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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Feb 2, 2008 16:44:52 GMT -5
Dude....Chris Carter will get in eventually, just not his first year. He may have to wait like Art Monk did. I may be a football dunce but isn't Carter one of the top WR's who ever played? Very good yes, great maybe. I really think that his time in Miami and Philly may have hurt him this year.
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domrep
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Post by domrep on Feb 2, 2008 16:47:14 GMT -5
Monk is finally in. He was Jerry Rice before Jerry Rice was Jerry Rice.
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Post by gsguy on Feb 2, 2008 16:47:28 GMT -5
Say, why isn't Ryan Leaf in? (dodges tomatoes) Stop throwing tomatoes Mr. Leaf ;D
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 16:48:28 GMT -5
I may be a football dunce but isn't Carter one of the top WR's who ever played? Very good yes, great maybe. I really think that his time in Miami and Philly may have hurt him this year. To be quite honest, I think Carter got screwed by politicking. I'm sure the supporters for Monk somehow forced the other HOF voters to elect Monk. At least, thats a reason why Irvin got shut out for 3 years. Carter will get in next year, though. The real surprise though was the no-sell of the Senior Committee's picks. That hasn't happened in more than a decade, I believe.
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 16:50:41 GMT -5
With Monk in, I say the HOF voters will split between Ray Guy, Bob Kuchenburg, and Derrick Thomas as their "cause celebs"
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 16:51:49 GMT -5
"Cris Carter, Richard Dent, Bob Kuechenberg, Randall McDaniel and Derrick Thomas made the first cut, but they didn't make it to the final list."
That's what an ESPN blog is claiming.
Someday Bobby K and Thomas, someday....
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Seth Drakin of Monster Crap
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Post by Seth Drakin of Monster Crap on Feb 2, 2008 16:53:29 GMT -5
"Cris Carter, Richard Dent, Bob Kuechenberg, Randall McDaniel and Derrick Thomas made the first cut, but they didn't make it to the final list." That's what an ESPN blog is claiming. Someday Bobby K and Thomas, someday.... That is correct as it was announced in the press conference that they were the last to be left off the list.
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Seth Drakin of Monster Crap
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Post by Seth Drakin of Monster Crap on Feb 2, 2008 16:55:07 GMT -5
I think Carter's past drug problems while in Philly cost him. Same thing happened with Irvin.
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 16:56:03 GMT -5
"Redskins' Green, Monk headline HOF class; Tagliabue shut out again" (AP)
PHOENIX -- It was a Hall of Fame day for the Washington Redskins, with Art Monk and Darrell Green elected to the shrine Saturday. Former commissioner Paul Tagliabue failed to get in for the second straight year.
Also voted in were New England linebacker Andre Tippett, San Diego/San Francisco defensive end Fred Dean, Minnesota/Denver tackle Gary Zimmerman and senior committee choice, Kansas City cornerback Emmitt Thomas.
In his eighth year of eligibility, Monk finally was chosen. He concluded his career after the 1995 season with Philadelphia, but spent 13 years with the Redskins as one of the NFL's premier receivers. Monk held records for most consecutive games with a reception (164) and career catches (820). Both have been surpassed, but Monk didn't play in as wide-open an era on offense as many other receivers. He was one of the most consistent possession and third-down receivers in the league throughout his 14 pro seasons.
Green, one of the NFL's speediest and most skilled cornerbacks for two decades, spent his entire career (1983-2002) with the Redskins. He holds the record for consecutive seasons with an interception (19), and had 54 picks for 621 yards and six TDs. A member of the 1990s All-Decade team, Green made seven Pro Bowls.
The other player in his first year of eligibility, receiver Cris Carter, was not elected. Carter finished his 15-year career second on the career list in receptions and TD catches.
Inductions will be at the Pro Football Hall of Game in Canton, Ohio on Aug. 2.
Perhaps the most surprising outcome was Tagliabue again not getting enough support.
In his 17 years as commissioner, the NFL experienced no labor stoppages, while its revenues from TV contracts skyrocketed. There also were expansions to Jacksonville, Charlotte, Cleveland and Houston under his watch, and several teams moved into new stadiums, many of them built with public funds.
But many, including some reporters on the 44-member selection committee, found Tagliabue unapproachable and uncooperative.
Also failiing to get in were Redskins guard Russ Grimm, Buffalo Bills receiver Andre Reed, Oakland Raiders punter Ray Guy, Denver Broncos linebacker Randy Gradishar, Chicago Bears defensive end Richard Dent, Miami Dolphins guard Bob Kuechenberg, Vikings guard Randall McDaniel, and Kansas City Chiefs linebacker Derrick Thomas.
Senior committee nominee Marshall Goldberg was not elected, either.
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Off-topic, but watching Redskins Green and Monk openly talking to each other in the press conference, with fellow Skin, and Super Bowl MVP Doug Williams entering the building as well...
I'm sure many Skins fans are marking hard as hell right now.
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Post by Mr. Backlund on Feb 2, 2008 16:56:31 GMT -5
Don't worry, Cris Carter will get a very vocal publicity campaign to ensure he's in. It apparently can make people confuse above average to very good players with Hall of Famers, so it'll definately work for him. Hey, it even works for those who don't belong in there, but I can't hold it against Monk. A lot of people who really don't belong in there came before him and more will follow him.
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Post by gsguy on Feb 2, 2008 16:57:09 GMT -5
I think Carter's past drug problems while in Philly cost him. Same thing happened with Irvin. That would explain it. Didn't realize he was a druggie.
