists don't pay sources for a lot of ethical reasons, and while a lot of people very aggressively don't see him as a real journalist, Dave has an actual degree and history of print journalism pre-dating his wrestling beat. It's one of those things a lot of the lower rung crop of wrestling reporters today lack and you can kind of tell. In an industry like wrestling especially, you're sure to get a lot of steaming garbage in terms of scoops. Dave alreayd gets bad info intentionally leaked out to him, but putting out a cash reward for scoops would attract every carny in the world to him for a quick payday.
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Post by Jaws the Shark on Dec 31, 2022 19:09:18 GMT -5
Don't get me started on Twitter. That's the other thing about the net, all this past reporting is now available far more widely and it means that tedious, terminally online nerds are now able to pore over everything he's ever reported and poke around on the internet for "wrong" things he's said or not said, and then present them as gotchas on Twitter and Reddit for other nerds to work themselves into a frenzy.
The absolute worst instance of this I can remember was that he once referred to Konnan as Cuban and ackshually he was Cuban American.
I’m not a subscriber nor would I call myself a fan, but I follow him on Twitter, the nonsense he puts up with. The only other person I see on Twitter who has it worse is Kelly Carlin, George’s daughter, who actually has to argue with people about what her dad believed IRL. Yeah, in terms of his critical opinions I'm pretty ambivalent, but the amount of shit he gets for his reporting and his opinions is insane. He does get it wrong sometimes, and he often doesn't like stuff that people do and vice versa, but that's life, and doesn't justify the absolutely insane vitriol directed at him because he's sometimes wrong or "wrong" about wrestling.
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Post by AwamoriRock on Dec 31, 2022 19:34:35 GMT -5
I’m not a subscriber nor would I call myself a fan, but I follow him on Twitter, the nonsense he puts up with. The only other person I see on Twitter who has it worse is Kelly Carlin, George’s daughter, who actually has to argue with people about what her dad believed IRL. Yeah, in terms of his critical opinions I'm pretty ambivalent, but the amount of shit he gets for his reporting and his opinions is insane. He does get it wrong sometimes, and he often doesn't like stuff that people do and vice versa, but that's life, and doesn't justify the absolutely insane vitriol directed at him because he's sometimes wrong or "wrong" about wrestling. He’s said a few things that people have reasonable issue with that don’t have to do with getting things wrong though.
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Post by Jaws the Shark on Dec 31, 2022 19:55:07 GMT -5
Yeah, in terms of his critical opinions I'm pretty ambivalent, but the amount of shit he gets for his reporting and his opinions is insane. He does get it wrong sometimes, and he often doesn't like stuff that people do and vice versa, but that's life, and doesn't justify the absolutely insane vitriol directed at him because he's sometimes wrong or "wrong" about wrestling. He’s said a few things that people have reasonable issue with that don’t have to do with getting things wrong though. Yeah, but he's also frequently raked over the coals undeservingly for stuff that people have either misinterpreted, sometimes willfully, or that he flat out didn't say.
I'm not taking issue with people who criticise him when he deserves to be criticised, it's with people who spunk themselves when they think an opportunity has presented itself to trash him, often not just as a journalist or a critic, but as a person. I've brought it up multiple times but I think it's worth mentioning again because I found it so distasteful, when his mum died the thread about it on Reddit had to be locked because it was being trolled so relentlessly by SCJerk geeks who couldn't put their pathetic little vendetta aside for a second. It wasn't taking issue with something he got wrong, it was the sort of behaviour that makes me hate a lot of other wrestling fans.
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,952
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 31, 2022 20:06:01 GMT -5
It's weird, as much as the net sort of revolutionised insider wrestling news, it also completely f***ed it. As well as twonks like Prichard and Bischoff shitting on Meltzer on their podcasts, you now also have a lot of instances of quotes being isolated then spread around the net without the context that they need; case in point the whole controversy over him reporting that Regal had health issues back in March when if you include the rest of the quote you can see he'd said nothing of the sort, but was still trashed for misreporting or lying when he...didn't. I think there's a degree of contrarianism too, people who want to be seen to not be "smarks" and draw attention to themselves as independent free thinkers on the internet by pointedly allying themselves with figures like Bischoff they believe to be "smark" pariahs and buying into their bullshit. Meltzer still gets “Mabel was the 3rd man” tweets several times a week. Like clockwork, he’s had to respond to this as of 20 minutes ago.
