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Post by ChitownKnight on Feb 14, 2023 4:44:22 GMT -5
Come to think of it I wonder if that segment was setting up Seth / Logan Paul as the main event of night one. ... If so I think that's a night I'll be tuning out early. I still personally think that what Seth did at mania 31 is more valuable than a Night 1 main event. Yes technically they headlined Wrestlemania Saturday and Night 1 main events have been important but the Night 2 main event is what the “real” headline is |
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mc74
Samurai Cop
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Post by mc74 on Feb 14, 2023 5:13:22 GMT -5
Come to think of it I wonder if that segment was setting up Seth / Logan Paul as the main event of night one. ... If so I think that's a night I'll be tuning out early. No doubt, there's no need for Seth to waste his talents on this lowly shitstain. |
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Feb 14, 2023 5:42:11 GMT -5
Just as an aside on that...props for WWE for letting Seth wear the red boots on the air.
That's the most right on the button culturally relevant they've been in a while.
(I also unironically want a pair...)
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tirtefaa
Unicron
If you wanna know the truth, you gotta dig up Johnny Booth.
Posts: 3,271
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Post by tirtefaa on Feb 14, 2023 5:43:46 GMT -5
Being the main event as "promoted" as the last match is rather silly.
There are so many matches that were the main event that weren't the last match on the show.
If the case was that the main event = the last match, then the biggest wrestling audience of all time was headlined by The Hart Foundation vs. Strike Force, not Andre vs. Hogan.
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Soultastic
El Dandy
Only an idiot can be completely happy.
Posts: 8,976
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Post by Soultastic on Feb 14, 2023 7:06:55 GMT -5
Didn't watch Raw. Holy shit, Miz is STILL bringing that up in promos? Even Jericho eased up on "beating Austin and Rock the same night" over time.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Feb 14, 2023 7:08:07 GMT -5
The heel used a heavily technical definition to put himself over someone above him in the pecking order to get under his skin and prey on insecurity. Miz, who cares about seeing his name in lights, who values renown and stardom and attention, gets to say his face on the poster drove the gate or drove sales and Seth doesn't. I think the inverse of the distinction being weird to get worked up over is that a heel doing this is a weird thing to get worked up over. Storytelling gets real boring when everyone's reactions become a simplified boil-down to what's 'logical'. There's an asterisk on Seth's spot in that history and right now that's being used to do something with his character and insecurity. Real people sure as hell don't operate on pure logic.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Feb 14, 2023 7:13:46 GMT -5
The heel used a heavily technical definition to put himself over someone above him in the pecking order to get under his skin and prey on insecurity. Miz, who cares about seeing his name in lights, who values renown and stardom and attention, gets to say his face on the poster drove the gate or drove sales and Seth doesn't. I think the inverse of the distinction being weird to get worked up over is that a heel doing this is a weird thing to get worked up over. Storytelling gets real boring when everyone's reactions become a simplified boil-down to what's 'logical'. There's an asterisk on Seth's spot in that history and right now that's being used to do something with his character and insecurity. Real people sure as hell don't operate on pure logic. It reminds me about how a flat mate constantly asks about why things happen when the better approach would be easier to which I constantly say to him "Because the story would then be shit and boring". |
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Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,987
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Post by Mozenrath on Feb 14, 2023 8:06:26 GMT -5
The heel used a heavily technical definition to put himself over someone above him in the pecking order to get under his skin and prey on insecurity. Miz, who cares about seeing his name in lights, who values renown and stardom and attention, gets to say his face on the poster drove the gate or drove sales and Seth doesn't. I think the inverse of the distinction being weird to get worked up over is that a heel doing this is a weird thing to get worked up over. Storytelling gets real boring when everyone's reactions become a simplified boil-down to what's 'logical'. There's an asterisk on Seth's spot in that history and right now that's being used to do something with his character and insecurity. Real people sure as hell don't operate on pure logic. It reminds me about how a flat mate constantly asks about why things happen when the better approach would be easier to which I constantly say to him "Because the story would then be shit and boring". Right. Things should follow a coherent logic, but it doesn't have to be perfectly rational. We just need to understand the reasoning for things for them to be effective, it doesn't mean wrestling characters have to always make prudent decisions, and it's often better if they don't, so long as we can still follow why they'd do that. Vince McMahon, as a character, was effective because his cowardice and greed were effective motivations for many of his heelish actions, including not simply firing Austin when he could benefit from him financially, with his pettiness and ego being leveraged whenever they needed to place him in harm's way. Mr. McMahon was still ultimately a fool, the one the joke was on, but you could typically understand WHY he'd find himself in a mess. |
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Feb 14, 2023 8:06:55 GMT -5
It's just all very silly to me. He's both ended Mania as champion in one of the most famous endings in company history and also won the world title at Mania by beating the super protected champion (and it just happened to open the show). There has to be a better way to find a motivation for this dude.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Feb 14, 2023 8:52:52 GMT -5
It's just all very silly to me. He's both ended Mania as champion in one of the most famous endings in company history and also won the world title at Mania by beating the super protected champion (and it just happened to open the show). There has to be a better way to find a motivation for this dude. They do seem to never know how to set Rollins up for ‘Mania matches. Like, they spent most of the season last year trying to convince us there wasn’t room for him on the card until Vince was like “Of course you have a match, why would we not have you on?” retconning the entire story he booked. |
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msc
Dennis Stamp
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Post by msc on Feb 14, 2023 9:30:46 GMT -5
It's a bit like Edge/Foley in 2006.
