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Post by wildojinx on May 21, 2023 22:39:35 GMT -5
I was thinking about this today. Is there any way you could do this plot (ie, that one Seinfeld episode or Homer thinking Mr. Burns is hitting on him) in this day and age without coming off as offensive? MAYBE if the mistaken for Gay character actually ends up being Gay, but otherwise it just leads to cheap innuendo-laden stuff
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on May 21, 2023 23:01:58 GMT -5
It wouldn't be offensive as much as just awkward.
Back in the era it was written, with homosexuality more stigmatized and closeted, it could be funny in a certain way of writing it, but it would only work for that audience and others that came before.
Today, it just would be more eh. But I'm bi so what do I know?
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pinja
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Post by pinja on May 21, 2023 23:14:14 GMT -5
I think it would be pretty easy by not focusing on the homosexuality or any falsely attributed sexuality, but on the fact that someone's sexuality got denied. Sexuality is a big part of most people's identity. There's got to be a few dramas about this type of confusion and what it might do to a teenager's psychology. Commedy, however, is a tougher one.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on May 21, 2023 23:22:54 GMT -5
I think Frasier generally did it well and there are ways to do it that focus more on the humor of the confusion rather than the humor of someone possibly being mistaken for being gay.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on May 21, 2023 23:41:50 GMT -5
Depends. “The Outing” episode of Seinfeld won awards from GLADD. An episode of Cheers, where it’s mistaken for a gay bar would never fly today, but it won awards too.
It’s all context and you have to be more clever than “haha, gay” but sure, it could be done. Not sure anyone would try.
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Post by Limity (BLM) on May 21, 2023 23:52:47 GMT -5
Well that's a good question, the more I think on it. First, what genre are we talking about? It's almost played for laughs, so let's stick with the comedy genre. With that, however, is the careful consideration of who or what is the punchline of a joke.
Over time, a few shows have already approached this trope and added their own twist on it. Community did it with Britta, where her and a female guest star thought each other was gay and wanted to be seen being accepted and open minded. The joke was not at the expense of anyone being or not being gay.
My favorite is Arrested Development, where everyone knew Tobias was gay EXCEPT Tobias. Again, the jokes were not at the expense of being gay or homosexuality in general.
So you could follow these examples, and approach the trope where the butt of the jokes may be the straight character and their lack of understanding or insecurities. The focus is not on the character "mistaken for gay", but on the character that is doing the mistaking.
To me, 40 Year Old Virgin did this approach by accident. When Paul Rudd and Seth Rogan's characters were going back and forth about who was gay, one says, "You know how I know you're gay? You listen to Coldplay."
I laugh at that every time, because to me it's at the expense of those characters, and their limited ability to grasp concepts including bands just left of center like Coldplay was.
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Moppy
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Post by Moppy on May 22, 2023 12:24:53 GMT -5
Reminds me of an old episode of Everybody Loves Raymond I rewatched recently.
Marie tells this story of how she made Frank jealous early in their romance by having dinner with a guy named Chuck Pecorella.
The gag being, later she reveals it was all a ruse - 'don't be naive, Chuck Pecorella was gay!' and the live studio audience lose their freaking minds.
Like it's really innocuous and not offensive but it's just so comically out of place through today's lense, like, what's the joke? Revealing an offscreen character as gay isn't ostensibly offensive in this context, but it's also not a joke.
It's like the live audience just heard the word gay and went bananas. Feels like the kind of thing that crept up on Friends a hell of a lot as well.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on May 22, 2023 12:44:28 GMT -5
Reminds me of an old episode of Everybody Loves Raymond I rewatched recently. Marie tells this story of how she made Frank jealous early in their romance by having dinner with a guy named Chuck Pecorella. The gag being, later she reveals it was all a ruse - 'don't be naive, Chuck Pecorella was gay!' and the live studio audience lose their freaking minds. Like it's really innocuous and not offensive but it's just so comically out of place through today's lense, like, what's the joke? Revealing an offscreen character as gay isn't ostensibly offensive in this context, but it's also not a joke. It's like the live audience just heard the word gay and went bananas. Feels like the kind of thing that crept up on Friends a hell of a lot as well. There was an episode of Married with Children where Peggy goes out dancing, without Al, meets a guy there and they begin dancing together every week. Suddenly, the man's husband (played by Dan Castellaneta) shows to tell Al about what is happening and how worried he is Peggy is trying to steal his husband. He and Al get along famously, he cooks for Al, they watch baseball, there's no hint at all Al has a problem with a homosexual couple and he gives Dan's character advice and feels jealous of the man Peggy has been dancing with. Eventually goes to meet Peggy for dancing, Peg tells Al all about the guy she was dancing with and how she could have had him. Episode ends on the line, "He's a homo, Peg" and laugh track. Obviously, then it was a funny punchline, now it's a sharp left turn into language people don't use anymore. |
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Post by Hit Girl on May 22, 2023 16:17:35 GMT -5
Invert it and have someone gay being falsely suspected of being straight.
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Scoops
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Post by Scoops on May 22, 2023 17:18:59 GMT -5
The "Guess who likes you?" Simpsons joke would have been a months long controversy if it happened today.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on May 22, 2023 17:55:36 GMT -5
The "Guess who likes you?" Simpsons joke would have been a months long controversy if it happened today. And, frankly, it’s still hilarious. It’s the eyebrows and then the smash cut to Milhouse being hauled away and the EMT saying “He can’t hear you, we had to pack his ears with gauze” I know it’s not right, but it’s funny. |
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Post by Ryback on a Pole! on May 22, 2023 21:07:13 GMT -5
I was thinking about this today. Is there any way you could do this plot (ie, that one Seinfeld episode or Homer thinking Mr. Burns is hitting on him) in this day and age without coming off as offensive? MAYBE if the mistaken for Gay character actually ends up being Gay, but otherwise it just leads to cheap innuendo-laden stuff Ted Lasso kinda did it with Jamie Tartt with a one-off scene. One of the players, Isacc attacked a fan who was using homophobic abuse, and someone suggested something like "Isaacc isn't gay, but someone on the team is" and everyone looked straight at Jamie. He said "I'm flattered, but it's not me" |
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The Ichi
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Post by The Ichi on May 23, 2023 7:29:35 GMT -5
...I've seen this a ton. Like Always Sunny do it at least once per season.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on May 23, 2023 9:26:34 GMT -5
Invert it and have someone gay being falsely suspected of being straight. It feels that trope has replaced it. Though "gay as a twist" for a while was cringy. Only because of execution and how after the fact the characters would have no identity outside of being there with their partner who also says nothing ever. Walking Dead is the best example but I can write for days about their issues with representing people. |
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Allie Kitsune
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Post by Allie Kitsune on May 23, 2023 9:39:31 GMT -5
Maybe. But not as a joke. It'd have to just be a matter-of-fact thing that happens (eg : Gay character thinks another guy he takes an interest in might be gay, he's not, and just politely says as such and moves on) and then it's done.
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Dr. T is an alien
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Post by Dr. T is an alien on May 23, 2023 9:43:58 GMT -5
Johnny Galecki got that in real life, but his response was basically, “Meh. You say that like it is a bad thing to be gay. I don’t care if you think that I am.” Considering that he stayed friends with Sara Gilbert after they broke up because she realized that she was a lesbian, I’m not surprised at his mindset.
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