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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Feb 23, 2008 18:05:49 GMT -5
It's not really the same thing at all.
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salTy
El Dandy
Posts: 8,425
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Post by salTy on Feb 23, 2008 18:18:47 GMT -5
Rock only wrestled full time from 97-00. After Wrestlemania 17 in 2001 was when he started taking his hiatus' for movies. Austin started off in like 1990. Yeah Rocky came back to "save" us in 02 for what 2 months when he cut this promo? Then came back in 03 for about 3 months, then 04 maybe a month? Give me a break Austin gave so much more than Rock ever did to the business. As soon as Austin came back in 2003 he put the Rock over so he hardly has a problem jobbing. I still have a problem with that being Austin's last match because it was not the way he should have gone out. YOu are forgetting that Austin walked out not once, BUT TWICE. He walked out becasue he refused to work with Scott Hall, and then Lesnar. The Rock > Austin in terms of professionalism. Um, he worked with Scott Hall at Wrestlemania, dude. How is that refusal? His second walk-out was refusing to job to Coach.
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salTy
El Dandy
Posts: 8,425
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Post by salTy on Feb 23, 2008 18:34:38 GMT -5
I guess people misunderstood what I meant by this. I was pointing out how he keeps putting over how he'll be there til he's 80 and anyone who didn't want to be there could leave. The irony was that it was the Rock who left. I thought my saying I don't begrudge him leaving for Hollywood was pretty self explanatory. I doubt the speech was The Rock's idea to begin with.
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Post by Benjamin Boone on Feb 23, 2008 18:36:22 GMT -5
Ah, it must be that time of the month to start criticizing Stone Cold for the whole walk out. No matter what it seems, people will always rag on Austin for the walk out. I'll try to put things in perspective...
-Do you realize how crappy 2002 was in terms of booking for the WWE? There have been awesome matches from 2002, but storylines not so much. nWo losing steam in a matter of weeks, Katie Vick, the Jericho/HHH feud (that involved Stephanie's DOG of all things), etc. -The thinking that Brock needed to be fed as many people as possible to build up. Austin vs. Brock would have been a monumental PPV match, but not an 8 minute King of the Ring squash.
As for the Rock, he is the perfect success story from pro wrestling. He accomplished everything there is to accomplish in a matter of a few years, had many classic matches, and a charismatic prescence that can be rivaled by Hulk Hogan. I guarantee you if he was still wrestling today you would not look back on him fondly and that he was "wearing out his welcome". Yet, he goes to Hollywood, makes some successful movies overall, and people rag he is a "sell out"? Selling out that he has an opportunity to makes millions and take more time off? The fact that WWE let his contract expire in 2005 without being informed sure has to weigh on his mind also. Regardless, especially after how wrestling has been viewed in the past year, I am sure Rock is glad he retired when he did.
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Jack
Team Rocket
Posts: 903
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Post by Jack on Feb 23, 2008 18:59:36 GMT -5
Thing about Austin is that not showing up is the ultimate no-no especially when you've got fans who've bought tickets to see you, it's just not fair. Even if you go there and stedfastly refuse to work an angle until it's changed then you do that, but you at least turn up. I'm sure everyone from Flair to Hogan and anyone with sway backstage inbetween has turned up at an arena and not liked what was going down and demanded a change.
Just not turning up IMO is quite unforgiveable.
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Post by Mongo & Pepe: Back in Black on Feb 23, 2008 18:59:54 GMT -5
In 20/20 hindsight the video seems awkward. But the reality is that life is not just in black and white but occasionally throws in shades of grey. Today, I might be content with my job but tomorrow a better offer and circumstance may come that I may never have forseen. Loyalty is an admirable and great virtue but in the real world it is not like that black and white concept but a shade of grey. Exactly. Just because you're happy with your job one day doesn't mean you'll still be happy a few months or years down the line.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,127
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Post by Mecca on Feb 23, 2008 21:58:51 GMT -5
YOu are forgetting that Austin walked out not once, BUT TWICE. He walked out becasue he refused to work with Scott Hall, and then Lesnar. The Rock > Austin in terms of professionalism. Um, he worked with Scott Hall at Wrestlemania, dude. How is that refusal? His second walk-out was refusing to job to Coach. He worked the match with Hall but basically refused to do business with him if you listen to anyone talk about that. Several have said the original intentions of that Mania was to get the NWO over and then they changed it all to appease Austins ego because he was refusing to lose. I know Hall/Nash and some others said the original plan was for Hall to go over Austin and then for Rock to win but the NWO to take out Rock and end the show standing tall.....it didn't happen because Austin pretty much refused to work the match if he wasn't going over.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Feb 23, 2008 22:05:38 GMT -5
He worked the match with Hall but basically refused to do business with him if you listen to anyone talk about that. Several have said the original intentions of that Mania was to get the NWO over and then they changed it all to appease Austins ego because he was refusing to lose. I know Hall/Nash and some others said the original plan was for Hall to go over Austin and then for Rock to win but the NWO to take out Rock and end the show standing tall.....it didn't happen because Austin pretty much refused to work the match if he wasn't going over. Ya, I remember hearing that too. Austin owning Hall like he did killed off any credibility as a threat that the nWo had.