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 16:58:14 GMT -5
Don't worry, Cris Carter will get a very vocal publicity campaign to ensure he's in. It apparently can make people confuse above average to very good players with Hall of Famers, so it'll definately work for him. Hey, it even works for those who don't belong in there, but I can't hold it against Monk. A lot of people who really don't belong in there came before him and more will follow him. My question to you about Monk is this: Would the Skins have won 3 Super Bowls without Monk? Case Closed.
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Post by Mr. Backlund on Feb 2, 2008 17:03:00 GMT -5
Don't worry, Cris Carter will get a very vocal publicity campaign to ensure he's in. It apparently can make people confuse above average to very good players with Hall of Famers, so it'll definately work for him. Hey, it even works for those who don't belong in there, but I can't hold it against Monk. A lot of people who really don't belong in there came before him and more will follow him. My question to you about Monk is this: Would the Skins have won 3 Super Bowls without Monk? Case Closed. Don't get me wrong, Monk's a great guy and a very good player, but how many times was he the focal point of the team? Add in the fact 2 of the 3 rings came in strike years, where a lot of top-level teams were sitting at home because the scrubs that took their place sunk them in too deep of a hole to rebound after things were settled between the two Unions. I can without a doubt say they'd win the one against the Bills (no strike that year) without Monk. Again, he lead in any statistics only once in his career, was in the top ten only three times in his career, three Pro-Bowls and was never the main weapon on the Skins offense in championship years. I like the guy and would take him on my team in a heartbeat, but I really think you draw a line between players that were consistently good over a very long career and players who are HOF'ers, who changed the way the game was played, redefined the position or were just flat out amazing for an entire career with a few rings to back it up. Monk obviously was not the first two and you're fighting an uphill battle if you want to state he was flat out amazing (at least statistically, which is all that you can really measure a player on in this kind of event) for his career.
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 17:06:16 GMT -5
I think Carter's past drug problems while in Philly cost him. Same thing happened with Irvin. That would explain it. Didn't realize he was a druggie. Just to correct, he was a druggie when he first began his career...and in fact, thats why he got cut from the Eagles. With the Vikings, he cleaned up...and became a role model player and citizen. It's not like he only "cleaned up" after he quit ball like, oh I don't know, Irvin?
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Seth Drakin of Monster Crap
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Post by Seth Drakin of Monster Crap on Feb 2, 2008 17:14:24 GMT -5
All I was saying was the Carter's drug past, which he has definately cleaned up from, may have been a huge reason he was left off.
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 17:17:54 GMT -5
All I was saying was the Carter's drug past, which he has definately cleaned up from, may have been a huge reason he was left off. I doubt it, quite honestly. I believe the cocaine did keep Irvin out a few years, because while he was winning Super Bowls and catching balls for America's Team, he was arrested quite a few times, and most of them narcotic related. But Carter? The drugs was only in his first few years, before he became a major star and All-Pro Wide-Receiver. It's like holding against Johnny Unitas because he was a semi-pro QB for some time before the Colts signed him. It's little-known data that isn't as closely associated with the star. Hell, I didn't know Carter was a former druggie until he highlighjted it on INSIDE THE NFL. But then again, maybe it did factor into him getting knocked out this year. My theory is, politicking screwed him. Hell, there was many cries that no WR should go into the HOF until Monk got elected....and why Irvin, Reed, and now Carter waited and still wait.
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Post by gsguy on Feb 2, 2008 17:20:48 GMT -5
That would explain it. Didn't realize he was a druggie. Just to correct, he was a druggie when he first began his career...and in fact, thats why he got cut from the Eagles. With the Vikings, he cleaned up...and became a role model player and citizen. It's not like he only "cleaned up" after he quit ball like, oh I don't know, Irvin? Gotcha.
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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Feb 2, 2008 18:12:41 GMT -5
Notables who become eligible next year:
RB Larry Centers WR Antonio Freeman TE Shannon Sharpe DE Bruce Smith DB Rob Woodson
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rra
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Post by rra on Feb 2, 2008 18:19:06 GMT -5
Notables who become eligible next year: RB Larry Centers WR Antonio Freeman TE Shannon Sharpe DE Bruce Smith DB Rob Woodson One would think that Sharpe, Smith, and Woodson would get in...they certainly deserve it.... But who knows.
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Feb 3, 2008 1:35:03 GMT -5
All I was saying was the Carter's drug past, which he has definately cleaned up from, may have been a huge reason he was left off. I doubt it, quite honestly. I believe the cocaine did keep Irvin out a few years, because while he was winning Super Bowls and catching balls for America's Team, he was arrested quite a few times, and most of them narcotic related. But Carter? The drugs was only in his first few years, before he became a major star and All-Pro Wide-Receiver. It's like holding against Johnny Unitas because he was a semi-pro QB for some time before the Colts signed him. It's little-known data that isn't as closely associated with the star. Hell, I didn't know Carter was a former druggie until he highlighjted it on INSIDE THE NFL. But then again, maybe it did factor into him getting knocked out this year. My theory is, politicking screwed him. Hell, there was many cries that no WR should go into the HOF until Monk got elected....and why Irvin, Reed, and now Carter waited and still wait. Michael Irvin got arrested one year before the election which killed him (though it might have been his 2nd year and I'm not sure who got in his first year) I'm pissed off about this Chris Carter. There seems to be a deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeepppppppppp Vikings biased in the HOF voting (at least it seems that way) I guess catching Touchdowns is not enough to get in.
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