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Post by I Graduated Warrior University on Nov 16, 2007 9:27:28 GMT -5
Angle looks like he's about to break apart. didn't notice. in what way? What killed some of the excitement for me was this whole long "Fight for the Right" tourney that was hyped like crazy, and the payoff's a TV match, not even a week after the tourney ended. If they REALLY wanted to build Kaz as a threat they should have held off till the PPV. maybe they didn't REALLY want to build up kaz as a threat. that is one thing people seem to have trouble with. they say why waste this match on impact, why not develop it and make him look like a threat. simple. because they aren't trying to push him into main event right now. they are trying to elevate him to upper mid card. so they simply had little build up and then he shows up in the match and almost beats kurt elevating him. kurt almost got beat by kaz because he was looking past him, and kaz gets bumped to upper mid. you people act like they are trying to find a way to make kaz the king of the company in two weeks time. no, they are simply elevating his position in the company. What he said. Also, WWE did the same thing with Cena back in 2003
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Post by toodarkmark on Nov 16, 2007 13:17:51 GMT -5
It wasnt a classic, but it was alright. I enjoyed it.
Most of Angle's finishes have been weird, rushed, and confusing. Like the Sting finish. Some of Joe ones too. I think TNA suffers from anti-climactic finishes at times. That seems like a booking-agents problem. I remember when Joe pinned Scott Steiner and it just seemed weird to me. Its got something to do with selling. Like a super move gets a kick out and then a weird small move gets the pin. Oh well.
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Post by Arthur Digby Stamp on Nov 16, 2007 13:23:03 GMT -5
I think it was a mistake to have Angle kick out of the Flux Capacitor. That move should have stayed protected, at least for the time being.
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Hiroshi Hase
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Nov 16, 2007 13:24:37 GMT -5
I think it was a mistake to have Angle kick out of the Flux Capacitor. That move should have stayed protected, at least for the time being. You may have a point there, I would've had him by the ropes and have Karen put the foot under or on the rope to save him, but still it was a good match and I liked the show a lot as unlike Raw I actually stay tuned throughout.
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comahan
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Post by comahan on Nov 16, 2007 13:25:04 GMT -5
I think it was a very good tv match that served its purpose of making kaz look good. I marked when he kicked out of the Low Blow / Olympic Slam combo.
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erisi236
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Post by erisi236 on Nov 16, 2007 13:29:41 GMT -5
I was totally stunned when Kaz kicked out of that low blow/Slam combo.
I thought that match made Kaz look like a Million bucks, I really hope he stays in the upper-card.
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Hiroshi Hase
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Nov 16, 2007 13:31:11 GMT -5
It sorta reminded me of Angle/Cena from 02, where Angle barely got by and at the end Cena made the "I was this close to beating you" sign with his hands, much like what Kaz did last night.
I'm sure he'll have other opportunities in the future, and this'll do him a lot of good, more than being in that jobber stable.
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Post by poi zen rana on Nov 16, 2007 13:46:47 GMT -5
for those that were underwhelmed by the match, for what reasons were you underwhelmed?
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Nov 16, 2007 14:48:57 GMT -5
It sorta reminded me of Angle/Cena from 02, where Angle barely got by and at the end Cena made the "I was this close to beating you" sign with his hands, much like what Kaz did last night. I'm sure he'll have other opportunities in the future, and this'll do him a lot of good, more than being in that jobber stable. You know, I was reminded of that, too.
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The F'N Captain
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Post by The F'N Captain on Nov 16, 2007 16:45:43 GMT -5
Angle looks like he's about to break apart. didn't notice. in what way? What killed some of the excitement for me was this whole long "Fight for the Right" tourney that was hyped like crazy, and the payoff's a TV match, not even a week after the tourney ended. If they REALLY wanted to build Kaz as a threat they should have held off till the PPV. maybe they didn't REALLY want to build up kaz as a threat. that is one thing people seem to have trouble with. they say why waste this match on impact, why not develop it and make him look like a threat. simple. because they aren't trying to push him into main event right now. they are trying to elevate him to upper mid card. so they simply had little build up and then he shows up in the match and almost beats kurt elevating him. kurt almost got beat by kaz because he was looking past him, and kaz gets bumped to upper mid. you people act like they are trying to find a way to make kaz the king of the company in two weeks time. no, they are simply elevating his position in the company. Kinda edited my post there to just take what you wanted, anyway moving on. I am not mad at Kaz losing, by no means, in fact it would be insane to have him go over Angle right now with a stocked mainevent scene. I just think for the weeks that TNA put into this whole "Fight for the Right" thing they rushed it. When I say make Kaz look like a threat I should have reworded it. If like Christian won it, it would have been a PPV main event. In Kayfabe they might be able to gloss over it, but out of Kayfabe it comes off for what it is, Kaz can't headline a PPV so he gets a tv match. I'm not so much unpleased with Kaz or the match, as I am with the hype for the tournament and how THAT paid off. The winner of the tourney should have had a PPV match, no matter who won. Trust me I don't expect Kaz to suddenly take Sting's place because he got one match with Angle, I just think it made the concept of the tournament seem weak. Compare it to the MITB,the MITB can be cashed in on any show or PPV but the MITB match is ALWAYS a PPV match.
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Post by poi zen rana on Nov 16, 2007 17:12:04 GMT -5
i just don't agree with the precedent that tournament pay offs have to be on ppv. just because tons of other tournaments do doesn't mean it has to be that way. he won a match with the champ and took it the next card. i guess it just doesn't bother me.
