Will we ever get a Hogan/Rock fan response again?

[mysticalhamster]

I have WWE 24/7, and I opened Jonathan Coachman's Christmas gift, and to my surprise it was The classic Hollywood Hogan vs. Rock at Wrestle mania 18.

This made me happy, since I remember seeing this live on PPV and being totally in awe of the crowd.

This then made me very sad, since we have not had a crowd so into a match like they were in Canada that night. Not even the 'mighty' John Cena, Batista, Undertaker, HHH, etc has come close to this.

Todays moronic humanoid fans only pop for Batista since Batista himself looks as if he is going to pop at any moment if you know what I mean. They pop for HHH in my opinion because they feel sad for the man, they see right through his cerebral assassin gimmick, and only like him because if they truly start to dislike him, Vince will jack up the ticket price to the next live show when it comes to their Podunk town, USA.

Undertaker gets pops simply because the fans know that the match will be decent, due to Undertaker's proving talent to entertain them. The gimmick has become a non-factor. It's something the fans expect to be present, nothing more, nothing less. Compare it to baseball. Imagine if fans went to a game involving their favorite team. They announce that because they can, they have decided they will be playing only 6 innings. Clearly the fans go nuts, because they *expect* the game to be 9 innings. If Taker did not come out in his evolved adult emo gimmick, the fans would be pissed.

And then we have John Cena.. For the love of me I cannot explain why the moronic fans cheer for this man. It clearly is not for his 'wrestling' skills, since they are paper thin. This man would not have lasted 15 minutes with a Flair or Steamboat circa 1989. Perhaps the fans like his look, and his physique. Then again, if this were the case people like Val Venis would be popular on this alone. But of course, Val Venis achieved his look via hard gym work. Cena? could be..

Then you have Cena's gimmick. Or should I say lack of gimmick. Perhaps Cena is smarter than me, as are his fans. His lack of a gimmick IS a gimmick they think. My bad!

Ok, rant off. Back to the question at hand.

Let's talk about that night with the rock and hogan. I was able to watch it over and over, rewind, etc and that crowd had to be breathing in some secret WWE 'sweet gas' all night, a special gas that excites fans to pop for everything, throwing out all set 'rules' of heel and face.

For *your chosen gods sake*, they POPPED for both of them AS THEY STARTED THE MATCH and did that routine 'walk around the ring in a circle to get the match started' thing. WTF?

And they were not just popping for both men at the smallest movement they did, they were standing, doing poses, even some jumping out of pure joy. Perhaps the recent Carolinas crowds failed to see this match, or even know of it. They sat there like brain dead Borg drones.

So then Hogan pushes rock down, as the HEEL. Rock flops back selling like mad for Hogan, Hogan starts to pose and flex - crowd within a second totally forgets that 'Hollywood' Hogan, the leader of the nWo, is in the ring fighting the good guy, The Rock. They stand, cheer, pop, etc. Hogan if but for a moment, truly looked stunned - then he quickly realized the fans were behind him and then at that second decided to change his work to very carefully play the crowd as the 'old hero being beaten up by this upstart youngster'. It does not matter that Hogan was yelling heel phrases towards rock, calling him a 'meatball', sounding like Thunderlips from his Rocky appearance.

They don't care, all of a sudden it's the late 80's early 90's. I swore if I looked close enough I could see a few guys popping what looked like vitamins from a pill bottle. The match continues, they heavily boo rock if he even gets within 5 feet of Hogan - let alone touch him.

Rock not being stupid slightly changes his game plan to work as a neo heel, while still portraying himself as a face. But to the fans, he is now the heel, and hogan is the betrayed face. Rock heels it up by grabbing a chair, but the ref takes it away and Hogan drops him. Hogan tries to be the heel by getting the heat of tearing up the announcers table to give the impression that he plans to brawl rocky on it. Hogan than starts to whip Rock with his workout belt, to loud approval.

Then rock gets the belt, looks down at it in a very heel like fashion, and whips the old and broken down fallen hero, Hogan. He then spits on the belt ( I am sure that was planned from the start. Yea right ) and whips him a final time. Around this time the ref bump happens, and a few rock bottoms take place, a sharpshooter,( Which btw made the Canada crowd pop so loud I am sure all of their voices were gone for the next few days.) etc. Hogan starts to hulk up after like 3 rock bottoms or something, only to have rock kick out of his devastating leg drop of doom, which angers the crowd even more.

Ok to wrap it up, the rock ends up winning the match. BUT - watch it again if you can, when Rock wins, ALL OF A FREAKING SUDDEN the fans POP FOR THE FACE again, as a broken Hogan lays on the mat.