"Mick Foley, you may have won the tag titles at WrestleMania, you may have refereed the main event, you might have KO'd Vince McMahon at WrestleMania, and wrestled in the main event of WrestleMania, but you've never had a WrestleMania Moment."
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schma
El Dandy
Who are you to doubt me?
Posts: 7,548
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Post by schma on Feb 14, 2023 10:01:52 GMT -5
In his promo, Seth specifically mentioned that he wanted his name on the marquee when he's talking about having not headlined Wrestlemania. So yeah he won the main event but he wasn't scheduled for it. That's what he's getting at. Essentially his character is acknowledging that his participation in that main even wasn't entirely Kosher and he wants to 'do it right'.
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schma
El Dandy
Who are you to doubt me?
Posts: 7,548
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Post by schma on Feb 14, 2023 10:04:34 GMT -5
Just as an aside on that...props for WWE for letting Seth wear the red boots on the air. That's the most right on the button culturally relevant they've been in a while. (I also unironically want a pair...) Are these something people are actually wearing? I'm behind on a lot of pop culture. I thought this was just playing into Seth wears wacky outfits. |
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Feb 14, 2023 10:08:28 GMT -5
Just as an aside on that...props for WWE for letting Seth wear the red boots on the air. That's the most right on the button culturally relevant they've been in a while. (I also unironically want a pair...) Are these something people are actually wearing? I'm behind on a lot of pop culture. I thought this was just playing into Seth wears wacky outfits. No, the shoes were officially revealed a few days ago. I only heard about it because I follow people that follow shoe accounts. |
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Feb 14, 2023 10:12:21 GMT -5
In his promo, Seth specifically mentioned that he wanted his name on the marquee when he's talking about having not headlined Wrestlemania. So yeah he won the main event but he wasn't scheduled for it. That's what he's getting at. Essentially his character is acknowledging that his participation in that main even wasn't entirely Kosher and he wants to 'do it right'. And he's a face now, right? Because that'd also be a massive part of it. The single most iconic moment of his career and his claim to a main event came during a period where he was just like the worst f***ing guy. If ever there was someone who could reasonably make a strong claim to wanting to do it the right way it'd be him. |
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4real
Wade Wilson
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Post by 4real on Feb 14, 2023 10:12:48 GMT -5
I saw it as The Miz knows Seth is adamant that he should be the man in the company and for one reason or another that hasn’t happened (every time he got given the ball something went wrong so to me there’s a reason why Seth isn’t the top guy) and it eats Seth up that he’s not at Roman’s spot or at this stage even at Sami or Cody’s
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Post by dangerousdanpotato on Feb 14, 2023 10:22:47 GMT -5
I feel like choosing chaos tonight so I'mma let this rip: What match would you call the main event of Wrestlemania IX? Mega Maniacs vs. Money Inc.  |
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Feb 14, 2023 10:25:06 GMT -5
I feel like choosing chaos tonight so I'mma let this rip: What match would you call the main event of Wrestlemania IX? Mega Maniacs vs. Money Inc. With a clean finish? Absolutely. With the finish it got? Absolutely not. |
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Post by Jindrak Mark on Feb 14, 2023 10:46:33 GMT -5
For me it's: Main eventing = Your match goes on last. Headlining = Your match gets the most promotion beforehand. Most of the time they'll be one in the same but not always like with obvious cases like Hogan/Rock and Hogan/Vince were they were the most hyped matches at Wrestlemania 18/19 and the ones that were all over the posters and stuff so I would find it fair to call them headliners but they obviously didn't go on last. In Seth's case obviously he wasn't a headliner because he wasn't promoted as part of the match. If you purchased the PPV you went in knowing Brock/Roman and Rollins/Orton were the matches. Rollins cashing in his MITB was a prediction at best. He's in the history books though and ended up going on last/competing in the main event so he can call himself a Wrestlemania main eventer but just the word headliner doesn't fit his particular circumstances. I feel like choosing chaos tonight so I'mma let this rip: What match would you call the main event of Wrestlemania IX? Mega Maniacs vs. Money Inc. I think that actually was the biggest draw for Wrestlemania 9 due to it being Hogan's big return and first match after a year. Not as big of an example as his 18/19 matches but I do think Hogan's return was a bigger selling point than Yoko/Bret. |
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Post by darbus alan on Feb 14, 2023 10:51:34 GMT -5
Headlining is about promotion and advertisement, not the actual execution of the match. Seth's cash in was a complete surprise, so he wasn't promoted as part of the main event.
So Miz is technically correct, the best kind of correct.
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