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Reverend BTY
Hank Scorpio
Christian Troy: God's Gift
Posts: 7,206
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Post by Reverend BTY on Feb 23, 2008 22:14:03 GMT -5
I guess people misunderstood what I meant by this. I was pointing out how he keeps putting over how he'll be there til he's 80 and anyone who didn't want to be there could leave. The irony was that it was the Rock who left. I thought my saying I don't begrudge him leaving for Hollywood was pretty self explanatory. Although wacky how it turned out, it's not suprising. I mean this was just a promo Vince probably wanted him to do to make the people not feel like they've been ripped off. After his role in Mummy 2, I expected him to leave for Hollywood anyway. As far as I can tell, he's done perfectly fine for himself.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,127
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Post by Mecca on Feb 23, 2008 22:17:20 GMT -5
He worked the match with Hall but basically refused to do business with him if you listen to anyone talk about that. Several have said the original intentions of that Mania was to get the NWO over and then they changed it all to appease Austins ego because he was refusing to lose. I know Hall/Nash and some others said the original plan was for Hall to go over Austin and then for Rock to win but the NWO to take out Rock and end the show standing tall.....it didn't happen because Austin pretty much refused to work the match if he wasn't going over. Ya, I remember hearing that too. Austin owning Hall like he did killed off any credibility as a threat that the nWo had. They were the 2 biggest stars but their ideas of how to do business were so opposite..Austin repeatedly refused to work with guys he didn't think "were on his level" I'm pretty sure everyone remembers the Jarrett thing also.. Then you had the Rock who would work with and put anyone over at any time...
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Feb 23, 2008 22:17:22 GMT -5
Although wacky how it turned out, it's not suprising. I mean this was just a promo Vince probably wanted him to do to make the people not feel like they've been ripped off. After his role in Mummy 2, I expected him to leave for Hollywood anyway. As far as I can tell, he's done perfectly fine for himself. The Rock has done GREAT for himself. He got like 10 mil. for his first couple movies. He still gets 2-5 mil. a movie, and that's likely to have gone up seeing as Game Plan was such a huge hit. Another hit like that, and he's gonna be getting some great offers and great money
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Post by -Lithium- on Feb 23, 2008 22:38:45 GMT -5
Its kinda funny that if Austin did lose to Lesnar, no one would remember it, but since he didnt, everyone does...
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Feb 23, 2008 22:41:37 GMT -5
They were the 2 biggest stars but their ideas of how to do business were so opposite..Austin repeatedly refused to work with guys he didn't think "were on his level" I'm pretty sure everyone remembers the Jarrett thing also.. Then you had the Rock who would work with and put anyone over at any time... Didn't Austin also refuse to drop the belt to Hunter at SummerSlam 99, which is why Foley got the one day title reign? I maybe wrong about it but I'd swear I heard that before
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Post by Da (No Sold) 7-1-3 Itch on Feb 23, 2008 22:45:52 GMT -5
It's funny how people whine and complain that a certain Superstar "Needs To Get Off My TV" and "Their Act Is Tired" and that he is "A Washup Jobber Who Has Overstayed their Welcome"
Yet we constantly get attacks against Rock for pretty much making a career in the movie industry after he saw that he did everything he could in wrestling.
Did Rock provide memorable moments? Yes Did he provide entertainment? Yes Did he have memorable matches? Yes Was he one of the best characters ever? Probably Was a a proffesional? Yes Did he put his body through years of pain just so fans could enjoy a few moments of laughter or entertainment? Yes Did he really need to stay after all the accomplishments and all the things that he did? No
So why is it so hard for some to get over their hate of the guy?
Dunno
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,552
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Feb 23, 2008 22:49:11 GMT -5
They were the 2 biggest stars but their ideas of how to do business were so opposite..Austin repeatedly refused to work with guys he didn't think "were on his level" I'm pretty sure everyone remembers the Jarrett thing also.. Then you had the Rock who would work with and put anyone over at any time... Didn't Austin also refuse to drop the belt to Hunter at SummerSlam 99, which is why Foley got the one day title reign? I maybe wrong about it but I'd swear I heard that before That's right. But Austin rarely gets any shit for it. Hunter on the other hand.....
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Post by kokakola on Feb 23, 2008 23:15:21 GMT -5
The funny thing is; The Rock left 3 months after when he lost to Brock Lesnar at SummerSlam
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Post by dh03grad on Feb 24, 2008 0:08:02 GMT -5
The funny thing is; The Rock left 3 months after when he lost to Brock Lesnar at SummerSlam What makes it funny? He dropped the belt and put him over clean on his way out. The same guy Austin refused to face.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Feb 24, 2008 0:22:13 GMT -5
What makes it funny? He dropped the belt and put him over clean on his way out. The same guy Austin refused to face. To be fair, Austin didn't flat out refuse to face Lesnar, he refused to face him in a unadvertised, throw away TV match. He felt it should be built up and saved for PPV. And he had a good point, he just didn't handle the situation properly
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
Posts: 30,755
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Feb 24, 2008 7:51:44 GMT -5
Its kinda funny that if Austin did lose to Lesnar, no one would remember it, but since he didnt, everyone does... I disagree, I think people would remember it and I don't think it would just be some random match where the commentators wouldn't bring it up again or anything. When Hogan he lost to him on TV, and they played it up big time in the weeks leading into and after Summerslam.
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Post by Loki on Feb 24, 2008 8:14:57 GMT -5
I don't begrudge the Rock for leaving... actually the least I see him on WWE TV, the better it is.
He wanted to go Hollywood, fine. Good for him.
I'm not so sold on his "putting guys over" anyway, because if you're been on and off the roster for the better part of 2-3 years, it doesn't really matter whom you lose to. You're not a vital part of the show, so your appearences are more or less "special attractions" that may or may not affect the whole product.
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