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Post by Red Impact on Jun 9, 2009 18:57:08 GMT -5
But here's the thing, take any two random guys from UFC, let's say Chuck Liddell and.....Random UFC guy #142, and they're in a fight. Why? Why should I care who wins or loses? Especially if a belt's not on the line? Rankings. I don't know why WWE is always trying to bring down the UFC. I mean, i see why, but UFC is real competition. WWE is not. If i want to see entertainers, storylines, and artificial drama, i'll watch WWE....and i do. I'm guessing the statements were in response to questions about how WWE views MMA as competition, instead of just a random shot.
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Post by jfpierce on Jun 9, 2009 18:58:53 GMT -5
This kind of overlooks the issue that WWE doesn't really have stars right now either. John Cena's not exactly The Rock in terms of public recognition.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,052
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Post by Mecca on Jun 9, 2009 19:18:01 GMT -5
When you get 2 guys that just wanna lay on the mat it makes me wanna nap, I just can't watch guys like that. Do you have a similar aversion to mat-based wrestling matches? Honestly, many MMA casuals hate technical struggles too. If you can't appreciate the technique involved, it's quite boring. I'll be the first one to say if Mir beats Lesnar it'll be bad for the UFC because Mir is not an exciting fighter. And most long time wrestling fans I personally know think MMA is kind of boring.
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Post by Reptar on Jun 9, 2009 19:31:21 GMT -5
JBL said in an interview that the first MMA fighter to truly embrace being a heel would make huge money. Would you happen to have a link to this interview? I'd like to hear JBL's opinion on MMA.
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Post by charlesmc206 on Jun 9, 2009 19:33:57 GMT -5
The WWE taking pot shots at UFC is ridiculous. MMA is a sport, Pro Wrestling is performance art. Two different beasts entirely.
And the UFC has plenty of stars, if not than why has MMA become the most popular combat sport their is?
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Brother Coyote
Samurai Cop
Has Clarity of Vision Is an engine of will
Posts: 2,124
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Post by Brother Coyote on Jun 9, 2009 20:54:59 GMT -5
The hour I spend watching The Ultimate Fighter on spike is INFINITELY more enjoyable than any 2 hours of RAW I've watched in years. I care more about how Jeff Lawson is than Batista, Matt Brown was an intense animal in the cage, Amir Sahdalla may as well be old school Chris Jericho... ARMBAR.
TUF is making these young fighters into characters we will recognize when we see them again, its an amazing, compelling show and I think it could go toe to toe with any hour of product the WWE puts on any week.
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Post by Seth Drakin of Monster Crap on Jun 9, 2009 20:57:19 GMT -5
Here is the thing.....
WWE exploited UFC like they did when other athletes so to say they have no real stars is stupid.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2009 20:58:47 GMT -5
He's gotta point
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Post by Seth Drakin of Monster Crap on Jun 9, 2009 21:00:50 GMT -5
How does the WWE COO have a point?
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Post by Captain & Diet on Jun 9, 2009 21:06:10 GMT -5
I can see the COO's point that stars can be repackaged. The fact is that the UFC's stars only get exposure once every 6 months or so when they fight. The UFC and the sponsors have to do a better job about marketing the stars in between the bouts. The Ultimate fighter TV series has helped make some stars but otherwise I don't think the UFC knows how to make their fighters "bigger." Obviously, the WWE can run vignettes and develop promos for their stars as well as showcase them on 6 hours a week of free TV. WWE is obviously at an advantage because they have years of experience at building stars. Dana White and the Fertittas have only started to really develop stars outside of Couture, Ortiz and Liddell.
There are some things working against the UFC. There aren't large guaranteed UFC contracts for specific dollars. Fighters don't know their purse until after the win. You have to win to make big money. You also have to win A LOT to be a PPV draw and help your income. Compared to WWE standards, the salaries are paltry and a MMA fighter isn't ever going to make unreal money vs. the risk. So it's easier to "lose" stars to attrition.
There are some great UFC fighters though. Check out some MMA websites and see who people are talking about. Check out some of their fights online. I can personally suggest Jon Jones who, IMHO, will be one of the biggest MMA stars EVER. I would also suggest checking out Nate Diaz, who always puts on a great show. Watch those two guys, start finding some more and you will see MMA has great talent, regardless of how the UFC promotes them.
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Lancers
El Dandy
Oh you
Posts: 7,951
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Post by Lancers on Jun 9, 2009 21:31:40 GMT -5
I don't know why there has to be a constant comparison of the WWE and MMA. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Oh sure their both fruits, and sure some people like to eat both, but that doesn't mean their one and the same.
I also use this analogy comparing Lindsay Lohan to Portia de Rossi.
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Post by TRUTH TELLER on Jun 9, 2009 21:36:16 GMT -5
No offense, but he/she whomever's only relevant point is that they can repackage their stars. The “No-stars" thing is asinine beyond comprehension. A lot of their shows (UFC) are based off of real hatred between fighters. Look at Serra vs. Hughes. It was hilariously personal. Then the fight drew huge. Brock Lesnar drew huge. St. Pierre draws huge. There's lot's of guys who draw huge in UFC and are perceived as stars. And I'm not even that big of a UFC fan. I prefer wrestling. But UFC is obliterating WWE on almost every level right now. A person would have to be blind, in denial, or just plain retarded to not see it. All their perceived stars (Cena, HHH, Batista) are drawing dog shit on PPV. The numbers don't lie. No one cares. For example, UFC 98 got something like 9 times the buyrate of Judgment Day. So, ya, UFC's non-stars like Lyoto Machida kicked the piss out of Vince's "stars".