W-T-F. Why would they boo the face Rock during most of the match, then within 2 seconds decide they would *as one* pop loud for Rock?? And why did they turn so viciously and quickly on Hogan, the same man they went ape poop over all match?

These are good questions, they are. I won't even get into the crap that Hogan stayed in the ring when he was supposed to go crap, nor the lame nWo beating that the rock should have let happen.

I wrote all of this for one simple reason that I hope you see by now. WHERE ARE THE GOOD FANS? ( or is it, where are the good matches? )

Could it really be that that night was very unique? I mean it was Toronto, they were Canadians, which are in general smarter about wrestling in ways than Americans, and the fact from what I could see the crowd seemed to be a tad older than this new generation of fans brought in by Cena?

Can you feel my pain? I just want to have this kind of response again. It's been too long. Only the WWE right now can get arenas large enough for this kind of fan noise to take place.

Argh!!!

[mainsupreme]

Maybe if hogan vs. austin gets a good build-up.

But it was hulk motherfrigging hogan returning to wrestlemania against the rock. It just doesn't get any bigger than that

[Hiroshi Hase]

mainsupreme said:

Maybe if hogan vs. austin gets a good build-up.

But it was hulk motherfrigging hogan returning to wrestlemania against the rock. It just doesn't get any bigger than that

Agreed, it may as well have been the main event because that was the loudest that crowd was going to get and they were somewhat dead afterwards, and I heard that even some left after it.

[Loki]

The crowd marked out loud for Rock-Hogan because it was a ONCE IN A LIFETIME match.

How could they cheer like crazy for a match they've seen 10 times already and will probably see for 10 more times in the upcoming months?

Why was Hogan-Andre so special? Because it was the first "real" showdown between the two of them. Had they wrestled one-on-one six months before, nobody'd have cared so much.

Ditto for Hogan-Warrior.

All the "milestone" matches in WWF/E have one trait in common: they're a special, never (or rarely) seen before event, built-up and booked as such.

[tomservo23]

I'm not even going to respond to this drivel, but I will say that the most pathetic smark is the one that insults other fans because they're into something they consider "stupid." Just pathetic. You make me sad to be from the Midwest.

[Hiroshi Hase]

loki said:

The crowd marked out loud for Rock-Hogan because it was a ONCE IN A LIFETIME match.

How could they cheer like crazy for a match they've seen 10 times already and will probably see for 10 more times in the upcoming months?

Why was Hogan-Andre so special? Because it was the first "real" showdown between the two of them. Had they wrestled one-on-one six months before, nobody'd have cared so much.

Ditto for Hogan-Warrior.

All the "milestone" matches in WWF/E have one trait in common: they're a special, never (or rarely) seen before event, built-up and booked as such.

Of course, I wasn't saying that it wasn't, just saying what I thought of it that's all.

And also most of the big dream matches are all gone now.

[krill]

loki said:

The crowd marked out loud for Rock-Hogan because it was a ONCE IN A LIFETIME match.

How could they cheer like crazy for a match they've seen 10 times already and will probably see for 10 more times in the upcoming months?

Why was Hogan-Andre so special? Because it was the first "real" showdown between the two of them. Had they wrestled one-on-one six months before, nobody'd have cared so much.

Ditto for Hogan-Warrior.

All the "milestone" matches in WWF/E have one trait in common: they're a special, never (or rarely) seen before event, built-up and booked as such.

Whats that sound?


























Thats the nail being hit on the head

[Corporate H]

Only time will tell. Who knew anyone would cheer for Rocky Maivia...EVER?

[Lt. Palumbo]

I say Rock/Cena would be the best bet at present

Austin and Hogan reappear far too frequently for anyone to care, so it has to be Rock and like him or not Cena gets huge cheers and would be a fresh opponent for the Rock.

A case could also be made for Rock/HBK, but for some reason,I feel that Rock/Cena, while surely not a better match, would garner a better reaction

[algertman]

Having so many damn PPV a year kills that alot now. We see the same matches every month

[phenomphan]

At this point the only thing that I think could come close is Taker vs. Sting. Both are legends and they've never fought before. You can bet their respective fan bases would be very passionate about their guy. I still wanna see this match one day.

[Jack]

Rock is probably the best of his generation at garnering fan reaction and Hogan is almost certainly the best of all time at it. There's no way that crowd was going to be dead.

