mo
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
"Here are the young men, the weight on their shoulders..."
Posts: 16,598
|
Post by mo on Dec 15, 2008 15:27:46 GMT -5
The only three officially recognised world championships in the US are the WWE, WHC and TNA WHC. So as much as I'd like to say Matt got to a world title before Jeff, it's not a "real" one. Recognized by who!? PWI is the source many go to when it comes to World Titles and all that stuff, those are the three titles they recognize. And WWE has called the ECW Title a World Title several times even this year. But it's pretty debatable.
|
|
|
Post by Hulkshi Tanahashi on Dec 15, 2008 15:46:05 GMT -5
If the WWE Title can be considered a World Title even though it doesn't have "World Heavyweight" in it, then so can the ECW Title.
|
|
Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
|
Post by Krimzon on Dec 15, 2008 15:51:02 GMT -5
PWI is the source many go to when it comes to World Titles and all that stuff, those are the three titles they recognize. Don't forget the ROH World Championship.
|
|
Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
|
Post by Bub (BLM) on Dec 15, 2008 15:56:36 GMT -5
It was a World Heavyweight Title when Big Show had it. Hell, even when Lashley had it. John Morrison is what turned it into a midcarder title.
|
|
|
Post by Ryback on a Pole! on Dec 15, 2008 15:57:06 GMT -5
I don't understand why a pro wrestling magazine gets to be the one who decides which titles are world titles or not? Surely Vince Mcmahon, the owner of the worlds biggest wrestling fed has more say in what goes than a bunch of magazine editors?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2008 16:01:13 GMT -5
Someone in a magazine saying it is a heavyweight title or not gives it no more credibility than if I say it is or isn't.
I just consider the top title on a show, the one named after the company, to be the heavyweight title.
In fact to nitpick, they are ALL heavyweight titles right now. There's no weight limit, anyone can compete, just like a boxing heavyweight title.
For a title to not be a heavyweight title, wouldn't there have to be some sort of weight restriction?
|
|
|
Post by Nacho STAYS Hyped on Dec 15, 2008 16:03:52 GMT -5
It was a World Heavyweight Title when Big Show had it. Hell, even when Lashley had it. John Morrison is what turned it into a midcarder title. Agreed. When Benoit no-showed Vengeance 07 (AND NO, I AM NOT TRYING TO TURN THIS INTO A BENOIT DISCUSSION!), they couldn't replace him with anyone better than Johnny Nitro? Why couldn't they have booked Kane or something?
|
|
Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
|
Post by Krimzon on Dec 15, 2008 16:07:30 GMT -5
I don't understand why a pro wrestling magazine gets to be the one who decides which titles are world titles or not? Surely Vince Mcmahon, the owner of the worlds biggest wrestling fed has more say in what goes than a bunch of magazine editors? Vince has say in nothing. If the ECW Championship hasn't been defended throughout the world, then it's not a World Title. The same goes for any other belt. If it were defended in places like Germany, Canada, Switzerland, Austria, Japan, and Mexico, then it would be a World Championship on the level of TNA's and ROH's. What sets those apart is that they were defended in other countries against people not in the same promotion. I HIGHLY doubt we'll ever see that from the WWE. That's how I feel a TRUE World Championship should be established.
|
|
|
Post by Robbymac on Dec 15, 2008 16:08:39 GMT -5
PWI is the source many go to when it comes to World Titles and all that stuff, those are the three titles they recognize. Don't forget the ROH World Championship. PWI doesn't recognize the ROH Title as a World Title. Nor should they.
|
|
|
Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 15, 2008 16:11:11 GMT -5
Don't forget the ROH World Championship. PWI doesn't recognize the ROH Title as a World Title. Nor should they. Waitaminute...I thought they did?
|
|
Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
|
Post by Krimzon on Dec 15, 2008 16:11:12 GMT -5
Don't forget the ROH World Championship. PWI doesn't recognize the ROH Title as a World Title. Nor should they. Why should they not? A while back, I could've sworn that they did.
|
|
|
Post by bubbles on Dec 15, 2008 16:15:18 GMT -5
The only three officially recognised world championships in the US are the WWE, WHC and TNA WHC. So as much as I'd like to say Matt got to a world title before Jeff, it's not a "real" one. Recognized by who!? The International President of Pro Wrestling, Headbanger Thrasher.
|
|
|
Post by Nacho STAYS Hyped on Dec 15, 2008 16:17:49 GMT -5
PWI doesn't recognize the ROH Title as a World Title. Nor should they. Why should they not? A while back, I could've sworn that they did. Simple: They're not televised.