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AriadosMan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Your friendly neighborhood superhero
Posts: 15,620
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Post by AriadosMan on Jun 9, 2009 21:38:12 GMT -5
More fingerpointing and excuse-making to distract the press from the inevitable fall of WWE's unsustainable PPV business model.
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Post by parder on Jun 9, 2009 21:48:24 GMT -5
JBL said in an interview that the first MMA fighter to truly embrace being a heel would make huge money. Would you happen to have a link to this interview? I'd like to hear JBL's opinion on MMA. Here's the link: www.aroundtheoctagon.com/?p=1799
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Post by ghettooverlord on Jun 9, 2009 21:50:52 GMT -5
No offense, but he/she whomever's only relevant point is that they can repackage their stars. The “No-stars" thing is asinine beyond comprehension. A lot of their shows (UFC) are based off of real hatred between fighters. Look at Serra vs. Hughes. It was hilariously personal. Then the fight drew huge. Brock Lesnar drew huge. St. Pierre draws huge. There's lot's of guys who draw huge in UFC and are perceived as stars. And I'm not even that big of a UFC fan. I prefer wrestling. But UFC is obliterating WWE on almost every level right now. A person would have to be blind, in denial, or just plain retarded to not see it. All their perceived stars (Cena, HHH, Batista) are drawing dog s*** on PPV. The numbers don't lie. No one cares. For example, UFC 98 got something like 9 times the buyrate of Judgment Day. So, ya, UFC's non-stars like Lyoto Machida kicked the piss out of Vince's "stars". I think the point is that the UFC is marketed in the same way as the NFL, where the brand is bigger than the fighters involved. If a champ decided he was going to make a stand against Dana White for whatever reason, White currently has the power to say "screw you, I'll find someone to take your spot". I don't think most casual fans will care, come Saturday of the pay-per-view, they just want to see skilled fighters beat the crap out of each other. Whether or not that model is sustainable, I don't know. When one sees a boxer making as much as eight-figures for a single fight, and then an MMA fighter gets 250,000 dollars in the main-event of a ridiculously hot product, something seems wrong to me.
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Post by Azrael from Outerspace on Jun 9, 2009 22:27:15 GMT -5
I agree but just with it being the UFC as i've always found the UFC to be bland and boring. I was a huge PrideFC fan as they had the best fighters and they fought in a ring. I can understand the point with the UFC though. Besides Griffin, Liddel, Rampage and Brock she has a point. And i was a huge MMA fan before UFC, WWE'd, PFC.
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travis
Mike the Goon
Posts: 47
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Post by travis on Jun 9, 2009 23:09:10 GMT -5
I don't know why there has to be a constant comparison of the WWE and MMA. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Oh sure their both fruits, and sure some people like to eat both, but that doesn't mean their one and the same. I also use this analogy comparing Lindsay Lohan to Portia de Rossi. There's always a comparison due to the likes of Meltzer and Alvarez, two pro-MMA shills, being able to brainwash people. The comparisons are for idiot smarks who's lives are focused around being anti-WWE. Their little wrestling companies from past and present couldn't take down WWE so they cling onto MMA due to it's popularity.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2009 23:15:41 GMT -5
No offense, but he/she whomever's only relevant point is that they can repackage their stars. The “No-stars" thing is asinine beyond comprehension. A lot of their shows (UFC) are based off of real hatred between fighters. Look at Serra vs. Hughes. It was hilariously personal. Then the fight drew huge. Brock Lesnar drew huge. St. Pierre draws huge. There's lot's of guys who draw huge in UFC and are perceived as stars. And I'm not even that big of a UFC fan. I prefer wrestling. But UFC is obliterating WWE on almost every level right now. A person would have to be blind, in denial, or just plain retarded to not see it. All their perceived stars (Cena, HHH, Batista) are drawing dog s*** on PPV. The numbers don't lie. No one cares. For example, UFC 98 got something like 9 times the buyrate of Judgment Day. So, ya, UFC's non-stars like Lyoto Machida kicked the piss out of Vince's "stars". I said a Point A Point the repackaging thing is the one point
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Post by YellowJacketY2J on Jun 9, 2009 23:18:23 GMT -5
Maybe she brought up the UFC/MMA topic because everybody else seems to bring it up when talking about WWE's ratings and PPV buyrates.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Jun 9, 2009 23:19:27 GMT -5
If you've watched alot of wrestling MMA is boring, fake fighting is more exciting than real fighting, especially when you get 2 guys that just wanna roll around on the mat. This. I watched a UFC PPV about three years ago, and there was an undercard fight where a guy literally rode around in piggyback position on his opponent for an entire round. The crowd was booing, and I was bored as hell. Wrestling may be "fake", but at least I know I'm not going to see John Cena ride around on Triple H's back for five minutes.
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