The match itself WAS the main event of Wrestlemania. I don't care what match was on last or who walked away with the belt, the merchendise, the t-shirts, the DVD's the signs, the reaction and the point where everyone stops the DVD and says "oh wait...put it back on, we've forgot the title match" says that Hogan vs Rock was the main event for Wrestlemania 18.

[Hiroshi Hase]

tryme said:

Rock is probably the best of his generation at garnering fan reaction and Hogan is almost certainly the best of all time at it. There's no way that crowd was going to be dead.

The match itself WAS the main event of Wrestlemania. I don't care what match was on last or who walked away with the belt, the merchendise, the t-shirts, the DVD's the signs, the reaction and the point where everyone stops the DVD and says "oh wait...put it back on, we've forgot the title match" says that Hogan vs Rock was the main event for Wrestlemania 18.

I usually stop watching the DVD after Hogan/Rock, as Austin had already wrestled against Hall earlier, so there wasn't really anything else to watch that was important to me.

[Erik Majorwitz]

I think John Cena should come back as Sting...

I mean, why not?

[Hiroshi Hase]

devondragon said:

the only thing that irked me about that match was "Wrestling's past vs wrestling's future", yet Hogan still wrestled after Rock retired

Well, it wasn't a retirement match or anything and by that time I think Rock was wrestling a schedule where he wasn't at every show, he was gone by the next PPV and didn't return till June of 2002.

[Jack]

devondragon said:

the only thing that irked me about that match was "Wrestling's past vs wrestling's future", yet Hogan still wrestled after Rock retired

You just got who was who the wrong way round.

[KAMALARAMBO: BOOMSHAKALAKA!!!]

The main event of Wrestlemania 23 could of gotten a reaction like that if they booked Shawn Michaels against someone the Detroit fans didn't hate. Giving more buildup to the event couldn't have hurt either.

[ChitownKnight]

If they do Cena vs Hogan 5 years from now, It will get a HUGE pop

[Deleted]

mysticalhamster said:

Todays moronic humanoid fans only pop for Batista since Batista himself looks as if he is going to pop at any moment if you know what I mean.

I don't like Batista, but honestly, no. I don't know what you mean.

They pop for HHH in my opinion because they feel sad for the man, they see right through his cerebral assassin gimmick, and only like him because if they truly start to dislike him, Vince will jack up the ticket price to the next live show when it comes to their Podunk town, USA.

Okay, now I really have no idea what that's supposed to mean. If fans don't cheer HHH ticket prices go up, and I feel sorry for him?

If Taker did not come out in his evolved adult emo gimmick, the fans would be pissed.

evolved adult...Nah, dude, you lost me.

And then we have John Cena.. For the love of me I cannot explain why the moronic fans cheer for this man. It clearly is not for his 'wrestling' skills, since they are paper thin. This man would not have lasted 15 minutes with a Flair or Steamboat circa 1989. Perhaps the fans like his look, and his physique. Then again, if this were the case people like Val Venis would be popular on this alone. But of course, Val Venis achieved his look via hard gym work. Cena? could be..

Then you have Cena's gimmick. Or should I say lack of gimmick. Perhaps Cena is smarter than me, as are his fans. His lack of a gimmick IS a gimmick they think. My bad!

Cena bashing. How original.

Can you feel my pain? I just want to have this kind of response again. It's been too long. Only the WWE right now can get arenas large enough for this kind of fan noise to take place.

Yes. Yes I can feel your pain. But let's just face it. Until we're given something to really get behind, and honestly care for, you won't have that kind of response.

[Reverend BTY]

mysticalhamster said:

I have WWE 24/7, and I opened Jonathan Coachman's Christmas gift, and to my surprise it was The classic Hollywood Hogan vs. Rock at Wrestle mania 18.

This made me happy, since I remember seeing this live on PPV and being totally in awe of the crowd.

This then made me very sad, since we have not had a crowd so into a match like they were in Canada that night. Not even the 'mighty' John Cena, Batista, Undertaker, HHH, etc has come close to this.

Todays moronic humanoid fans only pop for Batista since Batista himself looks as if he is going to pop at any moment if you know what I mean. They pop for HHH in my opinion because they feel sad for the man, they see right through his cerebral assassin gimmick, and only like him because if they truly start to dislike him, Vince will jack up the ticket price to the next live show when it comes to their Podunk town, USA.