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Nov 16, 2007 17:13:46 GMT -5
i just don't agree with the precedent that tournament pay offs have to be on ppv. just because tons of other tournaments do doesn't mean it has to be that way. he won a match with the champ and took it the next card. i guess it just doesn't bother me. I agree.
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Post by royboy8 on Nov 16, 2007 17:17:00 GMT -5
i just don't agree with the precedent that tournament pay offs have to be on ppv. just because tons of other tournaments do doesn't mean it has to be that way. he won a match with the champ and took it the next card. i guess it just doesn't bother me. Remember the Gold Rush Tourney? I dont think that was a ppv payoff and it was pretty critcally acclaimed here. So that kind of supports your opinion.... If the Gold Rush winner did get a ppv title shot, forget any mention of this post ever lol
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The F'N Captain
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Post by The F'N Captain on Nov 16, 2007 17:17:51 GMT -5
i just don't agree with the precedent that tournament pay offs have to be on ppv. just because tons of other tournaments do doesn't mean it has to be that way. he won a match with the champ and took it the next card. i guess it just doesn't bother me. They just hyped it heavily. There's been many tourneys that don't get as much hype and that's fine, but the way TNA pushed it it seemed like a biger deal than how it was paid off.
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Post by Adam Pacman Khan (akkilla) on Nov 16, 2007 17:20:17 GMT -5
Match was awesome IMO one of the best TV matches i've seen since in a while, and i marked for the ending as well.
Only thing is i do wish the match had more time.
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Post by big nasty on Nov 16, 2007 18:09:47 GMT -5
really good match. what bothered me about the ending, though, was if it was angle digging into his amateur background to lock up kaz out of nowhere, whats to say he cant do it at any point in ht e match? if he can out-wrestle kaz like that, then angle is obviously superior to kaz, so whats the point? its the same reason i cant stand "roll-up" ending to matches, you see them three times during the match, why did it work now, just because the guy was "distracted"?
i would have preferred to see angle hit a suplex or angle slam out of nowhere, get a win, and sell the match by just laying in the ring next to kaz, both men exhausted by a hard fought match. to me that would have shown that angle had to really go all out to get by kaz, and just barely at that.
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 16, 2007 18:17:43 GMT -5
really good match. what bothered me about the ending, though, was if it was angle digging into his amateur background to lock up kaz out of nowhere, whats to say he cant do it at any point in ht e match? if he can out-wrestle kaz like that, then angle is obviously superior to kaz, so whats the point? its the same reason i cant stand "roll-up" ending to matches, you see them three times during the match, why did it work now, just because the guy was "distracted"? i would have preferred to see angle hit a suplex or angle slam out of nowhere, get a win, and sell the match by just laying in the ring next to kaz, both men exhausted by a hard fought match. to me that would have shown that angle had to really go all out to get by kaz, and just barely at that. Angle rarely has to turn to his true amateur background to get a win. It's not something he often does. He's confident enough (read: arrogant) in his pro wrestling abilities that he doesn't feel he has to spend time pulling up moves that won him gold in 1996. But Kaz was enough of a surprise and a challenge that he went to the well, took Kaz by surprise, and it worked. Besides, that's why roll-ups and stuff work: they're meant as surprises to the guys they happen to, or they're done in such an effective way that the opponent simply can't break the pin. In this case, it was the former; Kaz DID kick out, but right after the 3, because he couldn't have guessed Angle would have gone for that move. Angle, in storyline, probably had no intention of ever using that pinning combination, but he did out of desperation after eating a Flux Capacitor.
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The OP
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Post by The OP on Nov 16, 2007 18:19:25 GMT -5
I didn't see the match, but when I saw the title I thought "you're asking people on the internet? The answer is obviously no, you could not possibly have been the only one".
I didn't really mean that to be as snarky as it sounds, that's just honestly what popped in my head. I'm sorry I missed the match though, I'd like to be able to weigh in further.
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Post by lildude8218 on Nov 16, 2007 18:23:44 GMT -5
it was essentially Jarrett/Lethal all over again
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Post by big nasty on Nov 16, 2007 18:24:38 GMT -5
really good match. what bothered me about the ending, though, was if it was angle digging into his amateur background to lock up kaz out of nowhere, whats to say he cant do it at any point in ht e match? if he can out-wrestle kaz like that, then angle is obviously superior to kaz, so whats the point? its the same reason i cant stand "roll-up" ending to matches, you see them three times during the match, why did it work now, just because the guy was "distracted"? i would have preferred to see angle hit a suplex or angle slam out of nowhere, get a win, and sell the match by just laying in the ring next to kaz, both men exhausted by a hard fought match. to me that would have shown that angle had to really go all out to get by kaz, and just barely at that. Angle rarely has to turn to his true amateur background to get a win. It's not something he often does. He's confident enough (read: arrogant) in his pro wrestling abilities that he doesn't feel he has to spend time pulling up moves that won him gold in 1996. But Kaz was enough of a surprise and a challenge that he went to the well, took Kaz by surprise, and it worked. Besides, that's why roll-ups and stuff work: they're meant as surprises to the guys they happen to, or they're done in such an effective way that the opponent simply can't break the pin. In this case, it was the former; Kaz DID kick out, but right after the 3, because he couldn't have guessed Angle would have gone for that move. Angle, in storyline, probably had no intention of ever using that pinning combination, but he did out of desperation after eating a Flux Capacitor. i get what you're saying, guess im trying to reconcile logic with kayfabe, hehe i was just a little disappointed with a flash ending in what had been a good match.
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