Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Oct 20, 2008 1:49:43 GMT -5
At this point I have to believe he's pissed someone off. I refuse to believe that anyone on creative has someone with that much talent on roster and can find nothing better for him than this. And no, he didn't attack HHH with a screwdriver. Or did he? I doubt it. If he pissed someone off, they'd make no effort to aknowledge his losing streak, and wouldn't give him mic time. I'm sure they're going somewhere with it.
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Post by wrestlecrapcrap on Oct 20, 2008 8:01:47 GMT -5
The amount of people that think what happens on screen is a direct result of what is happening off screen astounds me.
It's a process. Everyone has a spot. Right now Big Show and Kozlov are above MVP. They need someone to lose to the faces so that those faces can lose to Kozlov for example. MVP is that guy right now.
It's all about timing. If everything builds towards Wrestlemania, they need to have enough opponents lined up for the top heels and faces so they can be cemented in the spots that they need to be in for the biggest show of the year. It's not about deciding to push someone and randomly stopping because they don't like them anymore. MVP is taking losses so Jeff Hardy and HHH can take wins, and that's how it should be.
MVP's time will come, without question. He's nowhere near getting to be released. He's simply spending some time down the card so others can have some time higher up, like Kennedy has been all year. Kennedy was lower down because they were pushing Jeff. MVP is lower down because Big Show, Kozlov and Edge when he gets back will be above him. When they have done all they can with Kozlov and Big Show, then it will be MVP's turn.
It's all about extracting the most value out of your star power, and not constantly chopping and changing so that the star power becomes meaningless. They will milk each star for all they are worth, and then change it up. That's how it should work. For this to work, you need people to lose.
It's not about not liking someone and so 'stopping their push' because it's not even about that. It's about your spot. MVP is in a spot, and is being used absolutely correctly for it. The issue people have isn't with the push, it's with his spot. If he was in a higher spot, he'd be getting bigger and more wins. They are using Kozlov higher up now though, so MVP is lower, and there isn't a problem with that.
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Post by Avalanche Alvarez on Oct 20, 2008 9:26:47 GMT -5
He'll be all right. He's coming out with his own line of screwdrivers for Home Depot. MVP Screwdrivers W/ The Baller Grip for easy handling! "Do the job right with an MVP screwdriver!"
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
Posts: 4,804
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Post by randomranter on Oct 20, 2008 13:05:50 GMT -5
The amount of people that think what happens on screen is a direct result of what is happening off screen astounds me. It's a process. Everyone has a spot. Right now Big Show and Kozlov are above MVP. They need someone to lose to the faces so that those faces can lose to Kozlov for example. MVP is that guy right now. It's all about timing. If everything builds towards Wrestlemania, they need to have enough opponents lined up for the top heels and faces so they can be cemented in the spots that they need to be in for the biggest show of the year. It's not about deciding to push someone and randomly stopping because they don't like them anymore. MVP is taking losses so Jeff Hardy and HHH can take wins, and that's how it should be. MVP's time will come, without question. He's nowhere near getting to be released. He's simply spending some time down the card so others can have some time higher up, like Kennedy has been all year. Kennedy was lower down because they were pushing Jeff. MVP is lower down because Big Show, Kozlov and Edge when he gets back will be above him. When they have done all they can with Kozlov and Big Show, then it will be MVP's turn. It's all about extracting the most value out of your star power, and not constantly chopping and changing so that the star power becomes meaningless. They will milk each star for all they are worth, and then change it up. That's how it should work. For this to work, you need people to lose. It's not about not liking someone and so 'stopping their push' because it's not even about that. It's about your spot. MVP is in a spot, and is being used absolutely correctly for it. The issue people have isn't with the push, it's with his spot. If he was in a higher spot, he'd be getting bigger and more wins. They are using Kozlov higher up now though, so MVP is lower, and there isn't a problem with that. There's a term for that. It's called "Jobber to the Stars". With few exceptions, once a wrestler is in that role, he almost never comes back out of it. And in some cases, they end up becoming just plain "Jobber". We're not talking the occasional loss here and there. I don't think anyone would have a problem with that. It's the fact that MVP is doing nothing but losing, and has been losing consistently for *months*. And look at it from the fans' point of view. They don't see a guy who is in this "spot" or that "spot". They see a guy who is doing virtually nothing but losing. And after a while, they stop caring because they know that the guy is going to do nothing but lose. Take a look at Kane, for example. Kane isn't entirely a JTTS, but at the same time, he's not taken seriously as a main-event contender. If Kane is in a main-event PPV match, you know he's going to lose. And if he's one of multiple participants (such as a triple threat) with two legit main eventers, you know that Kane is the one who's going to take the fall. As a result, many fans have long since stopped taking Kane seriously as a main-eventer, even when they make an effort to elevate him back into the main event scene. The same thing will happen to MVP if this keeps up for much longer. After a while, fans are going to see a match featuring MVP vs. whoever, and they're going to know MVP is going to lose. So why are they going to keep watching? We've already been down this road a number of times: Having a guy booked to constantly lose will NOT get him over, and will only hinder any future attempts at rebuilding credibility in the future. As another point, you do realize that there *is* politics in wrestling, right? Always has been, always will be. One of the reasons WCW folded was because of backstage politics, and the company's refusal to push younger stars, or for that matter anybody that the upper tier of wrestlers (Nash, Hogan, etc.) didn't like. If you were on their shitlist, you were depushed and jobbed out. The Kliq did the same thing for years in the WWF in the 90's. And if Vince doesn't like you (for both personal and/or professional reasons), what do you think your chances are of getting any decent push? Many speculate that Michelle McCool has her spot because of her relationship with the Undertaker, despite being one of the least over women on the roster. Heck, even HHH was jobbed out for a while after the Curtain Call incident. The list goes on and on, but you get my point -- politics can and do influence if and when you get pushed, and how hard. It's not the only factor, but it does play a role. And it's very well possible that one reason that he's so low on the totem pole right now is because of backstage issues.