|
|
|
Post by Robbymac on Dec 15, 2008 16:21:06 GMT -5
PWI doesn't recognize the ROH Title as a World Title. Nor should they. Why should they not? A while back, I could've sworn that they did. I'm going off wikipedia which may or may not be accurate. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_Wrestling_Illustrated#World_Heavyweight_titlesIMO I don't feel that ROH has near the prestige, notierity, or exposure to justify putting their belt on the same level as the two top belts in WWE or TNA's top belt. I've had this argument before and don't really feel like rehashing it, but I don't think simply defending your title overseas grants you "World Title" recognition.
|
|
Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
|
Post by Krimzon on Dec 15, 2008 16:25:42 GMT -5
Nobody is saying it's on the same level of WWE's belts, but it should still be considered a World Title, ESPECIALLY after Samoa Joe & Takeshi Morishima's respective runs with it. Wikipedia also says on the ROH World Championship page that Joe turned it into the "World" Championship by defending in the U.K. against someone from the U.K.
|
|
|
Post by Robbymac on Dec 15, 2008 16:45:59 GMT -5
Nobody is saying it's on the same level of WWE's belts, but it should still be considered a World Title, ESPECIALLY after Samoa Joe & Takeshi Morishima's respective runs with it. Wikipedia also says on the ROH World Championship page that Joe turned it into the "World" Championship by defending in the U.K. against someone from the U.K. Yes, at that point ROH granted themselves World Title status. However there has to be something independent that distinguishes "World Titles" for the purposes of determining who has reached the top of the business. The closest thing we have to that is PWI. I could start an indy promotion out of the local bar here in Iowa and send my champion over to Ireland to wrestle the town drunk in a pub over there and call it a World Title too. Obviously thats an extreme example, but the point still stands. Just because I call an apple an orange doesn't make it one.
|
|
|
Post by Mayonnaise on Dec 15, 2008 16:57:20 GMT -5
Why should they not? A while back, I could've sworn that they did. I'm going off wikipedia which may or may not be accurate. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_Wrestling_Illustrated#World_Heavyweight_titlesIMO I don't feel that ROH has near the prestige, notierity, or exposure to justify putting their belt on the same level as the two top belts in WWE or TNA's top belt. I've had this argument before and don't really feel like rehashing it, but I don't think simply defending your title overseas grants you "World Title" recognition. How does TNA and their title's one year of existence get WT status over the ROH and ECW titles?
|
|
Crappler El 0 M
Dalek
Never Forgets an Octagon
I'm a good R-Truth.
Posts: 58,479
|
Post by Crappler El 0 M on Dec 15, 2008 17:01:55 GMT -5
One year the the winner of the Royal Rumble was able to choose to challenge for the ECW title if he won. The next year: the ECW Champion competed in the Rumble. WWE seems to have made the decision that that title is not to be treated like a world title, even if it is one in name.
|
|
|
Post by Robbymac on Dec 15, 2008 17:02:08 GMT -5
I'm going off wikipedia which may or may not be accurate. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_Wrestling_Illustrated#World_Heavyweight_titlesIMO I don't feel that ROH has near the prestige, notierity, or exposure to justify putting their belt on the same level as the two top belts in WWE or TNA's top belt. I've had this argument before and don't really feel like rehashing it, but I don't think simply defending your title overseas grants you "World Title" recognition. How does TNA and their title's one year of existence get WT status over the ROH and ECW titles? Actually ECW's title did have recognition when ECW was an independent promotion with its own national television program and ran pay per views from 99-01 TNA gets it because they have a 2 hour national program every week, runs monthly pay per views, and defends it title world wide. It was similar to WCW being granted World Title recogntion immediately after breaking off from the NWA. Basically PWI granted TNA the right several years ago World Title status to whatever belt they promote as their top title.
|
|
|
Post by Mayonnaise on Dec 15, 2008 17:07:10 GMT -5
How does TNA and their title's one year of existence get WT status over the ROH and ECW titles? Actually ECW's title did have recognition when ECW was an independent promotion with its own national television program and ran pay per views from 99-01 TNA gets it because they have a 2 hour national program every week, runs monthly pay per views, and defends it title world wide. It was similar to WCW being granted World Title recogntion immediately after breaking off from the NWA. Basically PWI granted TNA the right several years ago World Title status to whatever belt they promote as their top title. Outside of the two hour show part, the same could be said for the ECW belt of now though. It's all a load to stay in a promotions good graces and have access to them though.
|
|