Undertaker gets pops simply because the fans know that the match will be decent, due to Undertaker's proving talent to entertain them. The gimmick has become a non-factor. It's something the fans expect to be present, nothing more, nothing less. Compare it to baseball. Imagine if fans went to a game involving their favorite team. They announce that because they can, they have decided they will be playing only 6 innings. Clearly the fans go nuts, because they *expect* the game to be 9 innings. If Taker did not come out in his evolved adult emo gimmick, the fans would be pissed.

And then we have John Cena.. For the love of me I cannot explain why the moronic fans cheer for this man. It clearly is not for his 'wrestling' skills, since they are paper thin. This man would not have lasted 15 minutes with a Flair or Steamboat circa 1989. Perhaps the fans like his look, and his physique. Then again, if this were the case people like Val Venis would be popular on this alone. But of course, Val Venis achieved his look via hard gym work. Cena? could be..

Then you have Cena's gimmick. Or should I say lack of gimmick. Perhaps Cena is smarter than me, as are his fans. His lack of a gimmick IS a gimmick they think. My bad!

Ok, rant off. Back to the question at hand.

Let's talk about that night with the rock and hogan. I was able to watch it over and over, rewind, etc and that crowd had to be breathing in some secret WWE 'sweet gas' all night, a special gas that excites fans to pop for everything, throwing out all set 'rules' of heel and face.

For *your chosen gods sake*, they POPPED for both of them AS THEY STARTED THE MATCH and did that routine 'walk around the ring in a circle to get the match started' thing. WTF?

And they were not just popping for both men at the smallest movement they did, they were standing, doing poses, even some jumping out of pure joy. Perhaps the recent Carolinas crowds failed to see this match, or even know of it. They sat there like brain dead Borg drones.

So then Hogan pushes rock down, as the HEEL. Rock flops back selling like mad for Hogan, Hogan starts to pose and flex - crowd within a second totally forgets that 'Hollywood' Hogan, the leader of the nWo, is in the ring fighting the good guy, The Rock. They stand, cheer, pop, etc. Hogan if but for a moment, truly looked stunned - then he quickly realized the fans were behind him and then at that second decided to change his work to very carefully play the crowd as the 'old hero being beaten up by this upstart youngster'. It does not matter that Hogan was yelling heel phrases towards rock, calling him a 'meatball', sounding like Thunderlips from his Rocky appearance.

They don't care, all of a sudden it's the late 80's early 90's. I swore if I looked close enough I could see a few guys popping what looked like vitamins from a pill bottle. The match continues, they heavily boo rock if he even gets within 5 feet of Hogan - let alone touch him.

Rock not being stupid slightly changes his game plan to work as a neo heel, while still portraying himself as a face. But to the fans, he is now the heel, and hogan is the betrayed face. Rock heels it up by grabbing a chair, but the ref takes it away and Hogan drops him. Hogan tries to be the heel by getting the heat of tearing up the announcers table to give the impression that he plans to brawl rocky on it. Hogan than starts to whip Rock with his workout belt, to loud approval.

Then rock gets the belt, looks down at it in a very heel like fashion, and whips the old and broken down fallen hero, Hogan. He then spits on the belt ( I am sure that was planned from the start. Yea right ) and whips him a final time. Around this time the ref bump happens, and a few rock bottoms take place, a sharpshooter,( Which btw made the Canada crowd pop so loud I am sure all of their voices were gone for the next few days.) etc. Hogan starts to hulk up after like 3 rock bottoms or something, only to have rock kick out of his devastating leg drop of doom, which angers the crowd even more.

Ok to wrap it up, the rock ends up winning the match. BUT - watch it again if you can, when Rock wins, ALL OF A FREAKING SUDDEN the fans POP FOR THE FACE again, as a broken Hogan lays on the mat.

W-T-F. Why would they boo the face Rock during most of the match, then within 2 seconds decide they would *as one* pop loud for Rock?? And why did they turn so viciously and quickly on Hogan, the same man they went ape poop over all match?

These are good questions, they are. I won't even get into the crap that Hogan stayed in the ring when he was supposed to go crap, nor the lame nWo beating that the rock should have let happen.

I wrote all of this for one simple reason that I hope you see by now. WHERE ARE THE GOOD FANS? ( or is it, where are the good matches? )

Could it really be that that night was very unique? I mean it was Toronto, they were Canadians, which are in general smarter about wrestling in ways than Americans, and the fact from what I could see the crowd seemed to be a tad older than this new generation of fans brought in by Cena?

Can you feel my pain? I just want to have this kind of response again. It's been too long. Only the WWE right now can get arenas large enough for this kind of fan noise to take place.

Argh!!!

Watch RAW clips from 98. The sheer sound of breaking glass made people go completely apeshit.