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Mochi Lone Wolf
Fry's dog Seymour
Development through Destruction.
Posts: 24,038
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Post by Mochi Lone Wolf on Dec 31, 2022 20:11:15 GMT -5
I need to know the source that gave him the story of doctors taking Shibata's brain out of his head and putting it back in like it's a SNES cartridge.
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XIII
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,570
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Post by XIII on Dec 31, 2022 20:12:59 GMT -5
Paul E. Had to have been a source for a while…probably still is. lol
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Post by 06vwgti on Dec 31, 2022 20:18:38 GMT -5
I know promoter’s read it because they felt it was the only way to know what was happening in the company. Yup. Watts for sure read it, I think it was Jerry Jarrett or someone else who read it by having it sent to their mother in law's house to hide he was subscribed, among some others. Foley talked about how he was kind of mystified of Meltzer on meeting him, since he'd heard of him but this was pretty pre-internet for most people, so he didn't know much, other than that his bookings got significantly better after Meltzer called him "wrestling's best kept secret" and put him over as underutilized for how good he was. Not saying Meltzer was a kingmaker or anything, but he could materially benefit dudes, and to a degree still can. That makes me wonder, before the internet, how many people were subscribers to his newsletter. Even with a few thousand people subscribing, I don't think Meltzer would have been managing the subscriber related tasks to actually care, but some poor admin or third party contracting group... Then again, we all saw the memes of Meltzer's office and how much of a dinosaur he was with finally going on video now lol
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Post by flowercity on Jan 1, 2023 0:55:15 GMT -5
Yup. Watts for sure read it, I think it was Jerry Jarrett or someone else who read it by having it sent to their mother in law's house to hide he was subscribed, among some others. Foley talked about how he was kind of mystified of Meltzer on meeting him, since he'd heard of him but this was pretty pre-internet for most people, so he didn't know much, other than that his bookings got significantly better after Meltzer called him "wrestling's best kept secret" and put him over as underutilized for how good he was. Not saying Meltzer was a kingmaker or anything, but he could materially benefit dudes, and to a degree still can. That makes me wonder, before the internet, how many people were subscribers to his newsletter. Even with a few thousand people subscribing, I don't think Meltzer would have been managing the subscriber related tasks to actually care, but some poor admin or third party contracting group... Then again, we all saw the memes of Meltzer's office and how much of a dinosaur he was with finally going on video now lol I think his mother helped him for years with mailing.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2023 11:20:01 GMT -5
Jericho, Bill Watts, Flair, and Eric Bischoff come to mind. I know he and Cornette spoke plenty, but I am not sure if it was as a source or just for tape trading since both obviously were enthusiasts. There was a time when Vince McMahon asked Meltzer to potentially write a biography about him before changing his mind, so the two for sure have at least spoken a good deal at times, unsure if it was as any sort of source. Meltzer has been the top name for decades for a reason. He's pretty well connected, even with people who sometimes would take shots at him on TV and otherwise. Cornette says they were straight up friends for decades until a few years back. Even if he wasn't trying to be a "source" you know Dave got some stuff out of a decades-long friend sometimes.
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Post by Ganon83 on Jan 1, 2023 16:34:08 GMT -5
Bret wrote in his book ftr that he went years without talking to Meltzer outside of a quick introduction between mutuals after a show. Nothing personal but he didn't like him "exposin the business". Montreal was the thing where everybody told him to actively go to Dave on it and after that, they've seemed to have a good relationship since. So if Bret was ever a source for Meltzer, it would have only been during the WCW run.
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Post by madness50 on Jan 4, 2023 2:55:49 GMT -5
Jericho, Bill Watts, Flair, and Eric Bischoff come to mind. I know he and Cornette spoke plenty, but I am not sure if it was as a source or just for tape trading since both obviously were enthusiasts. There was a time when Vince McMahon asked Meltzer to potentially write a biography about him before changing his mind, so the two for sure have at least spoken a good deal at times, unsure if it was as any sort of source. Meltzer has been the top name for decades for a reason. He's pretty well connected, even with people who sometimes would take shots at him on TV and otherwise. Cornette says they were straight up friends for decades until a few years back. Even if he wasn't trying to be a "source" you know Dave got some stuff out of a decades-long friend sometimes. I know Cornette stuff is run into the ground, but what was the real reason Cornette just dropped Dave as a friend?
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