ChitownKnight
El Dandy
Lets go Bears
Posts: 8,219
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 9, 2024 22:49:52 GMT -5
For years we never gave wwe the benefit of the doubt. Hell a lot of us were afraid they would have Cody lose two years in a row to beat Hogan’s record. But HHH made wait and see work
-Having Roman beat Cody last year was certainly not a popular move, but it made the ending to 40 so much sweeter and Cody got more over. And before anyone says that the Rock almost ruined it, 1. I don’t think that was HHH’s idea, and 2. They still pivoted and listened to the fan’s reaction and made the story work.
-We all called Damien Priest a dumbass for never cashing in when Seth was hurt or fatigued or w/e but little did we know he’d do a Wrestlemania cash in and the way the cash in happened was perfect with Drew focusing more on Punk than beating Seth and winning the title
Now are his story’s perfect? Probably not but he’s created some major moments in pro wrestling
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Post by TWERKIN' MAGGLE on Apr 9, 2024 22:51:57 GMT -5
Fair assessment. At the very least, we can say Paul Levesque is flexible enough to not thumb his nose at fans and ignore them.
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Post by Ludwig Kaiser’s Walk on Apr 9, 2024 22:53:39 GMT -5
Fair assessment. At the very least, we can say Paul Levesque is flexible enough to not thumb his nose at fans and ignore them. Which is a huge compliment in the world of professional wrestling bookers. |
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Post by "Cane Dewey" Johnson on Apr 9, 2024 22:54:08 GMT -5
Broken analog clocks are right twice a day.
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Post by Muskrat on Apr 9, 2024 23:01:49 GMT -5
Levesque knows how to pay off a story. You can debate his skills when it comes to the timing of paying said stories off, and not every story is gonna be a hit, but the dude understands basic storytelling. Which is a helluva lot more then you can say for Vince the past 20 years
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ChitownKnight
El Dandy
Lets go Bears
Posts: 8,219
Member is Online
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 9, 2024 23:06:43 GMT -5
Levesque knows how to pay off a story. You can debate his skills when it comes to the timing of paying said stories off, and not every story is gonna be a hit, but the dude understands basic storytelling. Which is a helluva lot more then you can say for Vince the past 20 years Even the little things he’s good at. I wasn’t a fan of Sami beating Gunther (I think it should have been Jey at the next PLE), but Gunther getting cocky and f***ing around cost him the match and his historic title reign. Roman’s resentment of Seth betraying him cost him his historic reign, and Drew’s hatred of Punk cost him the title just moments after winning it. |
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Post by jason1980s on Apr 9, 2024 23:43:45 GMT -5
Cody beating Roman last year would have been great but beating him this year, with different storyline twists made for an even sweeter victory. It had much bigger impact I think. And with Vince in the rear view mirror, I really do see some great things coming. I feel like Wrestlemania X was a little bit of a dawning of a new era but 40 is even bigger.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Apr 9, 2024 23:56:31 GMT -5
I said this in another thread, but it bears repeating. I don't expect WWE doing the strongest babyface payoff possible for WM40 to mean that suddenly everything is OK, because it's been a long arduous journey as fans getting to this point. But I do hope that the kind of relentless cynicism that led to expecting the bad ending to happen EVERY time is eased off bit by bit over time to the point that, eventually, WWE is seen the same as every other wrestling company is... That they're no longer going out of their way to piss you off and that anything good that happens is merely coincidental.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone.
Got away with it, this time.
Posts: 23,528
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Post by Bo Rida on Apr 10, 2024 0:21:15 GMT -5
Levesque knows how to pay off a story. You can debate his skills when it comes to the timing of paying said stories off, and not every story is gonna be a hit, but the dude understands basic storytelling. Which is a helluva lot more then you can say for Vince the past 20 years Even the little things he’s good at. I wasn’t a fan of Sami beating Gunther (I think it should have been Jey at the next PLE), but Gunther getting cocky and f***ing around cost him the match and his historic title reign. Roman’s resentment of Seth betraying him cost him his historic reign, and Drew’s hatred of Punk cost him the title just moments after winning it. That's maybe the most important thing. For too long it was all about the result, they'd rather have a shocking moment than a compelling story in the match. If there's focus on how they win or lose it's a lot more satisfying, doesn't matter so much if you don't like the result or its predictable. All that said hhh has a habit of dragging things out for far too long. He got lucky fans went with this mainly due to the popularity of Cody and Roman. He won't always so fortunate. Given how Bryan and Kofi's reigns were both false dawns they won't be in the clear until Cody has an acceptable run with a decent ending. |
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Post by HIM on Apr 10, 2024 0:40:17 GMT -5
I'm someone who stopped watching wrestling around the mid-00s (circa 2006-2007) and picked it up again a few years later with Punk's Pipebomb in 2011. Around 2013 there was a sort of weird stubborness about booking that I noticed and it started with the whole Authority/Bryan thing. Once I realized, that there was this worry in the back of my mind that they were going to ignore the fans, not care about storytelling much and were going to ignorantly try to push through the comments and do things they wanted rather than what we wanted. It doesn't matter the match, feud, segment, it doesn't matter how popular the babyface was, it was always there to me on the main roster. Even when we had great moments like Ambrose winning the WWE Championship I still felt like that it was only a matter of time. Hell, Ambrose was on the preshow at the next WM a few months after he lost that title.