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Post by Loki on Oct 20, 2008 16:07:56 GMT -5
There's a term for that. It's called "Jobber to the Stars". With few exceptions, once a wrestler is in that role, he almost never comes back out of it. And in some cases, they end up becoming just plain "Jobber". We're not talking the occasional loss here and there. I don't think anyone would have a problem with that. It's the fact that MVP is doing nothing but losing, and has been losing consistently for *months*. Pal, let me introduce to a man who had been classified as WWE's biggest JTTS of the decade... Ready? CHRIS JERICHO[/size] Could you name a high profile feud Jericho had come out on top since his loss to Triple H at WMXVIII? Or even a feud he kinda came out on top? By the time he was used as fodder to Cena, Jericho had been in the JTTS limbo for like 4 years already, working as reliable midcard champion or as luxury filler for main events. Then he got fired, came back and jobbed a lil while again, before getting THE push of his life. So, after like 7 years of JTTS, Jericho is (finally) getting what he deserved. It's almost universally accepted Kane DOESN'T want a main event push. Had WWE decided to give him one anyway, it'd take just a couple of weeks to build him back as a legit threat for a World Title. Fans care about some wrestlers, regardless of where they're on the card. Fans don't care about some others, regardless how how hard they are pushed I call BS on that. It's just that Kozlov has taken MVP's spot as heel third man in the Jeff v Triple H storyline.
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Post by wrestlecrapcrap on Oct 20, 2008 16:58:35 GMT -5
There's a term for that. It's called "Jobber to the Stars". With few exceptions, once a wrestler is in that role, he almost never comes back out of it. And in some cases, they end up becoming just plain "Jobber". We're not talking the occasional loss here and there. I don't think anyone would have a problem with that. It's the fact that MVP is doing nothing but losing, and has been losing consistently for *months*. Pal, let me introduce to a man who had been classified as WWE's biggest JTTS of the decade... Ready? CHRIS JERICHO[/size] Could you name a high profile feud Jericho had come out on top since his loss to Triple H at WMXVIII? Or even a feud he kinda came out on top? By the time he was used as fodder to Cena, Jericho had been in the JTTS limbo for like 4 years already, working as reliable midcard champion or as luxury filler for main events. Then he got fired, came back and jobbed a lil while again, before getting THE push of his life. So, after like 7 years of JTTS, Jericho is (finally) getting what he deserved. It's almost universally accepted Kane DOESN'T want a main event push. Had WWE decided to give him one anyway, it'd take just a couple of weeks to build him back as a legit threat for a World Title. Fans care about some wrestlers, regardless of where they're on the card. Fans don't care about some others, regardless how how hard they are pushed I call BS on that. It's just that Kozlov has taken MVP's spot as heel third man in the Jeff v Triple H storyline.[/quote] Good post. Jericho is also a fantastic example of what I'm saying. So often it was claimed he wasn't pushed harder was because of politics. Apparently HHH was holding him down. Apparently there was always some excuse. However now he is the main man on Raw. Why is this? Not because of a sudden political shift, but because Jericho made himself simply so good, that he simply had to be put at the top of the card, otherwise all the reaction would have been going to him in the mid card anyway. He made it happen because of how good he is. Not politcs. What we see off screen isn't really related to what happens off of it. Not like fans seem to think it does anyway. And Jericho is totally believable in his role also. It's not that he's been 'used so much as a JTTS that fans stopped caring' because as soon as the WWE decide to push someone, they will care. It's why Batista can go from being a deacon to being groomed for greatness in the space of a few months. The minute they decide it's MVP's time for a stint in a higher spot, he will gain credibility without question, because he has the talent to pull it off. Wins and losses aren't decided by politics, and spots are decided by how much reaction someone can generate. If a guy gets so much reaction, and also fits with the direction of the company, they'll use him higher. When someone loses a lot, they aren't losing because of some reason backstage, they are losing because of their spot. You don't therefore have an issue with the fact they are losing, you have an issue with the spot they are in. However MVP's spot is totally reasonable right now, considering Kozlov is doing a great job. When it's MVP's time, someone else will go into his spot and take the losses for the stars, while MVP takes the wins. It's how wrestling has always worked and always will.
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Post by -Lithium- on Oct 20, 2008 17:15:11 GMT -5
I wish he'd go back to his thing earlier this year to where he got a little more serious and didnt do the taunts or talked as much...
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