That feeling isn't there anymore. I've got faith they'll do well again. It might not be perfect but I know that they hear us and they'll do what's right as best they can.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Apr 10, 2024 1:06:08 GMT -5
I think What helped is that Hunter showed that his plan was always Cody takes the title at Mania 40 after Roman beat him at 39. Cody was always high profile, he was the guy that advocated for Jey, and then there was the Smackdown where Cody and Roman had the staredown with Nick Aldis saying "Not tonight." Hunter was telling everybody that his plan was always Cody beating Roman for the title at 40. There were some bumps, the biggest one being Rock trying to force his way to the Roman match, but the plan was what we got on Sunday night. Time for Hunter to admit he loves the MCU. Last year was Infinity War, night 1 was Thanos destroying the Avengers Compound and kicking the crap out of the Trinity, and night 2 was of course Portals and the triumph. Fair assessment. At the very least, we can say Paul Levesque is flexible enough to not thumb his nose at fans and ignore them. He apparently didn't know why Blue Pants was so popular with the NXT crowd, but said "f*** it, the crowds love her so we'll use Leva more." I think it was said that he didn't get why Enzo and Cass were as over as they were, but he kept putting them out there. Levesque knows how to pay off a story. You can debate his skills when it comes to the timing of paying said stories off, and not every story is gonna be a hit, but the dude understands basic storytelling. Which is a helluva lot more then you can say for Vince the past 20 years Even the little things he’s good at. I wasn’t a fan of Sami beating Gunther (I think it should have been Jey at the next PLE), but Gunther getting cocky and f***ing around cost him the match and his historic title reign. Roman’s resentment of Seth betraying him cost him his historic reign, and Drew’s hatred of Punk cost him the title just moments after winning it. There's something else about Sami's win that I hope they bring up. Last year at Mania, he and Owens ended the historic title reign of the Usos and this year he ends Gunther's historic IC title reign. |
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Post by BigPoppaNasty on Apr 10, 2024 1:40:30 GMT -5
Broken analog clocks are right twice a day. But the best booker in professional wrestling is right a lot more than that. |
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Post by David-Arquette was in WCW 2000 on Apr 10, 2024 1:57:26 GMT -5
As long as Triple H books an actual finish and pay off to these long stories and angles, as he has in the two big examples in the OP, then people will want to stay invested in them.
It's building up trust with the fans that if they watch and go along for the ride then it will be worth it. Hopefully it will see a return to more long term storytelling, and less reliance on trying to bump a quick rating whilst burning through angles.
One of the best examples of days past is the Mega Powers, which ran a whole year, but technically had seeds planted the year prior. Amazing story with a pay off that worked. Wrestling needs more of that.
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Post by theironyuppie on Apr 10, 2024 5:07:53 GMT -5
I'm someone who stopped watching wrestling around the mid-00s (circa 2006-2007) and picked it up again a few years later with Punk's Pipebomb in 2011. Around 2013 there was a sort of weird stubborness about booking that I noticed and it started with the whole Authority/Bryan thing. Once I realized, that there was this worry in the back of my mind that they were going to ignore the fans, not care about storytelling much and were going to ignorantly try to push through the comments and do things they wanted rather than what we wanted. It doesn't matter the match, feud, segment, it doesn't matter how popular the babyface was, it was always there to me on the main roster. Even when we had great moments like Ambrose winning the WWE Championship I still felt like that it was only a matter of time. Hell, Ambrose was on the preshow at the next WM a few months after he lost that title. That feeling isn't there anymore. I've got faith they'll do well again. It might not be perfect but I know that they hear us and they'll do what's right as best they can. It's a combination of changed booking and a changed fanbase. Vince's last decade at least was marred by his combination of stubbornness, pettiness, and indecisiveness, while the years up to the launch of AEW also had a very paranoid and smarky fanbase. This fanbase contributed to things like the rise of Becky (as much as people wanted her to succeed, there was also that element that cheering for her being seen as sticking it to WWE due to the botched heel turn), but also got very fearful about things like Roman 'coronations' that never quite seemed to come due to Vince changing his mind. Which lead to terrible results like the WM 34 main event.
These days, you can generally have more trust that stories will pay off, that not only the very top stars matter, and that smaller details are worth thinking about rather than worrying about Vince tearing up the script right before the show starts. (While Becky's book is generally flattering about him, she does repeatedly stress how chaotic creative was and how often even really important segments like her/Charlotte/Becky's debuts hadn't even been finished being properly written before the start of that episode.)
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